ID cards at long last

Casdon

I think allocating to older people will be a low priority when ID cards come into force, they will be aiming to capture those of working age first I would guess. By the time they are introduced for over 70s, in I’m guessing 7 or 8 years time), the majority of people will be smartphone savvy, as it is a generational issue, I don’t know anybody under 70 who doesn't use a smartphone.

This is true.
It’s working age people that are the main ‘targets’ of this roll out.
It’s a civil liberties concern of course, but I have come around to supporting it now.

Imaginations are going into overdrive on this thread. ID cards systems are in operation all over the world.

Robin202

The darker side of ID cards is all your personal and financial information is stored in one place. How many times has the UK been cyber attacked this year and the financial losses have been huge for JLR, M&S, Co-Op, Harrods, Dior, Collins Aerospace.
Can the Govt guarantee your data and finances are secure and safe? No.

Look also at China and their ID cards, linked to a social credit score. If you have a lower one for whatever reason, make be a parking fine, then some of your day to day activities will be restricted, such as not being allowed to take public transport.
Think this will never happen?
Ive just listened to the World Economic Forum talk about the further development of these cards where your carbon footprint can be tracked. Would that mean limited travel?

Supposing your credit card fails - you want to pay with cash - whoops - no cash as no longer accepted.
This was introduced during Covid, prepping you for no more cash.
As were vaccine passports.

This has been planned for a long time.

Lots of unanswered questions.
Its a creeping authoritarianism via the back door and once here, theres no going back.

This is what would bother me about them. Whilst I can see the benefits are many, the assertion of "why would you worry if you haven't got anything to hide" is not relevant to how they could be used in an authoritarian society scenario. China for example, their overreach in the way they control their citizens spending for example is the stuff of dark dystopian nightmares. Yes I know the counter argument, we all have masses of data on us anyway.

So ….. members of a so far not created task force raid the business premises of someone suspected of illegally employing. The employees will be followed to their homes, where a reporter discovers that the man is upright, hardworking and ostensibly honest, the woman he’s with is the same and all their sweet little children were born over here. The latter fact makes no difference but of course they didn’t know and wouldn’t otherwise have had so many. The reporter makes them all out to be hard done by saints and they get masses of public sympathy. Nothing will actually be done. They won’t be deported. Probably very few will. It might be a good idea on paper but if we can’t manage to oust those who’ve only just landed by boat how can we ever expect to deal with the rest?

The government already has all the data they want from you if you have a smartphone. They're welcome to mine - got up, went to allotment, made plum sauce....
It's less likely if you don't have a smartphone, but even then you can't escape being photographed whenever you step outside your door.
I don't mind them at all. For one thing, it would prevent criminals giving false details if they are apprehended.

The company I used to work for developed an app it only worked on IOS devices it was so very complex to be compatible with android. It will probably be years before there is a working digital I D card.

Cazza1953

Supposedly to stop illegal working. Do we really think employers of these people are going to ask for their ID?

It works in other countries? I imagine that alongside ID cards there will be severe measures for employers. For example,
under French law, employing foreign nationals without the necessary work permits is a serious offence with severe penalties.
Criminal Fines:
Corporate employers can face fines of up to €15,000 per illegally employed worker, or even higher if the offense is committed by an organized group.
The 2024 Immigration Law introduced an administrative fine of up to €20,750 (or 5,000 times the hourly minimum wage) for a first offence per worker.
For repeated offences, this administrative fine can be up to €62,250.
Imprisonment:
Company directors or managers involved can face up to five years in prison, with this sentence increasing to ten years for organised groups.
Other Sanctions:
Closure: Businesses can face temporary or permanent closure of their premises or branches involved in the violations.
Business Bans: Employers may be prohibited from pursuing the line of business that led to the violations or from exercising certain professional activities.
Loss of Public Aid: Convicted employers can be barred from receiving any public aid or financial assistance from the state or local authorities.
Reputational Damage: A public conviction can severely damage a company's reputation and image.

Supposedly to stop illegal working. Do we really think employers of these people are going to ask for their ID?

Galaxy

Politically this will be a disaster.

I bet you the next government wouldn’t scrap it, for all the posturing now.

I don't personally have any objection to them, but they seem to be concentrating on not being able to work unless you have one but the majority of illegal immigrants do not work for people who go by the rules, they "work" under the radar hidden away from public scrutiny so how do they police this? Also you can't drive with our a driving licence but everyday in local court reports there are people driving without them yes they are fined and banned from driving but I don't suppose it makes any difference. I am sure people will find away to copy them illegally. Unless we go really big brother and so that is only accessed via retina or thumbprint recognition.
We will see.

