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www.thewi.org.uk/media-centre/press-releases
It appears that the WI, along with Guiding, has finally accepted that the law applies to them as well as to the rest of us.
I am not a WI member, so much of what I know is from reading things like the thread on MN where a member's husband was refused membership as he doesn't 'live as a woman'. He took them to court, as they did allow transwomen to be members, so it was his lifestyle, not his sex that precluded his membership. Nobody can define what 'living as a woman' means, lifestyle is not a protected characteristic, and sex is legally based on biology, so it appears that he has won his case - I don't see how he could have lost, really.
Both the WI and Guiding express deep sorrow and regret at their decisions and are clearly 'giving in' grudgingly, but AFAIK neither asked their membership's opinions on things like having boys in tents with girls, or men at meetings supposedly for women, and from which men who don't claim to 'live as women' are excluded - the policies were imposed, not voted in.
I assume it's obvious that I approve of the policy reversals. At one time I would have argued that a very occasional man who had transitioned should be allowed in the WI, (although I would probably not have approved on teenage boys being in the GG), but since the recent forcing of the TRA agenda onto policies of various types my desire to protect women and girls has trumped a wish for everyone to live and let live.
It was apparently discussed on Women's Hour this morning, but I have been out all day, and missed it. Did anyone hear it, please, and if so, was anything discussed that contradicts my take on it all (ie that a women's and girls' groups should be for women and girls)?
Message withdrawn at poster's request.
I am a gender critical feminist.
Message withdrawn at poster's request.
Nanananabatman
This feels very restrictive and like your making assumptions about me. To all the people who said they never saw it impact people who arent trans here you go! I am being called trans when I’ve stated I’m born female and facing aggression about it and being asked to change my behaviour or have my gender questioned, and you can’t say it’s based on appearance because nobody has seen me
Untrue.
There’s nothing to say on here that you have to change behaviour or the way you look or anything else.As a gay woman you have access to all the women’s spaces that you have always had access to.The ruling on women being called women and having safe spaces just for them hasn’t changed for you.
No no name calling at all.
Message withdrawn at poster's request.
Message withdrawn at poster's request.
The terms cis and terfs are used by the trans lobby.
I don’t think that as a gay woman you have anything to fear by using women’s loos or changing rooms or anything else.
Message withdrawn at poster's request.
Message withdrawn at poster's request.
It’s what trans people use isn’t it?
You are welcome here as anything, this isn’t a women’s forum specifically btw and you are just as welcome as gay or trans come to that.
Message withdrawn at poster's request.
Don’t use the term cis women then…use the term woman or natal woman then we are all clear.
Message withdrawn at poster's request.
Message withdrawn at poster's request.
I know the ruling has made life more difficult for the quiet trans woman who has been using the ladies loo with no problems, but the vociferous trans lobby who want to take over all women’s spaces not just loos have caused this! They want to be in women’s prisons and have all the rights of women who were born female.Well now they can’t….and most women are relieved.
Nanananabatman
My ex would not want to enter a space for women, which is why you don’t see trans men joining the wi. Before the change in the law they would not have been legally allowed to and now however they are. And the reason I left my ex was because they were controlling and abusive so yes I would claim that they had negative male traits and did not in any way act feminine and you would never think they were a woman if you saw them or interacted with them. Also I’ve never heard the term TRA before what does it mean? I don’t think I’m using trans men as a tool here, I am just pointing out that the rates are about 50/50 and I don’t see how legally a person who has been on testosterone treatment and identifies as male has more rights to a women’s space than a trans woman?
Don’t you really?
The trans man is actually a woman who wants to live her life as a man, so she really wouldn’t want to join an all womens group.
But, that being said, she is still a woman and could insist on joining the WI or using the womens loos or changing rooms or anything else.A trans women, being actually a man, cannot.
Most women wear trousers and jeans in daily life, it’s more practical.
Trans women seem to prefer dresses and skirts.
Some schools insist on skirts for girls and some schools insist on trousers for girls.
I don’t think women who are gay face any problems in society as a result of the ban on trans women using women’s spaces.
Gay people do not owe trans people anything regarding their rights and protection, that came about with the gay lobby and arguably, time.
Nanananabatman
I don’t see how perpetuating a rhetoric that allows men to ask me to prove my sex based on my appearance in order for me to pee, leaving me feeling anxious to leave the house, is safe, kind or welcoming to all women? I owe trans women for my ability to be openly gay in public and am incredibly proud that they fought for my rights and protection and I will continue to return the favour. I will not have intolerant cis women undermining this progress they made to our human rights.
Only trans people call real women cis women, so are you really trans?We can only have a conversation about this if all posters are honest.
Nanananabatman
I was hoping I could find a safe women’s space here but it feels like everyone has ignored how myself and other cis women have been attacked and isolated as a result of this and this place hasn’t been welcoming either. We will be banned from wearing trousers again if we carry on on this journey and it frightens me. Everyone just wants to shout about how happy they are trans women aren’t allowed to use public women’s restrooms and it’s worrying that they aren’t seeing that we have been fighting to be seen as more than just our bodies this whole time and it’s a step back for our ability to express ourselves safely or for women to be able to safely be freed from traditional gender norms.
But you aren’t trans are you, you say you are gay.Gay women can use women’s loos and spaces as they are women.
No as I have said I hold different views to you, I don't think you are an enemy, I don't know you, I just disagree with you.
I don't think women should be described as ' intolerant cis women' because they want spaces without men. Transwomen are men, this doesn't make me intolerant, it just makes me aware of reality.
Message withdrawn at poster's request.
Message withdrawn at poster's request.
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