Will Trump really support Ukraine at meeting with Putin?

ronib

The USA and UK have not kept to their promises to protect Ukraine in any meaningful or effective way. foxie48What protection? How effective?

"In total, the UK has committed up to £21.8 billion for Ukraine: £13 billion in military support (including our £2.26 billion ERA Loan contribution) up to £5.3 billion in non-military support (including bilateral assistance and fiscal guarantees)"

"Since Russia’s February 2022 invasion, Congress has passed five major bills aiding Ukraine, which together amount to $175 billion in spending. Most of this is aid going to the government of Ukraine, but a large portion is funding other U.S. government activities associated with the war. Additionally, in December 2024 the U.S. provided a $20 billion loan to be paid back with interest from frozen Russian assets. The total amount of aid committed to the government of Ukraine is $128 billion".

Whereas Russia has invaded Ukraine for the second time, stolen children from their families, bombed critical infrastructure necessary to the lives of civilians, Putin is accused of war crimes and has been responsible for sending a million Russians to their death or sustaining injury, and killing thousands of Ukrainian men, women and children,when they had agreed to giving Ukraine a guarantee of security!

Just seen that European leaders are going with Zelenskii, which make absolute sense, as we are all affected in Europe. It is just Ukraine holding the line.

I think Trump really favours Putin and always has. He seemed to reverse his opinions recently but I think that was to appease European leaders. IMO he will do absolutely anything to get a deal of some kind whatever the terms so that he can brag about how great a deal maker he is and how he ended a war and then pick up his Nobel prize.
Seems he's ignoring the fact that Putin invaded Ukraine so why on earth should they be forced to give up their territories. They could have done this 3 years ago and ended the war then and just be overrun by Putin and his forces but they have fought bravely, endured years of hell without always having the European assistance they merited. What kind of message does that send to Putin and any other aggressor?

The USA and UK have not kept to their promises to protect Ukraine in any meaningful or effective way. foxie48What protection? How effective?

Sadgrandma

Everything about Trump is fishy. He wants a Nobel prize and doesn’t care who or what he sacrifices to get it.

Very early on I suggested to a friend that I thought Trump was after the Peace prize. They thought that was fanciful. Now it seems to be widely accepted as true. I wouldn't trust either Trump or Putin as far as I could throw them! I truly hope the rest of Nato will support Zelensky and Ukraine as ultimately neither Trump nor Putin will do the decent thing. The world is becoming a very dangerous place with them in power! As for what is going on elsewhere in the world, especially Gaza, I despair of there ever being true peace.
We have just celebrated the anniversary of VJ day yet the world seems more dangerous than ever!

ronib

Neither has the United States and the United Kingdom presumably? foxie48 Russia believes that there have been hostile moves towards it. That’s the difference.

Examples please Ronib

Nope, GG13 definitely not, it is an example of Russia not keeping it's promises.

It's not simply about Ukraine. There is a much larger strategic picture.

foxie48

"in 1994, Ukraine agreed to give up the nuclear weapons it inherited from the Soviet Union in exchange for security assurances from Russia, the United States, and the United Kingdom."

Russia would not have invaded Ukraine if it had kept it's weapons and there have been absolutely no hostile moves towards Russia. Russia never keeps it's promises.

Your post seems a resounding yes for a country to have a nuclear deterrent.

Neither has the United States and the United Kingdom presumably? foxie48 Russia believes that there have been hostile moves towards it. That’s the difference.

"in 1994, Ukraine agreed to give up the nuclear weapons it inherited from the Soviet Union in exchange for security assurances from Russia, the United States, and the United Kingdom."

Russia would not have invaded Ukraine if it had kept it's weapons and there have been absolutely no hostile moves towards Russia. Russia never keeps it's promises.

I am most definitely thinking along the lines of the link Not Spaghetti supplied. It’s definitely worth reading. Thanks 🙏

ronib

The EU is most definitely expansionary….

The EU is not an Empire.
It does not gain members by invading other countries!

I don't think the EU is the problem ronib.

Maybe you might like/be interested in this paper?
It seems to be along your thpught lines?

www.defensepriorities.org/explainers/assessing-realist-and-liberal-explanations-for-the-russo-ukrainian-war/

The EU is most definitely expansionary….

Putin feels threatened by the West. This is very dangerous for the West as Putin will seek partnerships with China to build a sense of security which the West has undermined so far. Russia and China together may well cause WW3. wwm2

A Ukrainian lawyer has said the pomp and ceremony given to Putin showed "the legitimisation of a war criminal at the highest level".
Ukrainians are dismayed by the warmth shown to their enemy.

Trump is creating a world where money and power overcomes humanity. Where criminals like Putin and Netanyahu prosper and ordinary people die to achieve their greedy aims.

ronib

wwm2 I can’t remember the full details but there may have been some treaty or agreement to cover Ukraine’s position with NATO and the EU. We’re underestimating the importance of Ukraine as a bulwark to Russia against Western expansion.

That is exactly what we are not doing and why Ukraine must remain a sovereign country to keep Putin back.

The west is not expansionary😄, that is just in Putin’s sick mind.

No there wasn’t a treaty to cover NATO and EU membership after all.

NotSpaghetti

Presumably you mean the man behind Offensive Realism, Ronib?

Yes. The video is informative NotSpaghetti

Presumably you mean the man behind Offensive Realism, Ronib?

wwm2 I can’t remember the full details but there may have been some treaty or agreement to cover Ukraine’s position with NATO and the EU. We’re underestimating the importance of Ukraine as a bulwark to Russia against Western expansion.

Ukraine is a sovereign country.

Since when has it been acceptable for another country to dictate its foreign and domestic policy.

foxie48 some of your comments apply to Starmer’s government at the moment- control of the media and siphoning off money from its citizens for example. It’s not just Russia.

Yes wwm2 we’re beginning to see a consolidation between China and Russia as the new Eastern Bloc against an increasingly weak West.