Should we be more open to a wealth tax?

Why do you assume people don’t care MaizieD ?

You really are preaching to the wrong congregation on here 🤦‍♀️

Until a government of the U.K. has the cajunas to rip up the fiscal rules, invest in our old and outdated infrastructure, which in turn will provide more jobs (skilled and unskilled) this conversation just goes round in circles.

Sort out the benefits system back to the original purpose as a safety net not a way of life for some families across multiple generations.

Unlike you I am not angry at wealth or those that have it.

A fair few of them are self made, Dyson, Branson and the Sir Sugar’s of this world.

GrannyGravy13

MaizieD you know, I know and most people on this thread know.

This same old, same old conversation…

It’s not really a conversation, GG13, it’s an encounter with a brick wall.

The UK has broken public services, 20% of its population living in poverty while a further significant proportion of it lives on a financial cliff edge. There is minimal activity in the economy, you yourself were talking of how you cannot expand, the hospitality industry is dying, high unemployment, etc. etc.

It should be blatantly obvious where the money which the state issues into the economy finishes up, yet the only reaction is shrugs and complete acceptance of gross inequality, defence of it, indeed, as if it were a god given law which cannot be altered in any way. As if the way that our economy is run is the acme of perfection which any attempt to tamper with would cause utter disaster.

Why don’t people care?

MaizieD you know, I know and most people on this thread know.

This same old, same old conversation…

Aveline

MaizieD buying and selling more and more expensive items -houses, art, jewellery, holiday resorts etc etc. Money making money

So, are you seeing the money as being contained in an endless self contained loop, being passed around among the same group of people?

Would people be able to join this group? If they could, how would they achieve it?

GrannyGravy13

MaizieD the poorest in society spend their money in the local economy.

Those with excess money at the end of the week/month/year save and invest.

Saving and investing is something which consecutive governments, over many years have actively encouraged.

The billionaires, some are altruistic and support foundations, research facilities and charities.

The bottom line in my opinion is that the majority of people want to hang on to as much of their money/earnings as they can in order to provide a good life for them and their loved ones.

Wealth isn’t a crime, sort out the current tax loopholes first, then look at taxation overall.

Where does the money that the ‘poorest’ have spent in the local economy then go? Who gets it next and where do they spend it?

MaizieD the poorest in society spend their money in the local economy.

Those with excess money at the end of the week/month/year save and invest.

Saving and investing is something which consecutive governments, over many years have actively encouraged.

The billionaires, some are altruistic and support foundations, research facilities and charities.

The bottom line in my opinion is that the majority of people want to hang on to as much of their money/earnings as they can in order to provide a good life for them and their loved ones.

Wealth isn’t a crime, sort out the current tax loopholes first, then look at taxation overall.

vintageclassics

I rather think it depends on what qualifies as wealth. I have a 400 year old cottage I bought 40 years ago 2.5 beds large garden and worth probably over £450k, nice area friendly neighbours etc - does that make me wealthy? I really don't want to downsize to a 2 bed on some commuter estate. In terms of available cash yes I have some savings (much of which I do pay tax on) and a pension which is also taxed - I'm comfortable but wouldn't describe myself as wealthy. Why on earth don't we charge companies that operate and profit from trading in the UK pay Corporation tax on those profits? HSBC, Amazon, Facebook, Daily Mail, and any other foreign owned biz?

You sound similar to me. ‘Comfortable’, yes, but not wealthy.

DH has a bad knee. If it gets so he needs a knee replacement, and he would have to go on a long waiting list, we would pay to have it done privately.

That’s the sort of thing I want to have money for, although I think it’s not fair on those who have saved and been careful with their cash.

MaizieD buying and selling more and more expensive items -houses, art, jewellery, holiday resorts etc etc. Money making money

GrannyGravy13

MaizieD

If you keep the poor poor, where are rich people going to get their money from?

Any ideas, anyone?

I imagine the poorest demographic in the U.K. are getting their money via the Government in Universal Credit in it’s entirety or as a top up on their low wages.

Along with working in the grey economy.

The very rich will make money producing goods, renting properties, playing the stock market, buying and selling works of art etc.

I wouldn’t worry about them personally.

And where does the money they get from the government go?

What do people in work spend their money on?

Who benefits from the spending of both categories?

Aveline

From other rich people of course

How does that work, Aveline?

Putin is the best person to answer to that question! We all probably have a reasonably good idea why.....

