Give teachers a ‘mark from home’ day, says NEU boss Daniel Kebede

Madmeg that’s true even in primary. Not so much because the subject changes drastically, but because the cohort of children does.

The basic planning and differentiation for one year did not always match the new groups’ needs, which meant devising other strategies that would work for them.

Mojack26 other than still marking exam papers after midnight after a full day of teaching

Grandmabatty, ditto I was on SQA Higher Exam Team and a marker @ Higher, SG and Nats. There is nothing more boring than a whole day of marking!

I was latterly a Uni lecturer. Unfortunately my key subject was one that changes annually so that meant that much of the previous year's lecture and assessment materials had to be re-written annually. I had formal class lectures/tutorials for 21 hours a week and spent at least 30 hours on prep, and another ten or so on marking. On top of that came record-keeping and report-writing, plus meetings. We had annual inspections to fit in and if teaching on external professional courses% (in my case professional Accountancy) there were annual inspections for those as well. In term time (36 weeks for professional courses) I worked about 70 hours a week, and at least half of the "holidays", albeit at times to suit myself. I+ was also a personal tutor for two degree groups meaning termly meetings with each student plus being available for any student with a problem (and lots of them had problems).

Fortunately I loved it all, but my average rate of pay was probably below NMW.

4allweknow

I thought that was one of the reasons the school day was shortened for children already.

The school day hasn't been shortened, lunch used to be an hour break, it's now shorter (cost cutting?)

I knew it’s really called PPA but for years we called it PPE. Planning, Preparation and Everything Else. 😊

PPE time has been seriously eroded over the past 20 years and we now have to work at home, late into the evenings and weekends. Our contracts have been broken over and over.

Teaching is and always has been hard but enjoyable work. Focusing on the learning process. Now it’s endless justification and paperwork.

A day or even half a day at home, preparing and marking means quality, concentrated time, not interrupted by phone calls, questions and unwanted lesson coverage.

Those calling us lazy have no idea about what we go through.

I used to have lots of mark at home days - in the college holidays.

My DD works in a school where the teachers can have their PPA - planning, preparation and assessment time at home. Either a morning or an afternoon. The staff really appreciate it. Teacher recruitment and retention is at an all time low so giving this perk is very attractive.

When you’ve done the job, you know what else there is to do besides standing in front of a class.
Until then the continuing questions about why teachers need time for all the paperwork and planning will go on, mostly from anyone not a teacher or not connected to a teacher.

When Planning, Preparation and Assessment (PPA) time first started, I sat in a Governor meeting listening to educated people arguing that teachers should not be allowed to do their PPA away from school because they weren’t sure we could be trusted to work at home!

No idea about how much time it takes, for marking, assessment and preparation for lessons including the differentiation in provision based on what the marking shows.

Or the person who assured me that I’d be well off with all the overtime I’d been doing, working in the evening or weekend, or during the holidays, or even running my after-school club.

.*loves, not lives!

My primary school teacher daughter leaves home at 6:30am, arriving at school at 7:30am every school day, she has staff meetings every Wednesday evening, when its Parents evening, 2 per term, she’s not home til after 7:00pm. She runs one after school club a week.

She’s lucky this year as she only has 30 children in her class, last two years she had 34.

She lives her job, but it takes its toll and she often struggles with “poor parenting” and appalling behaviour of some pupils. Add into this children with additional needs and the amount of paperwork in all aspects, it’s no wonder no one wants to be a teacher these days!

Bukkie

I have taught for over 30 years, the workload especially the paperwork is ridiculous. All of you who call teachers lazy need a few weeks marking until the early hours and not having a Sunday to relax.

Well said! Add into this all the other hats teachers seem to have to wear, it’s different but equally onerous challenges in Primary and Secondary schools.

😬 I remember be astounded when I realised that other people actually went out after work, during the week, for meals and cinema and stuff.

They have one already, often two.
They’re called Saturday and Sunday

I didn’t appreciate that weekends were supposed to be family/fun /hobby /sporting activity days until I retired from teaching.

