Mass shooting by suspected Islamist extremists at Bondi Beach

Very much yes. I hope my grandchildren will cover it in school as well as bits at home but I doubt it?

I spent more than half a day in the Jewish museum in Berlin. It covers the history of Jewish people from the beginning of time to beyond the Holocaust. It’s s brilliant museum, I could have spent more time there but frankly, felt drained. In my mind, it’s parallel is the Washington DC museum dedicated to the history of slavery. Wonderful museums detailing the history and exploitation, humiliation, abuse and murder of people because of who they were

This is one of the reasons we need academics, to calmly record, analyse, evaluate and more, the history we live through and with. Shouty ‘experts’ on GB news etc, who ‘aren’t afraid to speak their mind’ stoke hatred and add little to how we keep children safe

What I took from the film was how utterly senseless hatred of Jews is. Nothing they have done has given cause for their persecution. I believe some people don't even know why they hate Jews as it has been taught from birth.

Education has to be a way forward. I won't see an end to antisemitism but I would like to think there will be an end and that Jews can live in peace without fear.

That is correct, theworriedwell, and has been all along.
"looking to find out why so you know what you are fighting"

Nothing about this is "Reasonable" as in justifiable and nothing I have posted on this thread gives any indication of using it as such.

'

It is one thing to know the causes of violence but the word reason applies to rational thought processes.

So anger at the situation in Gaza may be a cause of revenge against Jews throughout the world, but it can never be a reason because the actions of the Israeli government Israeli are not carried out by or the responsibility of Jews in unconnected countries so any violence towards them is by definition unreasonable unless one is of the mindset that holds all Jews as a race responsible.

I read ‘reason’

Anniebach

Quote Wyllow3 Tue 16-Dec-25 12:42:05
If we do not seek to find out how things have come to be as they are, we are the more helpless to be able to change them. The film above shows how certain traits came to be.

But you spoke of reason Wyllow , have you found any reason ?

Is there a difference between reasons and excuses? Can there be reasons while there is no excuse? I'm not clear but I read Wyllow as not meaning excuses but looking to find out why so you know what you are fighting.

I might be wrong but that's how it seems to me. For example although I was born in England I'm from an Irish Catholic family and also from an Orange family, my parents were a mixed marriage. I knew the reasons for The Troubles but there were no excuses for the awful things that were done. I know the history is shorter but hopefully you see what I'm asking.

Indeed AGAA4. But personally I found the film more concerned with repeating myths and prejudices and trying to explain why these led people to persecute Jews, than any attempt to show that people that their “bias is based on thin air”.

To me a film more about reasons for persecution rather than about unreasonable persecution.

The Holocaust didn’t stop antisemitism regardless of “never again”

Lathyrus3

I have watched and personally I found this film to be something of a vehicle for covertly repeating publicly the myths and prejudices against Jews and to clarify reasons people hold for their persecution.

There are no valid reasons. That's the point. If more people could understand that their bias is based on thin air then there may be a chance to turn things around. It won't happen quickly but if antisemitism could be eradicated or even substantially lessened then surely that's a good thing.

Sadly the world is full of hate and prejudice. Recent events in Gaza have left me in tears.

I have watched and personally I found this film to be something of a vehicle for covertly repeating publicly the myths and prejudices against Jews and to clarify reasons people hold for their persecution.

Perhaps if more people understood that myths and lies over centuries have caused antisemitism they would realise that there is absolutely no reason to hate Jews.
Jews have been used as scapegoats for ills that have befallen people for too long.
There is really no valid reason to be antisemitic as Jews have never done anything to warrant such longstanding hatred.
It's about time we moved on from hurting people for no reason.

Quote Wyllow3 Tue 16-Dec-25 12:42:05
If we do not seek to find out how things have come to be as they are, we are the more helpless to be able to change them. The film above shows how certain traits came to be.

But you spoke of reason Wyllow , have you found any reason ?

I don’t think there’s any misunderstanding Wyllow3 none at all.
We don’t need to delve into ancient history, most here will already know of it and don’t need to be told.
The murders on Bondi Beach were carried out by Muslim extremists just as very many attacks carried out on Jews worldwide are and upon Christians too and those of no faiths.
Jews are particular targets but any Westerners are considered fair game by those who hold twisted views.

The Australian government has said that there is a link between the murderers and the Islamic State.

Thank goodness they found the IED’s in these evil people’s car, or there would have been many more casualties and probably deaths.

I really hope that the surviving murderer is well enough to be charged and left to rot in his cell.

Ah, I think this is where the misunderstanding lies - I am talking about the traits in the persecutors, those who have done evil, not the victims

If you watch the film Iam is is very much not about victim blaming, it is about the vicious treatment and religious persecution visited upon Jewish people for centuries, and is very specific. It is absolutely clear who the victims and who the perpetrators were and how some still are.

It looks at specifics of why they were driven out, why they were not allowed to own property, why the dreadful myths of bleeding children to satisfy some primeval evil grew up.

In other words, although we know about programs and property and the ideology around the accusations of genetic defects, it shows who built the myths and the hatred.

👏👏👏 Iam

Wyllow3

If we do not seek to find out how things have come to be as they are, we are the more helpless to be able to change them. The film above shows how certain traits came to be.

I’m catching up and haven’t time to watch your clip Wyllow. Will do later

Hoover I can’t understand your comment that it shows “how certain traits came to be”. It’s simple, Jews have been subjected to pogroms, to being driven out of places they thought were safe, prevented from certain professions, from owning property - since time began. They’re the only race that a political ideology decided should be wiped out. Israel is surrounded by people who would follow the holocaust, kill Jews and eradicate the state of Isreal

Attempts to understand how certain traits came to be feels like more victim and less perpetrator blaming

Quote Oreo Tue 16-Dec-25 12:33:53
Anniebach
You spoke of reasons yesterday Wyllow
There are no reasons, it’s totally unreasonable and evil to murder anyone because they have a different race or religion to you.
How anyone can find reasons or explanations is beyond me.

Excuse ?

If we do not seek to find out how things have come to be as they are, we are the more helpless to be able to change them. The film above shows how certain traits came to be.

Anniebach

You spoke of reasons yesterday Wyllow

There are no reasons, it’s totally unreasonable and evil to murder anyone because they have a different race or religion to you.
How anyone can find reasons or explanations is beyond me.🤬

A good idea then, not to keep repeating them.

You spoke of reasons yesterday Wyllow