David49

Almost all other countries have a mandatory ID card have it would make it much easier proving who to are for many purposes.
Those that want to travel overseas have to get a passport and a visa, you have to get an official ID to vote. Who you are is more important now than every before only criminals don’t want IDs

I don’t want one, does that make me a criminal? 😳 not everyone who doesn’t want one is a criminal.
I don’t trust any government to keep my info safe.

I don’t think we will need one as retirees.

I would welcome an Identity card. We do not have them in Denmark, which means if I go to countries such as France, Germany or Austria,which have them, I have to have my passport on me at all times.

I have had one passport stolen along with my wallet while shopping in Germany and it is expensive to renew a passport even if you can prove it was stolen.

What we do have, apart from passports, is a National Health card and a social security number. The Health card has no photo, and for years bank cards have not had one either, so no use as proof of identity when picking up parcels from the post or such like, although it does serve as proof of identity when you go to vote!

One card that serves all purposes would be a relief.

And if we must be paranoid, Big Digital Brother is always watching us anyhow. ATMs record who we are when we withdraw money, Internet Banking obviously does so too, the voter's roll has our name, date of birth, social security number and address, driving licence all details, the land registry knows what property we own - do I have to go on?

What difference is an ID card likely to make?

It won’t Greenstuff, as soon as they are introduced they will be available under the radar just as fake passports, driving licences etc are now.

Politically this will be a disaster.

How many will be falsified ?

ID Cards is a Starmer "Dead Cat" tactic to deflect attention away from his major failings. No one on Question Time last night could answer questions about it because it hasn't been announced in Parliament and they knew nothing about it - just like Starmer. I bet you it will be dropped so

vegansrock

At long last a hint towards modernisation with the introduction of digital ID cards. Having lived in countries which had ID cards it was all seen as normal and was useful in many ways - health care, benefits, employment, healthcare, education etc. I guess the tinfoil hat brigade will object but I’m not among them.

Exactly this

The darker side of ID cards is all your personal and financial information is stored in one place. How many times has the UK been cyber attacked this year and the financial losses have been huge for JLR, M&S, Co-Op, Harrods, Dior, Collins Aerospace.
Can the Govt guarantee your data and finances are secure and safe? No.

Look also at China and their ID cards, linked to a social credit score. If you have a lower one for whatever reason, make be a parking fine, then some of your day to day activities will be restricted, such as not being allowed to take public transport.
Think this will never happen?
Ive just listened to the World Economic Forum talk about the further development of these cards where your carbon footprint can be tracked. Would that mean limited travel?

Supposing your credit card fails - you want to pay with cash - whoops - no cash as no longer accepted.
This was introduced during Covid, prepping you for no more cash.
As were vaccine passports.

This has been planned for a long time.

Lots of unanswered questions.
Its a creeping authoritarianism via the back door and once here, theres no going back.

beachcomber76

A card ID surely would do the job. I don't have a smartphone. I don't like them. I don't want one.

I take my [dumb] mobile phone with me when I go out in the car, but not otherwise. Phone calls or texts can wait till I get home.

I have a laptop, been online for 25+years so obviously an internet user. I was doing computer work in the 60's and 70's. I am not part of any 'brigade', just know my preferences, priorities and what I need.

ID's will in no way stop the black market. Card ID's would be far cheaper to set up than digital with all it's very many foreseeable problems.

Do you work?
No? Don't need one then
Yes? Retired - don't need one then

Firstly the Government needs to ensure that there is a system that can cope with the Data. With recent cyber attacks it is concerning to think how easily information can be hacked.

DH and I both have and use them in Portugal.I used mine this morning to go the the Health centre to have a nasty scrape on my leg dressed and DH’s has been extremely useful the last couple of times that he has been taken into hospital by ambulance. The cards we use here have all necessary medical information on them and an up to date list of medications being taken.

The Law for ID cards has just been passed today 3hours ago.

Mamie

FriedGreenTomatoes2

To be honest I don't remember this in the labour manifesto. Then again, I don't remember most of what they have done to date being in their manifesto….

Nevertheless FGT in other threads you have expressed your enthusiastic support for ID cards. Mind you, it was a couple of weeks ago........

I didn’t say I don’t support it.
I just begrudge Blair getting rich on it. Which he will.
“Follow the money”.

I am sorry to say that I have reached the stage where I do not trust anything proposed by Keir Starmer.
I can see the advantages, also the disadvantages, but ultimately I have no faith in his judgement.