Was it in public interest to cover up the terror links to the Southport stabbings?

I don’t have salacious desires Barleyfield. I just happen to believe things weren’t shared in the public domain that could have been shared earlier than they were. As a KC pointed out. It would not have been prejudicial to a trial. If one were needed.

That said after pleading ‘not guilty’ for months (daft in my opinion it was obvious he’d murdered those three little girls) the defendant has now pled ‘guilty’. So the Court can sentence now on Thursday without a trial.

HousePlantQueen

Casdon

The law that protects the individual until the court case is not open to interpretation.

Indeed. Even though some choose to see conspiracies everywhere and just cannot stop allowing their fury that we have a democratically elected Labour cloud everything that Starmer says. I deeply resent the inference that because I believe in the rule of law, in due legal process that I am somehow defending the indefensible.

Quite so, HPQ, though I don’t share your support of the current government nevertheless the rule of law must be upheld. It applies whatever the colour of the government and long may that be so.

That was in response to FGT 16.41.35.

Full disclosure is required before a trial but that is disclosure to the lawyers representing the other party, not to the public. Putting into the public domain information which may be prejudicial to a fair trial is contempt of court and can be punished by imprisonment.

Obviously each party must be separately represented to ensure a fair hearing.

I have already said that lawyers will have differing opinions. Of course they do. They test the law. If it weren’t so, few civil cases would reach court would they, because everyone would be getting the same advice, and the common law would never have evolved.

I don’t understand why anyone would want information prejudicial to a fair trial, and therefore to the delivery of justice, brought into the public domain at an early stage other than to satisfy their own salacious desires.

Casdon

The law that protects the individual until the court case is not open to interpretation.

Indeed. Even though some choose to see conspiracies everywhere and just cannot stop allowing their fury that we have a democratically elected Labour cloud everything that Starmer says. I deeply resent the inference that because I believe in the rule of law, in due legal process that I am somehow defending the indefensible.

The law that protects the individual until the court case is not open to interpretation.

FriedGreenTomatoes2

^Although I can excuse you and others on here who may not be aware of the rules of justice in this country, Farage is, or should be aware of them, and I am afraid he is playing you and all his supporters as yet again^

However HPQ according to a KC this wouldn’t have been the case.

I think these things are said to deflect and stop people probing for answers.

It’s works. Mostly. But not always.
And the heat is now on Starmer.
He has questions to answer.

I even believe the inquiry has been set up NOW to deflect. Questions cannot be asked.

Starmer again at his panicking podium at 8:30am this morning tells us much.

His lawyerly smoothness will be chipped away. I don’t believe half of what he says is true and neither do others and they’re asking awkward questions and turning the heat up.

He doesn’t have good judgement does he - on so many things?

There was nothing ‘panicking’ about his speech this morning.

The law can be interpreted. That’s why there are Counsels for the Prosecution and for the Defence.

As well as the legal aspects, disclosure can be delayed. For several reasons. Some advantageous to one side of an argument.

Thank you for that kind comment woodenspoon. May I compliment you on your very apt choice of username?

I’m not defending the indefensible. Where have you seen me or any other poster defending this man or what he did? I believe in the rule of law. The alternative is mob rule and anarchy.

How can my quoted passage from The Telegraph (which I subscribe to) be ‘copyright infringement’ when other posters offer links to whole articles in The Guardian.

I’m confused.

Also, as a long standing subscriber I have been offered a ‘share this’ on many articles in the Telegraph. Free of charge to whomever I choose. 15 articles per month.

Barleyfields

I don’t think it’s HPQ who needs the tea and tranquillisers.

Well perhaps you do too.
Always the same people on here when these things happen defending the indefensible. Same names on every thread.

Although I can excuse you and others on here who may not be aware of the rules of justice in this country, Farage is, or should be aware of them, and I am afraid he is playing you and all his supporters as yet again

However HPQ according to a KC this wouldn’t have been the case.

I think these things are said to deflect and stop people probing for answers.

It’s works. Mostly. But not always.
And the heat is now on Starmer.
He has questions to answer.

I even believe the inquiry has been set up NOW to deflect. Questions cannot be asked.

Starmer again at his panicking podium at 8:30am this morning tells us much.

His lawyerly smoothness will be chipped away. I don’t believe half of what he says is true and neither do others and they’re asking awkward questions and turning the heat up.

He doesn’t have good judgement does he - on so many things?

I don’t think it’s HPQ who needs the tea and tranquillisers.

HousePlantQueen

woodenspoon

I don’t think the fact he could order a knife from Amazon is really relevant. He could just as easily used a knife that was in his home.
Meanwhile, his family have been given protection by the police and moved to a new home to restart their lives. So that’s all right then. His father is a karate expert who travelled all over the UK to hone his craft. Nevertheless, despite his karate expertise, he was unable to stop his son from murdering these young girls.

Your point is? Are you suggesting that this man's father should have used his martial arts skills to prevent his son going on his murderous spree? I think a few here on GN need to have a little lie down and a cup of tea.