How come there is such colossal financial inequality in Russia?

I'm a champagne socialist. I want everyone to have champagne, not just the fortunate few.
If that means that we have to downgrade to cava for all to be able enjoy, that's fine by me.
I believe, also, in courtesy to all, so I don't feel the need to describe people as dumb because they don't have the same worldview as me .

David49

Barbadosbelle

Plevey08

As Winston Churchill wisely said -

"You don't make the poor richer by making the rich poorer"

I just cannot understand why many are so dumb as to not understand that simple fact.

Because so many so called socialists are no more than Champagne Communists expecting the state to do everything

Rather a strange and sweeping statement.

As is calling people " dumb"

MaizieD

If you keep the poor poor, where are rich people going to get their money from?

Any ideas, anyone?

I imagine the poorest demographic in the U.K. are getting their money via the Government in Universal Credit in it’s entirety or as a top up on their low wages.

Along with working in the grey economy.

The very rich will make money producing goods, renting properties, playing the stock market, buying and selling works of art etc.

I wouldn’t worry about them personally.

From other rich people of course

If you keep the poor poor, where are rich people going to get their money from?

Any ideas, anyone?

Barbadosbelle

Plevey08

As Winston Churchill wisely said -

"You don't make the poor richer by making the rich poorer"

I just cannot understand why many are so dumb as to not understand that simple fact.

Because so many so called socialists are no more than Champagne Communists expecting the state to do everything

Barbadosbelle

Plevey08

As Winston Churchill wisely said -

"You don't make the poor richer by making the rich poorer"

I just cannot understand why many are so dumb as to not understand that simple fact.

Barbadosbelle
This looks like a quote that Churchill never said. It also makes no sense in the context of a wealth tax. We can argue if a wealth tax would be fair/wise/useful or not, but taking money from the rich and giving it to the poor literally makes the rich poorer and the poor richer.

The proposed wealth tax would target those with immense wealth. It's not aimed at ordinary people who have built up savings over decades or whose London house has gone up in value and now is worth a million. The middle class has been targeted enough over the last decades. It's always them whose taxes go up because the poor simply can't pay more and the rich have enough political power to prevent taxes on them. The wealth of the rich keeps growing, they keep buying up houses and other assets. This needs to change, otherwise the middle class will end up in poverty and the poor end up dead.

Elon Musk has just become the world's first trillionaire. He's got more money than the poorest half of the whole planet. It is insane. Don't tell me that he deserves it because he's worked harder than 4 billion people combined. The billionaires fund politicial parties, making sure that any law implemented is in their favour. They fund the media, so that ordinary people get bombarded with messages that blame powerless groups like benefits claimants or immigrants for everything that has gone wrong; instead of pointing the finger upwards. There's a rightful outrage about how much the government spends on asylum hotels. But who benefits from them? Not the asylum seeker who wants their claim to be dealt with quickly, instead of being stuck in a room with rationed loo paper for years. Not British people who pay for the subpar accommodation. It's the owners of the hotels who just happen to be rich chums of the political elite, raking in hundreds of millions in profit. If we keep believing their lies and vote for politicians who represent the interest of the rich few instead of 99% of the population, things keep getting worse. We must work together to stop the accumulation of wealth and growing inequality.

GrannyGravy13

Totally depends on the definition of wealth.

Absolutely! BUT define wealth:

A friend has inherited her mother's Berkshire home - a small ex-council home that she and her mother struggled to buy in the 80s. It is however, now worth £350K. The proceeds would actually help her to return to her home town, but she will have to sell it to pay IHT

I have worked and saved hard all of my life, paid enough into pensions and savings to ensure we are afloat in retirement. Paid off our home, which as "London" moves North our home has increased in value. I have lovely friends who made different choices and now have pension credits and their rent paid and they think I am wealthy

Moii and eazybee,a significant portion of of the " welfare budget" is, of course, the State Pension.
Are you recommending cutting it, and if so, by how much?

ordinarygirl

I'm open but my question is why are people encouraged to earn more money and buy bigger houses if it only to be taxed more?

...and don't forget people from more modest backgrounds, like myself, who just want to earn as much as they can so they can get on and raise a family without expecting the State to do everything for them.

Plevey08

As Winston Churchill wisely said -

"You don't make the poor richer by making the rich poorer"

I just cannot understand why many are so dumb as to not understand that simple fact.

MOnica

An absolutely brilliant and intelligent comment.
.