Breaking news, midnight - Peace in the Middle East?

Maremia

And what actual control did the Gazans have? Not allowed to have a proper port?

Fishing has always been restricted.

Interesting comment Wwm2 but Hamas was not deterred from building a vast underground network of tunnels and accumulating weapons to attack Israel. Arguably when funds should have been allocated to the people of Gaza.

And what actual control did the Gazans have? Not allowed to have a proper port?

That's the impression I get, from newscasts and posts some of them given by GNs.

ronib

What are you suggesting Wwm2? Are you saying that Israel blocked elections in Gaza since 2007? This makes no sense surely? Israel must have been displeased by the outcome which gave Hamas power?

What I am suggesting is that a governing body in a severely restricted occupied territory is never a governing body in the true sense.

ronib

What are you suggesting Wwm2? Are you saying that Israel blocked elections in Gaza since 2007? This makes no sense surely? Israel must have been displeased by the outcome which gave Hamas power?

Netanyahu was funding Hamas from as long ago as 2012 as he wanted them to be strong. I don't know if Israel blocked elections but it seems at that time they were happy for Hamas to have power in Gaza.

2006 correction.

What are you suggesting Wwm2? Are you saying that Israel blocked elections in Gaza since 2007? This makes no sense surely? Israel must have been displeased by the outcome which gave Hamas power?

A friend said that the Israeli method of election is 'complicated' and that's why Netanyahu is in thrawl to the extremists. Could look it up, but does anyone know offhand?

But don’t forget that the Gaza authorities were a government of an occupied country. The occupier had the ultimate power over them, and for years trade and movement of goods was severe.y restricted by Israel. And once Hamas became the governing body in 2007 a complete blockade was enforced.

Not a good comparison between a country whose freedom was taken for granted and an occupied territory who was severely controlled.

Well shall we just remind ourselves how and when the government of Gaza was elected? Back in 2007? No elections since then. Israel looks to be a paragon of virtue by comparison….

It certainly wasn't a good day for Israel when Netanyahu scraped in to government. Hopefully next year there will be a new government that will be willing to go with the two state solution.
This is one of the sticking points that Netanyahu has confirmed he will not allow that.

He struggled for some time to get a government together last time so given the current situation assume he would not be in contention next time. He’s already been around for over 20 years!

Maremia

They are stuck with him for another year, so I have been told on GN.

2026 I thought so I suppose it could go to the last minute.

I suspect it will very much depend on the peace process and his behaviour along with the far right meanwhile.

They are stuck with him for another year, so I have been told on GN.

I think he was so sure of his 'control' of the situation, it is on record that money had been sent to Hamas in the past, I actually think he just didn't pay attention, or that attention was not paid on his behalf, to the 'distraction' of these reports, with devastating consequence.
It will take some unravelling, as many of the border soldiers were killed in the assault.

AGAA4

Netanyahu was massively bood by the Israelis who were listening to Witkoff's speech yesterday so I think they will be asking those questions too CariadAgain

I think I have already said that my friend who has relatives and friends in Israel, and she was telling me just how split the country is.

The Zionists support Netanyahu but many other Israelis want him and his warmongering gone.

It is not going to be easy.

But I think Israel stands a better chance of peace if their leader is not such a warmonger or supporter of apartheid.

I’m not sure Maaremia. I’ve read the suspicions / conspiracy theories about lack of border protection. I struggle to believe even Netanyahu would encourage the murderous rapists

Deflection or expanding the discussion?

It has to be addressed, and not dismissed as conspiracy theories.

Netanyahu was massively bood by the Israelis who were listening to Witkoff's speech yesterday so I think they will be asking those questions too CariadAgain

This is where someone who remembers how there was warning after warning after warning before the boundary was left unguarded - so that the attack could happen might be able to provide the details of that.

Egypt warned and warned again I gather......so why werent those warnings listened to...why was the boundary left unguarded (for once)?

ronib

I have to ask how dehumanised the families of the dead Israeli hostages feel?

I think I would feel grief, anger maybe hatred and would never get over it but dehumanised no.
People who have their homes destroyed and lose most of their family who are pushed from place to place who are afraid all the time of being killed. Those who have been kept short of food and aid. Those people will feel dehumanised.

Casdon my comment was prompted by AGAA4 saying that a young alive Palestinian woman felt dehumanised because she had lost her home. So I thought immediately of all the young concert goers on October 7th. That’s all.

StripeyGran

I can't understand why we mere amateurs ( I think? mostly?) feel qualified to comment on Hamas this, Hamas that.

It must be an incredibly complex situation which has gone on for years. I would imagine diasaffected young men possibly from refugee camps which have been attacked ,see this as a legitimate way forward.

Surely war and people are much more complicated than good guys and bad guys.

For the record I do not support Hamas or terrorist organisations.

Very true.

I can see how Palestinian young men might well end up getting recruited by Hamas. Not saying I agree - but I can certainly understand why they would. I don't know if there are any other (more peaceful) avenues they could follow to try and get their country back - there may be and I can't see what they are. But, even on an individual basis personally, I can't see what other options they have besides a. fight back b. sit there and let all of Palestine get grabbed and grabbed some more ad infinitum until none of it is left.

It doesn't look from outside as if they have any options whatsoever to try to be a powerful businessperson that can maybe buy "a better life" even if for themselves only or, on the other hand, try and go into politics and influence things that way. Do they have any options besides a. being downtrodden b. literally fighting back. Because I honestly can't see any other options on the table.