Former Prince Andrew has just been arrested in Norfolk

The police are still gathering evidence. If Andrew is charged it will be for the public office offence.
As others have said there may be no actual evidence from the Epstein side of things but his association with Epstein doesn't show him in a good light.
He is a reprehensible character and I hope he is brought down for the disgusting way he has lived his life.

What I don’t understand is why the Royal family didn’t conduct more damage limitation but instead outsourced the problem to Republic, an anti monarchy group asking for £4 monthly membership subscriptions. Republic was always going to act against Andrew as part of its long term ambition to abolish the monarchy.

LemonJam

Tuliptree- I highly doubt the full nature of the public office misconduct currently subject to investigation will be made public so as not to undermine AMW right to a fair trial and due process.

It is entirely open to the police and CPS to determine whether to solely focus on his business envoy role or his royal role and expectations of his behaviour in that role in addition. I have said nothing about "sec side"

I understand all that - I’d thought the ‘sex’ side was being teferrrd to by Monica as the weaker side. The police and CPS especially are bound to ( one hopes) for charging purposes bring charges that will hopefully hold up. The as and whilst distinction is crucial with the latter been much trickier.

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Anniebach

I agree with David and Oreo

Agree what.

Tuliptree- I highly doubt the full nature of the public office misconduct currently subject to investigation will be made public so as not to undermine AMW right to a fair trial and due process.

It is entirely open to the police and CPS to determine whether to solely focus on his business envoy role or his royal role and expectations of his behaviour in that role in addition. I have said nothing about "sec side"

David - the investigations into the whole disgusting trafficking etc is still ongoing. Or did you hope it was finished and you could rest happy in believing that VG and other women/girls were just money grubbing liars? I suppose I can imagine some people wanting to believe in that version of the world .

I agree with David and Oreo

To those posters talking about other members of the RF- potentially all can be brought under scrutiny by the police CPS as the Misconduct in Public Office offence is defined as when someone in public office

"wilfully neglects to perform his or her duty" or "wilfully misconducts" to amount to an abuse of the public's trust in the office holder, without reasonable excuse or justification". It's a notoriously difficult offence to prove without solid ( documentary evidence is strong when verified) evidence plus because of the "wilful" element.

AMW being arrested and charged with this particular offence arguably poses the biggest challenge to the British modern monarchy to date. Queen Elizabeth intentionally influenced the monarchy to become more "family" orientated to deliver an air of openensss and transparency- that began with The BBC programme/documentary about the RF - showing the whole family around the BBQ for example. Her children were brought into the modern public domain as personalities. Yet now most urgently they will be trying to establish "separation" from AMW- caught in the middle with some members of the public wondering what they knew or didn't know about his behaviours.

As a result of being in the middle and seeking to protect the monarchy- it will need to reflect, adapt and change to hold onto sufficient public good will to survive. I would wager this will lead to considering all things that can demonstrate greater transparency and accountability - reading of wills being one example- most likely driven by William. The sooner the better so the public perception is that the RF is seeking to do so rather than pressured to do so.

Oreo - are you another one who doesn’t know what hearsay means?

Lemonjam -I’d assumed that the issues involved in this arrest are purely related to the emails which were confidential and he received as a trade envoy. The other ‘sec’’ side is a different investigation I can’t imagine they’d try and roll them up. Also there’s a difference between allegedly sending confidential information that you have received AS a trade envoy and allegedly been involved in trafficking WHILST a trade envoy. The latter is very unlikely to be misconduct in public office

Tuliptree

David - you can’t libel the dead ( maybe you don’t know that as you don’t know what hearsay means), But you’re coming close to libelling her family. Your posts are becoming unacceptable

Absolutely.

Tuliptree

David - you can’t libel the dead ( maybe you don’t know that as you don’t know what hearsay means), But you’re coming close to libelling her family. Your posts are becoming unacceptable

No they’re not, don’t be silly.
Courts deal in facts and things have to be proven.

Fallingstar

This of course doesn’t just extend to royalty but to wealthy and powerful/famous people as well, many whose names have been revealed in the Epstein files. There seems to be a a shift away from the rules and laws that ordinary people have to abide by, an immoral and tacit understanding that they can get away with whatever they do wrong because they have the money and the connections to make the bad stuff disappear.
I honestly think they get to a point where they don’t even see ordinary people as being the same as them, they must believe they are superior beings and thereby able to treat such people with the contempt they deserve.
At least criminals at the bottom of the pile can argue that they were doing what they did to survive. Imho those at the top are much much worse.

This!

