BMJ defends FGM

Maremia

When I said 'repair', probs should have used a different word, did not mean go back to the mutilation. I meant, are doctors now skilled in how to mend the damage caused by childbirth, as well as the FGM?

Slightly off topic but relevant. A young friend had a 12lb baby. She’s small. The size of the baby had somehow not been picked up by scans.
Long labour, baby’s shoulder stuck, I’ll leave the detail there, enough to say both mother and baby faced death. Physical damage to mum extensive. So bad, reconstructive surgery not possible, left to heal naturally,

Maremia, I’m sure medics can repair some, not all vaginal damage. The issue with FGM and poor maternal care is the same, preventative measures needed
(I’m not suggesting you don’t know this Meremia

Good to hear about that research foxie

Grantanow

Typical DM twaddle.

Are you talking to yourself or referring to an article on this thread?

When I said 'repair', probs should have used a different word, did not mean go back to the mutilation. I meant, are doctors now skilled in how to mend the damage caused by childbirth, as well as the FGM?

What a ghastly thought to even have to consider repairs after these cruel mutilations. Poor, poor girls

Typical DM twaddle.

www.nhs.uk/conditions/female-genital-mutilation-fgm/national-fgm-support-clinics/

There are support clinics and women can undergo de-infibulation but ATM the NHS does not attempt to resensitise the clitorus as it is not deemed to an effective procedure but there is further research being done.

Maremia

petra, your post shows that mutilation can be 'picked up' in maternity situations.
The question is, how do the medics deal with a women, previously harmed, but who now needs a repair?

The women can have a repair but the NHS is failing them 😥

www.theguardian.com/global-development/2023/dec/21/how-the-nhs-is-failing-fgm-survivors

petra, your post shows that mutilation can be 'picked up' in maternity situations.
The question is, how do the medics deal with a women, previously harmed, but who now needs a repair?

As I understand it - banning it hasnt stopped it totally. I can well believe that those awful parents who want to do it still find "under the counter" ways of doing so. There are always ways to do what one wants "under the counter" unofficially and a whole network of people is available to help with doing whatever-the-banned-thing-is if one cares to find them. Often they even offer. I've been offered drugs and having my electric meter swopped to one that doesn't work for instance - and I wasn't even asking for that (and refused it).

Look at recreational drugs for instance - I've never taken them in my life....but I know where I could go and ask and get put in touch and could be sorted by the end of the day. That - when there's no obvious visual signal that I might like to be offered some. So I'm sure it happens that women from that culture get spotted by others from the same one - and they offer their "friends" the chance to have it done one way or another if their daughters are in that sort of agegroup.

There is hope.

solidaarisuus.fi/en/fatumo-awil-duale-carries-forward-the-message-against-female-genital-mutilation/

fancythat

Maremia

A way forward?
Some African countries have managed to ban FGM. Who were the advocates for this, in those states?
Could we 'borrow' some of those champions, to work with the communities at risk in the UK?

Would you not say it is banned in the Uk as well?

There was a court case some years ago.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-30886077#:~:text='Encouragement',Mohamed's%20%22insistence%20or%20encouragement%22.&text=Kate%20Bex%2C%20prosecuting%2C%20told%20jurors,necessary%22%2C%20Ms%20Bex%20said.

I may have misundestood you Fancythat but it's been banned in the UK since 2003 and it's banned in 24 countries in Africa.

It is banned in the UK.
But, as some report, it is still covertly practiced.
So, next step. Reduce and eliminate completely.
How to do that?
Import experts who have already achieved this?
Worth a try?

Maremia

A way forward?
Some African countries have managed to ban FGM. Who were the advocates for this, in those states?
Could we 'borrow' some of those champions, to work with the communities at risk in the UK?

Would you not say it is banned in the Uk as well?

Maremia

A way forward?
Some African countries have managed to ban FGM. Who were the advocates for this, in those states?
Could we 'borrow' some of those champions, to work with the communities at risk in the UK?

That being people from their own race to talk with them? That does sound logical to me Maremia. They would be that bit more likely to listen to them than to us. Someone saying "I thought our cultural practice was okay too - but now I've learnt better/much better - so it's got to be stopped" rather than one of us going from the outside "The pain/the problems/the discrimination against women".

A way forward?
Some African countries have managed to ban FGM. Who were the advocates for this, in those states?
Could we 'borrow' some of those champions, to work with the communities at risk in the UK?

Galaxy no doubt there's disagreement amongst the professionals who contributed to this essay. That is stated in the essay. It's the way the essay has been used that's my beef. Media have cherry picked bits of it and reported those " bits" without the context which IMO is absolutely central to the purpose of the essay. Most of the comments on this thread have related to the opening post which is actually completely false and that's how many who read reports like this in the media will react!

I agree with your conclusion foxie.

I think the article is a form of progressive racism, so I am sure there is quite a bit of disagreement to be honest, and there is understandable distrust from those feminists who have watched this kind of manipulation of language before.
We are able to think without bring manipulated by the media, in fact I would say writers such as Janice Turner were one of the few voices who have demonstrated they were able to demonstrate critical thinking while most other people were nodding along with mantras.

The title of the thread says the BMJ defends fmg, it does nothing of the sort. The OP reports that the article says banning FMG is cultural suppression, the article doesn't say that. No one has suggested that FMG should be decriminalised neither does the article. I think this thread is the perfect example of how the media incorrectly reports things in a way that distorts the truth and is purposely trying to create division in society.
Its an essay which compiles a range of different opinions about how professionals might improve the effectiveness of their communication with members of communities that might take their children abroad for illegal practices. Tbh I think every contributor to this thread would agree that what happens now is not entirely successful and would want to stop these practices so there's really no disagreement.

I think it was a start but I didnt introduce it. As I think is clear if it was up to me I would be much clearer from a values perspective.
I think some of that article was drifting towards that kind of progressive racism which sometimes rears it head.

Apologies the reporting did come in 2015, the 2003 was making it a criminal act. But we're still looking at 10 years of mandatory reporting, is it working?

Sorry phone has gremlins too.

I would also say janice Turner ( obviously speaking from a feminist petspective rather than a survivir persoective) article in the Times is
very good.