The Women's Institute is to revert to being an Institute for Women

I remember reports of convictions assigned by gender , though I don’t remember the source.
The fact is that if a male person committing a crime, is already claiming to be female, what happened to the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth?

Crossposted Lathyrus .

Can you link to where you found your information please LemonJam as when I googled I found this freedom of information request and answer which doesn't seem to match?

www.met.police.uk/foi-ai/metropolitan-police/disclosure-2023/april-2023/recorded-data-relation-transgender-matters/

I realise it's from 2023 but don't imagine anyone has been back through the records correcting sex entries where they have been wrongly recorded.

Things may have changed since the High Court judgement lemonjam but in 2021 Faur Pkay for Women requested information from Police Forces and it was confirmed that a number of Police Forces registered crime in the sex of the perpetrators chosen gender. ie transwomen’s crimes were registered as female.

Even if it doesn’t happen that way now, for a period if time it did happen and so we can’t know the true extent of male violence against women in that period.

We don’t even know exactly what oeriod of time we are looking at as practice varied from force to force.

Lathyrus,- "Yes, men who call themselves transwomen are male and as such are part of the whole male group that carry out violent acts against females. This is the smokescreen *eloethan”, that they are a different biological group.

We don’t know how many trans have committed acts of assault and rape because up till now those crimes have been recorded as committed by women."

That is not the case- we do know. On arrest for committing any such act the perpetrator is then taken to police station into custody. To reassure you- the current police custody forms records all usual personal and alleged offence details and specifically includes sex at birth, country of birth, ethnicity and also preferred gender. All known medications have to be declared- e.g. gender reassignment medication.

Detained Persons (DP) in custody will also be "processed"- e.g. finger prints, photo, DNA, samples, maybe even strip searched if appropriate to arrestable offence. Injuries will be noted, photographed and the DP may also see a e.g. health professional- nurse, doctor for such a serious offence to make sure they are fit to be interviewed.

So if born and man and living a life as a woman that is known on arrival at into police custody and will also become evident when DNA tested. Will remain on record evidently at stage of conviction.

Comparative data exists how many arrests and how many convictions are perpetrated by males born living as a man and males born living as a woman and can be categorised from shop lifting offences to violent and serious crime offences.

There are plenty of mixed sex organisations, so why do the trans want to join the WI? Because joining female only groups and using female only facilities 'validates' them. Otherwise why do transwomen like India Willoughby state they would never use a gender neutral toilet, only the women's one?

Interestingly, the subject hasn’t been brought up on Monday’s meeting, but the committee, of which I’m a member, has been complaint bitterly about the “injustice of excluding trans-women”. I keep my mouth shut until asked for an opinion. I truly feel very, very sorry for these trans people, but I am firmly of the opinion that someone with XY chromosomes is emphatically a man.
We don’t have enough refuges for battered women, there is more and more misogyny and rapes on the streets, press and media. There are plenty of mixed sex organisations, so why do the trans want to join the WI? And why are we women bending over backwards to accommodate such people?
(Get off my hobby horse!)

SarniaI too am a member of the WI. I totally agree that the ‘mealy`’ mouthed apology from NFWI was totally pathetic. I have had a number of emails from people in my WI thanking me for speaking up about my concern of the WI accepting biological men in our Institute without a vote from members.

They keep insisting that transwomen are women when
they are patently not. They say they only received 20 letters of complaint but they avoid saying how many emails they got on the subject, at least 6 from me !

Probably because the apostrophe made it hard to spell.

Sarnia

I had a chat with fellow WI members a few days ago. Our feeling is one of annoyance with National. The statement from them was mealy mouthed and apologetic to trans members, promising to start Sisterhoods for them. The subs from 1st April will be £54 which has caused controversary in itself. Where is the funding coming from to start these Sisterhoods and why call it that because they are not sisters in the true sense of the word.

I, also, am a WI member and the Unofficial WI Facebook group is wholly behind the Trans 'sisters'.
There is much wailing and knashing of teeth at the 'unfairness of it all and how despicably Transwomen have been treated', because "they are women!"

Oh no they're not !

Chocolatelovinggran

Yes, Scouts ( and Cubs) do have girl members, and at sleepovers, and jamborees, in my GC's group, the girls sleep in a separate tent.

No problem. They aren’t boy scouts.
The problem would only arise if a scout / parents decided they were going to lie about their sex.