I feel so sorry for Beatrice and Eugénie in all this. No matter what Andrew has done, they have to deal with the fallout from it

According to the press this morning, they are going to investigate them both, to assess just how much they knew about what was going on and how much they benefited from these 'connections'. I hope it is true as they definitely need to.
Likewise, the other royals, the palace protection and police.

If the authorities can access the bank accounts of benefits claimants to see how much they have and where it is from etc, I hope a case is push forward to ensure royal and accounts are open for scrutiny and their Wills made public, just like all our Wills are. So much easier to see where the money is coming from to finance the lavish lifestyle of the royals.
As is often said 'follow the money'.

Tuliptree

David - you can’t libel the dead ( maybe you don’t know that as you don’t know what hearsay means), But you’re coming close to libelling her family. Your posts are becoming unacceptable

What evidence is there that would have lead to a conviction?

Allsorts

Sarah introduced Andrew to Epstein, the whole family had a fabulous lifestyle on his money.. The girls were young women not little children. It will all come to light. The Royal family let him get away with too much all of his life. Most women participating knew enough and were old enough to know what they were getting into, not so the young victims. Andrew should name those top people involved but obviously there's a reason he won't . Perhaps the arrest will alter his stance on that.
Andrew has been arrested and released and the law will unearth any dodgy deals.

Do you know as an ordinary citizen this is totally beyond me really.
I expect many of us may have been married for some time. We accept the good and the bad, the nice holidays when they come along and the days spent cleaning the fridge or whatever.

We aren't sex addicts, we don't hurt people, we don't fly our daughters to the home of a vile man.
We give back, volunteer, help a neighbour and so on.

As I said, it's beyond me the whole sorry business.

David - you can’t libel the dead ( maybe you don’t know that as you don’t know what hearsay means), But you’re coming close to libelling her family. Your posts are becoming unacceptable

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The court system in the USA is very different from the one in England.

AMW looked absolutely shell shocked, dishevelled and traumatised in the car photo as he left police custody last night. His day started early with the utter shock of unexpected arrest. Although the police have a duty of care to him and must treat him with respect, dignity and care, detainment is process that most likely landed on Andrew as a stark realisation his royal entitlement and protection had been utterly stripped away and had no currency whatsoever in his current circumstances. He would have arrived home to hear/read his brother's statement "the law must take its course". There finally is nowhere to hide.

AMW most likely would have been advised by his legal representative that misconduct in public office can carry a maximum life sentence. The offence is defined as when someone in public office "wilfully neglects to perform his or her duty" or "wilfully misconducts" to amount to an abuse of the public's trust in the office holder, without reasonable excuse or justification". It's a notoriously difficult offence to prove without solid ( documentary evidence is strong when verified) evidence plus because of the "wilful" element.

This offence has been used for prison officers for example. Eg officers that have taken bribes, brought in prohibited drugs etc into prison for inmates or had sexual relationships with a prisoner in custody. They were convicted because their misconduct was proved to be "wilful" (even if stupid, they thought they were in love or whatever) AND the misconduct undermined the public's trust in their role as a prison officer AND there was no reasonable excuse or justification for their misconduct as their job description and induction training clearly set out such behaviour amounts to gross misconduct. Fairly straight forward.

I agree with MOnica- the case for sharing commercially sensitive information with Epstein and/or others is the stronger case evidentially. In theory, in his public role as a Prince (previously), a case might be made that his conduct in his personal dealings with Epstein e.g related to alleged inappropriate relationships, plus potentially abusing his public office e.g. asking his personal officers to "find dirt" on VG etc. However like Monica in a charge already notoriously difficult to prove, I agree this is the weaker side of the CPS case.

As the offence is so difficult to prove, under the public office ( accountability) there is a bill reviewing this offence which is currently before the House of Commons (Starmer/LP openly said their aim was to strengthen public accountability). The offence will be replaced with 2 new offences, more easy to prove, thereby strengthening accountability of those in public office. Watch the timeline as if and when AMW's case gets to court current law will be applied.

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Maremia

A female abuse victim's witness statement is being dismissed as 'hearsay'?
I thought we had evolved from that.

Difficult to go down that line now I would have thought, given that there is a criminal serving a life sentence because she was part of the gang of sex traffickers and paedophiles.

There appears to be evidence surfacing that suggests children far younger than very early teens were abused, raped and hurt.

Maremia

A female abuse victim's witness statement is being dismissed as 'hearsay'?
I thought we had evolved from that.

Horrific.

Maxwell and Epstein were enabled in their abuse of young lives because of this kind of thinking.

No longer.

Maxwell swore in court that she didn’t introduce Epstein to
the former prince yet she was a long time friend of his.

Coincidence! We’re expected to believe this.

Normal for Norfolk?