I thought that was one of the reasons the school day was shortened for children already.

eddiecat78

I expect I'll be shouted at, but at my grandchildren's senior schools the teachers do very little marking - or lesson preparation! The switch to doing so much online started during COVID and hasn't stopped. Much of the classwork and most of the homework is done via computer. For example maths homework is all completed on the child's computer - they access a particular set of questions and their answers are marked automatically - with no teacher input. Similarly parents' evenings are all "virtual" with parents only allowed a set time before they are "switched off".
This is at two different schools in the southwest which both have good reputations.

I'm definitely not shouting at you but I think you've made a sweeping generalisation. Retired now, but I used to use the maths app you're referring to for homework, and very useful it was too because it gives an opportunity for pupils to have that part of the topic explained again if necessary. But that is only one subject. I don't know about other subjects.

Exercise books have to be marked at least once a fortnight, comments written, and feedback given. The computer work mentioned above is only part of it.

I don't recognise what you say about classwork. The homework results are analysed and then the teacher has to produce a resource to extend the pupil knowledge, or support misunderstandings that have led to them getting a low mark. Likewise when an exam class does a formal exam, the marking load is huge (for best results it needs to be done by next lesson, even if that's the following day) and then there is extensive debrief regarding which topics the whole class needs to address in the following week, and which topics individuals need to sort out. I used to write formatted spreadsheets to identify these. But that's also is hugely time-consuming.

As for parents' evenings, since the mid-70s, it's always been each child's parent only get 5 minutes. Remember there are 30 pupils to a class!

It’s a notional day. Not all hours at once. In schools in other countries. Teachers can leave school when not teaching. Non teachers are employed for other duties and dealing with pastoral/ year issues. It works

Fae1

I was a teacher for many years and loved the teaching/ integrating with pupils side of things. But the admin. was a nightmare. I left the profession when I worked out that for the hours I was putting in, I was earning around £3 an hour !!

Thats terrible...i can't understand d why anyone would choose teaching as a career

I was a teacher for many years and loved the teaching/ integrating with pupils side of things. But the admin. was a nightmare. I left the profession when I worked out that for the hours I was putting in, I was earning around £3 an hour !!

Does it matter with some subjects/topics, eddiecat?

My grandson had this, my daughter was initially angry - but then realised the teacher looked over the results every time and spent time with him on the area he was weaker at.
She gave him more explanations and exercises in that area.

Could it actually be helpful?

I expect I'll be shouted at, but at my grandchildren's senior schools the teachers do very little marking - or lesson preparation! The switch to doing so much online started during COVID and hasn't stopped. Much of the classwork and most of the homework is done via computer. For example maths homework is all completed on the child's computer - they access a particular set of questions and their answers are marked automatically - with no teacher input. Similarly parents' evenings are all "virtual" with parents only allowed a set time before they are "switched off".
This is at two different schools in the southwest which both have good reputations.

Do you think that could work keepingquiet or do you think the teacher actually learns quite a bit about the students by marking their work?

escaped

keepingquiet

Where are you reading this? If you are abroad why should it be an issue- do you have GC in the UK?

I haven't heard a squeek about it here...

Seems news travels even when abroad!! Also in the Times I believe.
www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/teachers-four-day-week-daniel-kebede-b2826711.html
The NEU in my title refers to the National Education Union, in case anyone thought I meant new boss, in German!
It's of interest to me for several reasons.

As an only recently retired memeber of the NEU I knew exactly what you were referring to, I just hadn't come across the report in the media here.

I once worked with a French teacher working in this country who was surprised teachers did their own marking. She said where she had worked in France marking is done by the teacher's assistant, leaving the teacher to focus on planning and progress monitoring, both of which take up a great deal of time.

I don't know if it is still the same.

LOUISA1523

I feel for teachers ....there's a lot to fit in....I'm NHS community ....we all flexi work ( start early or finish late) all the full timers compress their hours , so do a 4 day week or 9 day fortnight. Many of the part timers compress as well....and we all work from home at least one day a week....teaching just doesn't lend itself to any of this I guess

Agree... If you can compress the workload in other professions something surely must be done for Teachers. They educate this country's future citizens, a stressed out overstretched teacher isn't good for children or themselves.