Keir Starmer announces statutory inquiry into so called grooming gangs/organised child sexual abuse and exploitation

Quick response without yet listening to Maggie on woman’s hour. I heard her interview yesterday when she was concerned about the cost and time involved. She says she knows what the problem is and I’d say she speaks for police snf other agencies. Those concerns led me to accept the no need for yet more inquiries point of view. Hundreds of recommendations already and none implemented
I’ll listen to woman’s hour and read the summary of Casey’s audit that led her change of mind, which Starmer accepted.

I’m sure most of you have heard Maggie Oliver’s comments/ opinions on this, but just in case some haven't and want to this is her take on new enquiry.
She doesn’t sound very hopeful 😥
Her piece is 9.30 mins into the program ( woman’s hour)

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m002dmkk

If you find the BBC online article from the 6th of January this year,
'The 20 child abuse inquiry proposals-what has happened so far'
this will show you the findings, and proposals, and criticisms of delays to implementation. It also will let you click onto related articles.

TerriBull

I think too much emphasis has historically been placed on social cohesion and not rocking the boat. Which is why this issue was left unacknowledged for so long. No one is saying that grooming and paedophilia pertains to only one demographic, it, like prostitution has been with the human race since the beginning of time. Child prostitution was rampant in the Victorian era, when Britain had very few immigrants. There are other factors that have come into play within sections of Pakistani communities where grooming has been prevalent, so lets not obfuscate, arranged cousin marriages a general lack of interaction between the sexes, how women and girls are perceived per se and the idea that western girls are easy and up for it, particularly those who were most vulnerable. Some, I repeat some from different demographics do not share our values.

Exactly this.

petra

The shadow Home Secretary was talking about the child prostitute this morning on Sky.
The comment was in relation to this scum.

Wasn't Chris Philp a Truss supporter and a Minister in her (thankfully brief) Government?

Thank goodness the Torues are not in Government if he is typical of the party.

Child sexual abuse has been happening since time began. The question I return to is why do so many men (-it usually is men) find babies, infants, young children and adolescents sexually attractive
And we need to remember how prevalent victim blaming is. Yes even three year olds accused of being seductive

I think too much emphasis has historically been placed on social cohesion and not rocking the boat. Which is why this issue was left unacknowledged for so long. No one is saying that grooming and paedophilia pertains to only one demographic, it, like prostitution has been with the human race since the beginning of time. Child prostitution was rampant in the Victorian era, when Britain had very few immigrants. There are other factors that have come into play within sections of Pakistani communities where grooming has been prevalent, so lets not obfuscate, arranged cousin marriages a general lack of interaction between the sexes, how women and girls are perceived per se and the idea that western girls are easy and up for it, particularly those who were most vulnerable. Some, I repeat some from different demographics do not share our values.

Abuse and exploitation can occur across all communities and social groups as we are surely now well aware. While certain high-profile cases involving specific groups may receive significant media attention, it's important to recognise that abuse is a serious issue that can happen within any community, including families, peer groups, or other social settings.

It's also come to light in recent years the in established society people can be deemed above criticism for far too long in relation to abuse.

Focusing solely on one group can lead to misconceptions and stereotypes, which can be harmful and hinder efforts to address the root causes of abuse universally. Comprehensive child protection and support systems are essential to prevent abuse and ensure that victims receive the help they need, regardless of background.

Understanding the broader context and promoting awareness that abuse can occur in various forms and settings is crucial for a balanced and effective approach to safeguarding. Just encouraging prejudice is unhelpful to say the least.

Enquiries cost such a lot, I know the pressure to hold one around this subject has been imense, often the outcome is a detailed report on what is already in the public domain with recommendations to be adopted, that all takes a few years. Given that it's all still going on I wonder whether resources would be better spent on trying to wipe it out all together now.

Other sickening aspects, when the abusers come out they are allowed to return to their home turf where their previous victims are living. Also the army of lawyers via Legal Aid who fight deportation cases, where applicable.

TerriBull

I agree Iam, the fact that it's still going on is the most depressing aspect in the whole sordid debacle. How tragic, a 10 year old prostitute, positively Dickensian, who was pulling the strings there? A child cannot prostitute herself, unbelievably shocking and sad

A child can only be used as a prostitute.
It’s just sickening.

The shadow Home Secretary was talking about the child prostitute this morning on Sky.
The comment was in relation to this scum.

I agree Iam, the fact that it's still going on is the most depressing aspect in the whole sordid debacle. How tragic, a 10 year old prostitute, positively Dickensian, who was pulling the strings there? A child cannot prostitute herself, unbelievably shocking and sad

As someone who first learned of organised sexual exploitation of children by men of mainly Muslim Pakistani heritage in 1998, I still feel depressed and angry that it continues. The deliberate targeting, grooming and abusing of vulnerable children is deliberate. The men continue to believe successful prosecution is unlikely because of the ‘obvious ‘ problems with witnesses. Threatening to murder their victims and families is an effective silencing technique.

I read this morning that sw records describe a girl as having prostituted herself from age 10. Presumably, the record will identify the individual who so described a victim.