You’d better put your kettle on then HousePlantQueen. And take a few tranquilisers while you’re at it.

It was the gap between the announcement of the arrest and the refusal to release the name that roused suspicions, allowed false information to circulate and sparked the protests.
The father was concerned enough about his son to stop him going by taxi to his old school. You would think that after all the apparent 'interventions' from the various support agencies he would at least have searched his son's room for offensive weapons; apparently a samurai sword type knife was found under his mattress; not exactly cunningly concealed, followings the murders, along with ricin and the terrorist manual.

SillyNanny321

Shame Hanging, Drawing & Quartering are only allowed in books. I have just finished reading one where that was the punishment!

Would anyone in their right mind really want to return to that, no matter what the crime is/was. Hanging, which we had until the early 60s was bad enough. Forms of execution in many countries are still utterly barbaric. I for one thank God we don't live in a society that has capital punishment.

Having said that, of course the crime committed in Southport was utterly appalling. I hope he never comes out.

woodenspoon

I don’t think the fact he could order a knife from Amazon is really relevant. He could just as easily used a knife that was in his home.
Meanwhile, his family have been given protection by the police and moved to a new home to restart their lives. So that’s all right then. His father is a karate expert who travelled all over the UK to hone his craft. Nevertheless, despite his karate expertise, he was unable to stop his son from murdering these young girls.

Your point is? Are you suggesting that this man's father should have used his martial arts skills to prevent his son going on his murderous spree? I think a few here on GN need to have a little lie down and a cup of tea.

Perhaps he did. We may yet find that out.

woodenspoon

I don’t think the fact he could order a knife from Amazon is really relevant. He could just as easily used a knife that was in his home.
Meanwhile, his family have been given protection by the police and moved to a new home to restart their lives. So that’s all right then. His father is a karate expert who travelled all over the UK to hone his craft. Nevertheless, despite his karate expertise, he was unable to stop his son from murdering these young girls.

You seem to be suggesting that his father should have used violence on him. Karate is actually supposed to promote peace.

Applause for Barleyfields

👏👏

CarS

A Pensioner Bernard Fowler was murdered on a platform 4.30 am Harold Wood Station last year. Not on the National News. We are not being told half of it I believe by design

There are so many murders nowadays that few make the national news. Are you seriously suggesting that those which don’t make the national news are being covered up? What utter nonsense.

I don’t think the fact he could order a knife from Amazon is really relevant. He could just as easily used a knife that was in his home.
Meanwhile, his family have been given protection by the police and moved to a new home to restart their lives. So that’s all right then. His father is a karate expert who travelled all over the UK to hone his craft. Nevertheless, despite his karate expertise, he was unable to stop his son from murdering these young girls.

FriedGreenTomatoes2

Oh Wyllow I think you’re being disingenuous now.

Knowing ‘more’ would have helped diffuse a tinderbox reaction. Social media posts (I don’t do FB, Twitter etc) were full of agitated members of the public.

Questions were being asked, such as:
Was he Welsh??
Why not publish his name at least?
So ‘what were the police/government trying to hide’? was the narrative that WAS gaining traction.

Word got out (as it does) neighbours, friends of friends.
“Was he an asylum seeker?
Was he a newly arrived migrant on a rubber boat?

People then put two and two together and made five.

Definitely SOME of this could have been prevented.
It could have and should have been nipped in the bud to stop rampant speculation.

I well remember hearing on the news at the time that he was not an asylum seeker but was born in Cardiff. People are so ignorant about the limitations on what information can be published about the perpetrator, or suspected perpetrator, of a crime.

Nothing would have prevented the reaction we saw. The fact that he didn’t have a white face was enough for some, if not all, of them. What good could rioting, injuring innocent people and damaging or destroying their property, possibly have done? I remember watching the riots and being shocked at the extent to which some rioters were actually enjoying what they were doing.

Thank you HPQ. Was disgusted by Pearsons racist narrative. leading inevitably into the smearing of all migrants with the usual racist memes when as pointed out we had our Dunblanes.

The common sense narrative

"Britain faces a “new and dangerous threat” from extreme violence cultivated online, Sir Keir Starmer warned today in a press conference on the Southport killings.
Axel Rudakubana unexpectedly entered guilty pleas on Monday - admitting to murdering Bebe King, Elsie Dot Stancombe and Alice da Silva on 29 July last year - was followed by a public inquiry into the attacks, announced by the Home Secretary Yvette Cooper.
This morning, the prime minister said the government will review its counter-terrorism system, saying "terrorism has changed" from past threats from highly organised groups to acts of extreme violence by “young men in their bedrooms” accessing material online.

Speaking in the Commons this afternoon, the home secretary said she would tell technology companies to remove “dangerous” material that Rudakubana was able to access online.

She also said it was "a total disgrace" that he was "easily able to order a knife on Amazon" despite the fact he had a previous conviction for violence and was only 17 years old.

The government's Prevent anti-extremism scheme also came under scrutiny after it emerged that Rudakubana had been referred to it three times before carrying out the killings. Cooper said a review is already under way on whether the initiative is fit for purpose."