Ukraine- the situation is VERY serious

How did you make the leap from me disputing your version of events to telling me what my view is?

Casdon

It’s not quite like that though David49. What Putin is doing is very unpopular in Russia itself, he is having to conscript from North Korea to keep his troop numbers high, and Russia is under economic pressure because it’s been isolated. He doesn’t hold as many cards as you imply.

So you would back us fighting directly boots on the ground and accept missile and drone strikes on the UK.

pascal30

David49

Casdon

David49

I would support Ukraine joining NATO but if Russia says if they did no ceasefire, what would you do.

A cease fire with Ukraine secure in NATO is the best outcome, unless Europe decides to go it alone and fight on second best is going to happen.

The most important thing in any deal is for Ukraine to have guaranteed sovereignty.

Yes ,if NATO membership cannot be agreed then a UN monitoring force is going to be needed to prevent disputes breaking out.

But apparently a UN peacekeeping Monitoring Force cannot fight..so what happens if Russia starts attacking again?

UN peacekeepers reserve the rights to return fire if attacked, they are not toothless

It’s not quite like that though David49. What Putin is doing is very unpopular in Russia itself, he is having to conscript from North Korea to keep his troop numbers high, and Russia is under economic pressure because it’s been isolated. He doesn’t hold as many cards as you imply.

David49

Casdon

David49

I would support Ukraine joining NATO but if Russia says if they did no ceasefire, what would you do.

A cease fire with Ukraine secure in NATO is the best outcome, unless Europe decides to go it alone and fight on second best is going to happen.

The most important thing in any deal is for Ukraine to have guaranteed sovereignty.

Yes ,if NATO membership cannot be agreed then a UN monitoring force is going to be needed to prevent disputes breaking out.

But apparently a UN peacekeeping Monitoring Force cannot fight..so what happens if Russia starts attacking again?

Wyllow3

although Putin seems to have a lot of cards, I dont really he can tolerate an endless war. Too many young Russian men dying, he's bringing in north Korean troops

Russian population 150m, Ukraine 40m, in a war of attrition Ukraine looses.

Only if others (us) back Ukraine 100% and accept the cost in lives and economic hardship it’s not going to happen.

Wyllow - and others.
Here's a link to live updates at Munich.

www.theguardian.com/world/live/2025/feb/14/russia-ukraine-war-peace-vladimir-putin-volodymyr-zelenskyy-donald-trump-munich-security-conference-europe-news

although Putin seems to have a lot of cards, I dont really he can tolerate an endless war. Too many young Russian men dying, he's bringing in north Korean troops

Whitewavemark2

😄😄 comment on bluesky

*This is master negotiating. He really has Putin on the ropes. One more unprompted unilateral concession and Putin will surely crack*

I don't understand what this means, anyone?

Zelensky is due to address the whole conference later today. But as he says, "President Volodymyr Zelensky says he can't see a "ready US plan" to end the war in Ukraine, as he arrives at the Munich Security Conference"

Trouble is, all Hesketh has actually said gives us no clue as to "peace talks",

Trump is playing a cat and mouse game depending on moves the we/NATO make

all he has said summarised in news conference this morning

"He stands by his contentious comments in Brussels earlier this week that Ukraine joining Nato is "unlikely" as that any return to the country’s pre-2014 borders.

But Hegseth says the terms of any peace negotiations to end the fighting in Ukraine are up to Trump, not him.

The main message Hegseth has brought here is that European countries need to spend more on defence.

Poland, he says, is a "model ally" as it leads by example. Remember, Warsaw has massively increased defence spending in recent years, with around 5% of its GDP now being spent on the military.
Hegseth says other European countries should take a leaf out of Poland’s book."

Casdon

David49

I would support Ukraine joining NATO but if Russia says if they did no ceasefire, what would you do.

A cease fire with Ukraine secure in NATO is the best outcome, unless Europe decides to go it alone and fight on second best is going to happen.

The most important thing in any deal is for Ukraine to have guaranteed sovereignty.

Yes ,if NATO membership cannot be agreed then a UN monitoring force is going to be needed to prevent disputes breaking out.

David49

I would support Ukraine joining NATO but if Russia says if they did no ceasefire, what would you do.

A cease fire with Ukraine secure in NATO is the best outcome, unless Europe decides to go it alone and fight on second best is going to happen.

The most important thing in any deal is for Ukraine to have guaranteed sovereignty.

So why did people vote for the Brexit disaster?
Because people wanted control of our borders-though of course it didn’t work.

I would support Ukraine joining NATO but if Russia says if they did no ceasefire, what would you do.

A cease fire with Ukraine secure in NATO is the best outcome, unless Europe decides to go it alone and fight on second best is going to happen.

The bluesky comment makes me think of the Canada "deal" WWM

Whitewavemark2

Starmer has reiterated his support of Ukraine joining NATO.

I think it makes sense too..

If the US oppose Ukraine becoming a Nato member then it keeps them out.
Am not sure if it’s a good thing or not but in any case it was unlikely to happen just in four years and by then a different President may have a different point of view.

GG13, you may be right. The timing was a little unnerving.

😄😄 comment on bluesky

This is master negotiating. He really has Putin on the ropes. One more unprompted unilateral concession and Putin will surely crack

Thanks Whitewavemark
I had missed that.

Starmer has reiterated his support of Ukraine joining NATO.

Chocolatelovinggran

I will repeat my post of last year.
My daughter and family live in Scandinavia.
They have been issued with pills to take in the event of radiation in the atmosphere.

I was under the impression that this was in the event of one of the nuclear reactors being compromised?

I will repeat my post of last year.
My daughter and family live in Scandinavia.
They have been issued with pills to take in the event of radiation in the atmosphere.

GrannyGravy13

MaizieD

Europe puts boots on ground, and attacks Russia. This would probably end up with Putin deploying targeted nuclear missiles. Thousands and thousands of dead, thousands sentenced to illness and inevitable death, land unusable for the foreseeable future.

hope this doesn’t happen

I worried greatly about this at the start of the Ukraine war and when Putin was making nuclear threats. I concluded that the MAD theory would take care of that as there would be a strong prospect of US retaliation.

But now?

(Sorry)

I don’t think POTUS Trump would press the button unless the threat was directly aimed at USA.

He has made it clear that it’s down to Europe to protect Europe…

You've made explicit what I was thinking, GG13.

Let’s all hope you’re right GrannyGravy13.

MaizieD

^Europe puts boots on ground, and attacks Russia. This would probably end up with Putin deploying targeted nuclear missiles. Thousands and thousands of dead, thousands sentenced to illness and inevitable death, land unusable for the foreseeable future.^

hope this doesn’t happen

I worried greatly about this at the start of the Ukraine war and when Putin was making nuclear threats. I concluded that the MAD theory would take care of that as there would be a strong prospect of US retaliation.

But now?

(Sorry)

I don’t think POTUS Trump would press the button unless the threat was directly aimed at USA.

He has made it clear that it’s down to Europe to protect Europe…