Wyllow3

Doodledog

The trouble is that for as long as there are people who moan when nothing is done, then moan when something is done and moan about how something should have been done before something was done, it is bound to act as a deterrent to anything actually getting done.

This went on during 14 years of Tory government. Isn't it better to be pleased that there is going to be an enquiry now than to complain that the Tories didn't have one?

I am not in a position to know whether a national enquiry is justified, but as I understand it from News reports it is happening as a result of a preliminary investigation which had the brief of determining whether it should go ahead, and decided that it should. I can't see why that is a bad thing. Times change, more information is made available, and a sensible government will act in accordance with what is known at the time, which may change as time goes by.

Aint that the truth!

This, nanna. Nuff said.

Lots of talking about it maybe time to actually DO something. It is a disgrace, the worst scandal for many years. I’d be ashamed of myself if I was one of the people involved in those Councils or indeed a local politician.

Doodledog

The trouble is that for as long as there are people who moan when nothing is done, then moan when something is done and moan about how something should have been done before something was done, it is bound to act as a deterrent to anything actually getting done.

This went on during 14 years of Tory government. Isn't it better to be pleased that there is going to be an enquiry now than to complain that the Tories didn't have one?

I am not in a position to know whether a national enquiry is justified, but as I understand it from News reports it is happening as a result of a preliminary investigation which had the brief of determining whether it should go ahead, and decided that it should. I can't see why that is a bad thing. Times change, more information is made available, and a sensible government will act in accordance with what is known at the time, which may change as time goes by.

Aint that the truth!

I am in full support of an enquiry - hopefully we will get a better result than the usual "lessons have been learned"

Chocolatelovinggran

I hope that we see some useful outcomes from this.
I do not see it as a party political issue.

Absolutely!

The trouble is that for as long as there are people who moan when nothing is done, then moan when something is done and moan about how something should have been done before something was done, it is bound to act as a deterrent to anything actually getting done.
Well put, Doodledog.
Also the dismissive too little,too late comment that is used genetically to undermine any action.
As for this inquiry, yes it will take time before a report is available but it needs to be done. Everyone involved needs to be held to account .

Allira

Oreo

Galaxy

I wish I had saved the previous thread on this.

It’s in my memory😄
There was every kind of argument going as to why Starmer was right not to have an inquiry and how it wasn’t needed and other defensive guff.

Was it this thread?

www.gransnet.com/forums/chat/1344066-Labour-has-come-under-fire-after-refusing-to-hold-a-public-inquiry-into-historic-sexual-abuse-by-grooming-gangs-in-Oldham?pg=23

Yes it was.Interesting isn’t it?
Am so pleased the inquiry will be going ahead now as I was very disappointed at the time, last year when it appeared to be shelved.

I hope that we see some useful outcomes from this.
I do not see it as a party political issue.

I agree with you Sarnia The justice system has shown us who they are for the past 25 years.
As Maya Angelou said when someone shows you who they are, believe them
Did anyone else see the program where Maggie Oliver was explaining an incident with one of the abused girls?
They were driving along when the girl said thats him
“That’s him” was one of the rapists.
He was also a serving senior police officer who Maggie Oliver had been working with.
This one incident explains loud and clear that nothing, absolutely nothing is going to come of this enquiry 😥

The trouble is that for as long as there are people who moan when nothing is done, then moan when something is done and moan about how something should have been done before something was done, it is bound to act as a deterrent to anything actually getting done.

This went on during 14 years of Tory government. Isn't it better to be pleased that there is going to be an enquiry now than to complain that the Tories didn't have one?

I am not in a position to know whether a national enquiry is justified, but as I understand it from News reports it is happening as a result of a preliminary investigation which had the brief of determining whether it should go ahead, and decided that it should. I can't see why that is a bad thing. Times change, more information is made available, and a sensible government will act in accordance with what is known at the time, which may change as time goes by.

PoliticsNerd

Sarnia

Here we are again. Yet another inquiry into a national disgrace.
We will be told that lessons will be learned, the victims will receive grovelling apologies and apart from the disgusting perpetrators, not one person who enabled these gangs to abuse for over 20 years will be charged with anything.

Although past inaction is frustrating Sarnia, this inquiry could serve as a turning point, helping to identify systemic flaws, hold perpetrators and those who enabled them to account, and restore public trust.

Where, on this planet and where humans govern humans by democratic agreement, do you see a better option? Or do you just like to criticise?

It isn't criticism, more frustration with the process and sympathy for the victims.
Any national inquiry, Hillsborough, Post Office, Infected Blood, Grenfell Tower, to name a few, take so long, often decades long.
I hope those who enabled this for over 20 years will be charged accordingly but on past evidence, very likely not and that, for me, is wrong.

Sarnia

Here we are again. Yet another inquiry into a national disgrace.
We will be told that lessons will be learned, the victims will receive grovelling apologies and apart from the disgusting perpetrators, not one person who enabled these gangs to abuse for over 20 years will be charged with anything.

Although past inaction is frustrating Sarnia, this inquiry could serve as a turning point, helping to identify systemic flaws, hold perpetrators and those who enabled them to account, and restore public trust.

Where, on this planet and where humans govern humans by democratic agreement, do you see a better option? Or do you just like to criticise?