Yes, Scouts ( and Cubs) do have girl members, and at sleepovers, and jamborees, in my GC's group, the girls sleep in a separate tent.

Trans people, like others have a right to be and pretend to be whatever they want. They have no right to demand that we collude in their pretence.

Yes, men who call themselves transwomen are maleand as such are part of the whole male group that carry out violent acts against females.

This is the smokescreen *eloethan”, that they are a different biological group.

We don’t know how many trans have committed acts of assault and rape because up till now those crimes have been recorded as committed by women.

What we do know is that women have been made to feel unsafe and have had to change what they do to meet the desires of men and that protest has met with persecution.

I find it really hard to understand why other women support the men in their attitudes and actions against women.

I had a chat with fellow WI members a few days ago. Our feeling is one of annoyance with National. The statement from them was mealy mouthed and apologetic to trans members, promising to start Sisterhoods for them. The subs from 1st April will be £54 which has caused controversary in itself. Where is the funding coming from to start these Sisterhoods and why call it that because they are not sisters in the true sense of the word.

Galaxy

Whether people discuss it or not, transwomen are male, if we never mentioned it again, they would remain male.

Yes. There are 2 sexes. Trans males are men who would prefer to be women. All this nonsense gets on my nerves.

Transwomen are men, they are part of the category you are discussing Eloethan. I don't think male police should be allowed in women's spaces if that is any help and if they start a movement to insist they should be I would object to that too.

Eloethan the police force seems to be crammed full of men who been involved in the most awful treatment of women, including rape and murder as the mother of a dedicated police officer who has been violently attacked and injured by an offender can you supply evidence for your your vile allegations? I don't dispute that there are bad apples in the police force as there are in politicians, doctors, priests, CEOs, etc etc Being 'transgender', (whatever that means) or an immigrant does not absolve anyone from being a criminal and those that would dismiss offenders in either category as being unimportant do nobody any service. Do you have statistics for the percentages in each category that are guilty of offences?

It's a smokescreen for what has been called "an epidemic of violence against women and girls". It is outrageous, of course, that women and girls sometimes curtail their behaviour in order to try and keep safe - and that women are often told not to walk alone in the dark, etc., etc. - placing the onus on them to maintain their safety.

But, honestly, do people really think that violent crimes against women and girls are primarily carried out by immigrants and transgender people? For goodness sake, the police force seems to be crammed full of men who been involved in the most awful treatment of women, including rape and murder - and the vast majority of sexual and violent crimes are committed by heterosexual men.

It is so much easier to point the finger at minorities than to actually address more pertinent issues - like the growing number of boys and men who have been getting some very unpleasant messages on line which have led them to to see women as "the enemy" - manipulative and untrustworthy, and requiring to be "put in their place" by whatever means necessary.

I dont think ‘It doesn’t/it’s never happened to me “ is a valid argument for anything really.

I’ve never been burgled, but it doesn’t mean that other people haven’t and would want to prevent it. Or actually that I won’t take steps to avoid that experience, because I believe that it is a real experience.

Doodledog 👏👏👏

It's just like those women who have no objection to intimate examination or care by men, being in mixed sex hospital wards, having men who desire to be women invading single sex spaces thereby rendering them mixed sex etc etc who because they don't mind nobody should. I wonder if they'd even 'allow' lesbians to want to keep a group for themselves a female single sex one? They'd surely have to allow Muslim and orthodox Jewish women single sex care and groups, or risk being labelled Islamophobic or antisemitic, so where's the consistency?

Well said Doodledog.

Totally agree Doodledog

Well put Doodledog

I think you've answered your own question. As you rightly say, 'Some women seem to want women-only things. . .' Isn't that enough reason?

You may not want them, which is fine. I like some mixed 'things' and some single-sex ones, which is also fine. All people are asking the WI for is that it doesn't unilaterally change from being a women's institute to a 'people's' one because those people want to be in a club for women. There are all sorts of reasons why some women may prefer single-sex environments, and they don't ned to run them by you.

If every club, institute, team etc became unisex, those wanting single-sex versions are disenfranchised. As it stands, there are both single-sex and unisex options, so women like you can choose. Nobody is stopping you from attending only unisex 'things', but you seem to be saying that you would stop those who want single-sex versions from exercising their own choice. Is that fair?