The Guardian reports that Trump says all Palestinians should move out of Gaza

But David taking land and rights away from Palestinians predates Hamas. We can blame Hamas for what happened recently but Palestinians have long memories. The fighting might stop in order for the people to recover in some way but if the question of Palestinian land and rights is not addressed at sone point the fighting will just start again, and maybe this time it won’t be Hamas but it will be another militia made up of the young men whose families were wiped out in Gaza am sure. In order to stop this Israel needs to give Palestinians their land and their rights back.
And I can’t see that happening.

They don’t have the right to destroy the state of Israel currently Gaza “IS” Hamas remove Hamas stop fighting and we can make progress.

It’s their choice.

And btw before someone suggests it I do not in any way believe that what Hamas did on Oct 7th is anything other than an atrocity. I also believe that the PKK targeting tourists was the same, their usual MO is to attack military targets. All killing is wrong but that doesn’t mean I can’t understand why it happens in sone instances.

But David what about the land and the rights that Palestinians have had taken away from them not to mention the very, very many lives. Are they to just lie down and take it. Human nature throughout history shows that when people have their land and rights taken away from them they fight.
We see this in many places throughout the world. Especially with the Kurds, whose story mirrors the Palestinians to sone degree. A stateless people fighting for their land and their rights against Turkey, Syria, and Iran, thankfully they have an autonomous region in Iraq now. And the Kurds, though allies of the west in sone respects, have resorted to terrorism, though they call it fighting for their freedom. In Turkey the PKK has targeted western tourists with bomb attacks.
It is impossible to expect a people who have had their land and rights taken away from them to just agree to live as second class citizens with no way to reclaim what is rightfully theirs.
Would you settle for that?
Would anyone?

Aveline

The bottom line is that Palestinians have a right to live in Gaza and the West Bank and Israel is just trying to strip them of it. Thus leading to more and more anti Israeli freedom fighters - Hamas is one such group but others will undoubtedly spring up in retribution for how Palestinians have been treated. It's human nature!

Palestinians can live peacefully in Gaza but they have to stop fighting, if Hamas leaves and proper security is restored they can do that.

If they dont Trump will settle it his way, it’s entirely their choice

The bottom line is that Palestinians have a right to live in Gaza and the West Bank and Israel is just trying to strip them of it. Thus leading to more and more anti Israeli freedom fighters - Hamas is one such group but others will undoubtedly spring up in retribution for how Palestinians have been treated. It's human nature!

Smileless comparing Hamas with the IRA is attempting to
wipe away the horrors of Hamas, best ignored .

No one is attempting to wipe away the horrors of Hamas Annie.

Disproved by ? Denial

Many of the things you quote have been totally disproven as pure propaganda and lies.

All those things have been done to Palestinians, babies, children, women, shot, raped, burnt, tortured -by settlers and the IDF, with total impunity.
My point stand. The West Bank is now being cleared to local communities, Bedouins who have nothing to do with Hamas- with total impunity.

Quote Claremont Tue 18-Feb-25 20:48:22
Anniebach
Hamas are Palestinians
The IRA were Irish- did we decide to blow the country and all in it, and take it over, because of the IRA?

The IIRA didn’t rape , hold hostages, take infants from their cribs and hurled their little bodies against walls, burn a mother and her two daughters to death, take her husband hostage, when released made him talk of seeing his family again, not telling him they had murdered them
You are so wrong to compare IRA with Hamas in an attempt to
wipe away the horrors of Hamas

Wyllow3

Returning to the subject of the West Bank, the increasing occupation is not justified by Oct '23. It was happening before and has continued to happen. Should we let the current regime just take it over piecemeal? What will happen to those who live there when there is no space left?

Nobody will address this Wyllow because it shows unequivocally how Israeli aggression is not solely dictated by Oct 7th atrocities, but has been going on for decades.

Gaza has been destroyed and Trump and Netanyahu want to get rid of all the Palestinians left! With no right or return, and nowhere to go.

And in the meantime, the West Bank is slowly being cleared of Palestinians and Bedouins tribes- little by little, violently, with many killed like rabbits.

“What’s happening around Tko’a is what is happening elsewhere,” said Shaul. “New areas being cleansed by settler violence.”

Shaul said that in the 12 months before 7 October 2023 “we saw something like 100 Palestinians displaced” but in the months after the Hamas attack it was 1,400. He added that the acceleration of settler activity in the Tko’a area was being accommodated by the current Israeli political climate.

“Three and a half years ago there were around 240,000 dunums Palestinians could not access because of settler violence,” he said. “Today that figure is close to 800,000. That’s 12% of the West Bank.”

What was important now, Shaul said, was how Israeli settlers who had long behaved with impunity in Area C were now shifting their tactics to new parts of the West Bank with the aim of completely fragmenting the territory intended for a future Palestinian state.

“Now the settlers have become increasingly emboldened, the language being used is about the ‘battle over open space’, avoiding talking about Area B or C,” he said. “Because saying that, in their view, reinforces the Oslo paradigm which they reject.

“It’s now not good enough that Palestinians are contained in Areas A and B. Now the goal is that they must be contained in the built-up areas. The open spaces – they say – are ours. They are trying to put the last nail in the coffin [of a meaningful Palestinian state.]”

Returning to the subject of the West Bank, the increasing occupation is not justified by Oct '23. It was happening before and has continued to happen. Should we let the current regime just take it over piecemeal? What will happen to those who live there when there is no space left?

Anniebach

Hamas are Palestinians

The IRA were Irish- did we decide to blow the country and all in it, and take it over, because of the IRA?

It ‘holds water’ because of October 2023 and you and everyone else knows it Babs03

Aveline

And you're not allowed to point out the Israelis unacceptable behaviour in this matter!!

Why not? You already have done.

Hamas are Palestinians

Aveline

And you're not allowed to point out the Israelis unacceptable behaviour in this matter!!

No. Of course every terrible thing visited upon Palestinians is down to Hamas, which might just hold water if it wasn't for the terrible things visited upon them that predates Hamas.

And you're not allowed to point out the Israelis unacceptable behaviour in this matter!!

It isn’t defensible. None of it is. To take away people’s rights to live in their own homes by forcibly removing them and giving their homes/land to illegal settlers. It used to be that there would be a reaction from western governments about illegal settlers but those days have gone. Basically no one gives a damn.

It does trouble me that while we are discussing Gaza the fate of Palestinians on the West Bank is quietly left as the elephant in the room.

Their land is shrinking day by day and I can honestly not see any other outcome than a bit by bit annexation into Israel under the active support of the current regime. I wish I could see otherwise.

How is it defensible?

Entitled is the word I would use.

Hard to believe the brass necked behaviour of these invading Israelis.

The Israeli army has protected settlers during their incursion into these lands and prevented Palestinians from getting there. An official confiscation decision was recently issued, initially under the pretext of grazing, but it is believed that the reason will be changed to another, such as the conversion of lands into a nature reserve or military zone.

“The settlers deprived us of our grazing and agricultural areas. We used to depend on livestock for our livelihood, but now we only graze them between our homes and many were forced to sell them due to the lack of pastures despite the vast areas they own,” Rustom explained.

The Palestinians believe that these confiscation decisions are merely a prelude to an accelerated annexation process, which Israel seeks to complete this year.
www.middleeasteye.net/news/israel-issues-decision-confiscate-thousand-hectares-west-bank