Principality of Piddington

I see they have started a trend. Barnham another small village are discussing holding a symbolic referendum on leaving the UK.

I wonder whether the residents of Piddington, who are now no longer UK citizens, have applied for work visas and/or asylum?

Maybe accommodation could be offered at the MOD base util their right to remain claims have come through?

I agree with those who say that all areas should do their share, not just Northern large towns and cities who already have social issues. I also understand people being uneasy about having a sudden influx (of anyone) near their home towns. As I've said, we have a lot of new estates near us, and the 'incomers' are predominantly white, middle class southerners, but they have changed the nature of the town, as there are so many of them in a small town.

I am hoping a certain nice little village in Yorkshire gets their share.
My retired boss, Labour voter used to say’ isn’t it everyone’s world’ whilst wringing their hands.
Another one ‘just not in my yard’ 🙄

Graphite

Not one person has commented on my post from earlier today, that Cherwell in Oxfordshire, the subject of the Piddington protest, until now, has taken so few asylum seekers.

According to Right Move, the average house price in Piddington (Cherwell) over the last year was £577,000.

Proportionately, second only to Glasgow, Hyndburn in Lancashire takes the highest number of asylum seekers.

Average house price in Accrington (Hyndburn) last year was £154,000.

No prizes for guessing which area accommodates most asylum seekers per 10,000 of population.

Hyndburn accommodates 50 people per 10,000 of population with a total of 426. Cherwell accommodates just 6 per 10,000 with a total of 106.

You can see this pattern throughout the UK. The only outliers are where asylum seekers are accommodated in military barracks in middle-class areas, Wethersfield average house price £440,000 and Crowborough £470,000 and now the proposed MOD Bicester site.

• If asylum seekers are accommodated in hotels, people protest.

• If asylum seekers are accommodated in family houses or HMOs, people protest.

• If asylum seekers are accommodated in military barracks in middle class areas, people protest.

We can’t just stop people coming as they have a right to claim asylum and there is no legal way to do so from outside the UK.

Even Reform’s new Head of Policy has admitted that it would take a full five year term of government to find a resolution - not the internationally illegal Operation Fortress the party announced a few weeks ago.

There are 15 asylum claims for every 10,000 of UK population compared to 18 claims for every 10,000 of population across the EU so the UK does not receive proportionately more claims.

Is it possible on this forum to have a sensible discussion about the best policy for accommodating asylum seekers fairly across the UK until such time as their claims are settled?

Yes I believe Lancashire has the highest proportion of HMOS.

Cossy, so its ok for 1200 to go somewhere a as long as is not by you!

Hmm. It isn't helpful as the government are damned if they do and damned if they don't Maremia.
They are then attacked for not managing problems quickly enough. But mostly their time and tax payers money, are being spent on having to contain, rapid escalation of hostilities towards AS.

Fear or ignorance or racism or closed minds?
Could be any or none of these reasons, Plevey.

I admire your patience/fortitude Cossy, in having to relentlessly repeat that AS are not here illegally.
Is it fear or ignorance that enables this blind mantra? I really would like to know as it stunts and cuts off any possibility of discussion.

Allsorts

Talking here about about people here Illegally, practically all young men, we don't know who they are no one does. Feel sorry for Piddibgton residents, instead of stopping the lot coming they are under threat. Those that want them house them, if you only have room for one that's ok. Then report back in a month.

They are not here illegally. Doesn’t matter how many times you repeat that, it doesn’t make it true.

Many people did take in AS during the Ukraine project.

The majority were women with children, as many many men were prohibited from leaving and conscripted into the armed forces, where, we, the UK, supplied some weapons and actual training.

This isn’t possible in many other countries.

A great scheme, which couldn’t be replicated due to the many different nationalities arriving, however the cost of bringing them here and the housing was as below, this excludes any military costs.

AI

“ The UK government had provided over £2.1 billion in central funding for the Homes for Ukraine scheme by late 2023, with subsequent multi-million pound extensions continuing through 2026.”

Housing one “male” stranger in our spare bedrooms is infinitely more dangerous than having 1,200 housed together in military barracks.

I support the Labour Party, I wouldn’t want any of their minister or even Andy Burnham living in our spare room.

Thanks for making a deliberately goady suggestion, helps the situation such a lot.

Lancashire has long been somewhere that migrants settled because of the particular industries there. I think you have to be careful of conflating those people with automatic right of abode (British passport holders), those with Indefinite Leave to Remain - and asylum seekers needing supported housing which is what the Piddington protest is about.

The national average for the number of asylum seekers in supported housing is 13 per 10,000 of population which is low.

For context, my local theatre has a capacity of 500 seats. It could sell out every day for 20 days and only 13 people in the audience over that 20 days would be asylum seekers.

All I am arguing is that counties should take an equal share of people who need supported housing for now (because they are not allowed to work to earn a living) whether it’s in hotels, houses HMOs or barracks … and Oxfordshire is not doing its share. Nor are many other parts of the country. The Excel spreadsheet (link on page 28 of this) will show you what the numbers are for your area.

researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN01403/SN01403.pdf

Plevey08

It does sum it up Meandrogrog. Thanks for that.

I agree.

Yes they have...but the look and feel of these towns now with the amount of immigrants and AS has changed too quickly.

The feel of these towns is now so different. But I'm not complaining because it's not allowed. I'll just use my vote .

And people used to wonder[will they still] why people want or vote for certain people.

To be fair about the towns mentioned, they have had legal immigrants for a long time. 50 years? Have they not?

Yes Graphite....the unfairness of the placing of AS is astounding.
I live in the next town to Accrington.
Look at the % in neighbouring towns. Blackburn Burnley Nelson all have similar figures.
They all have large immigrant populations too.
The feel of these towns is now so different. But I'm not complaining because it's not allowed. I'll just use my vote .
People in Oxfordshire take your share please.

It does sum it up Meandrogrog. Thanks for that.

Talking here about about people here Illegally, practically all young men, we don't know who they are no one does. Feel sorry for Piddibgton residents, instead of stopping the lot coming they are under threat. Those that want them house them, if you only have room for one that's ok. Then report back in a month.

I know it can be hard to grasp but it is possoble to hold more two or more ideas in the brain concurrently.

Interesting comment on facebook today. Apparently one of the residents of Piddington is CEO of a charity called asylum welcome but is completely opposed to sending the men to the detention centre near the village. Also the local branch of the Stand Up To Racism has changed its slogan from ‘Refugees Welcome’ to ‘Refugees Welcome but no to the Bicester Asylum Camp’.

There is more but the article sums up that virtue signalling is easy until you are forced to put your money where your mouth is.

My point re the above stats on percentage of housing etc is... communities really do have to accept that more housing is needed in all areas.

Public perception; The BP overestimate how much of the country is covered in concrete. They guess, on average, that 47 percent of land is built on.
Actual residential buildings is between 1-1.4 percent of total land area.
Total built-on- area including all urban infrastructure ie commercial buildings, factories, roads etc is between 5-6percent.
The sheer cost of supported housing, in wealthier areas, with smaller groups of AS, could be offset by the astronomical cost of policing threatening/unpredictable protests.
Supervised work in large barracks would be an excellent way to occupy AS and they will have the opportunity to feel productive.
I do think MOD Bicester, being a self-contained facility, should be used.
I do understand the unease of those living in Piddington. However fears are always greater before change rather than after.

Sorry Graphite, your posts are so detailed and useful, but I've just been dotting in and out.

Catching up after a busy day. I’m joining others who thanked Graphite for her posts. I’m north west and know Accrington and Hydeburn as a result of work about 14 years ago. I live in what was a successful cotton , mining, engineering, manufacturing town which like so many northern towns struggling with unemployment, poor health in its deprived areas. Because rents are less than in the south east we have many asylum seekers. Local Facebook groups reflect a level of anxiety and worry about pressure on services and schools.

I hope the government can include places like Piddington. I recognise housing costs to be an issue, I’d welcome Graphite’s suggestion that its area is ripe for housing developments with associated infrastructure. Dare i add - especially if it reduced the applications to build on our few remaining fields here

Thank you all for replying.

The problem with renting to provide supported housing would be the sheer cost in more expensive parts of the country - which is why AS are dispersed predominantly to the NW and NE where housing is less expensive.

One of the oft heard criticism is of young men with nothing to do hanging around “menacingly” although that’s subjective and highly exaggerated imo. The leader of the county council here claims AS are being “menacing” when all they are doing is gathering waiting for the mini-bus to take them back to camp.

One answer to that would be to provide work. This had come up before. Prisoners work. These men are not prisoners but I don’t see why supervised work for those in barracks couldn’t be organised.

I really hope that the government doesn’t back down over this. Oxfordshire needs to take its fair share of asylum seekers. MOD Bicester is meant primarily to be a self-contained facility.

I’m hearing from people who know the area, saying that older residents weren’t happy either when MOD Bicester had a larger military presence there.

From a Cherwell District Council document 2007. The Defence Storage and Distribution Agency (DSDA) employs around 2600 personnel at MOD Bicester Garrison of whom 1100 are military staff and 1500 civilians.

That ties with what the the women who has now been doxed, said in her interview with Victoria Derbyshire. She said, most people in Piddington would be concerned about 1200 men from anywhere being based on the edge of our village, scale being the main concern. That sounds very much like a nod back to past tensions with the military.

It’s hypothetical but I would be interested to know whether the villagers would be happy with say a development of social housing, which we desperately need in this country. The site to be developed is 10 hectares, within the northern part of a 50 hectare wider site. That’s 25 out of 125 acres. A housing developer would squeeze 375 houses onto 25 acres, potential accommodating 1,500 with many more to come if the other 100 acres were developed.

That’s what has happened in many parts of the country where former villages have become large housing estates or even towns.

I’ve been looking a little at the history of lost villages. There was Imber on Wiltshire where 150 people were evicted to provide an exercise area fortroops preparing for D Day and has been abandoned ever since. Similarly Tyneham, near Lulworth in Dorset is a ghost village abandoned in 1943when the MoD commandeered it for military training.

Piddington has a total adult population of 268. Around 60% are over retirement age. It can’t be an easy place to live with no shop, no post office, no cafe, no pub, no doctors surgery, no paths or cycleways, the nearest bus stop a couple of km alway outside HMP Bullingdon offering an infrequent service. What do you do when you want a pint of milk or a loaf of bread or a daily paper? I wonder just how many people struggle with day-to-day living and would rather be living in Bicester, Thame, Aylesbury or Oxford?

If I were being radical I’d say the whole area is ripe for housing development with associated infrastructure. I wonder which the villagers would prefer if that were a choice?

Whilst it could/should be fairer to accommodate asylum seekers across the UK, Graphite, until their claims are settled. Realistically I don't think it is doable, despite there being proportionately less claims in the UK than in Europe per 10,000.
I think AS are generally safer in larger towns/cities. And larger communities can generally assimilate AS, without feeling as threatened by perceived personal safety concerns, which have gained momentum.
I think for smaller communities it would be less threatening if the AS intake was proportionate to their size and population.
I would like to see smaller groups, even in towns and cities to be accommodated over a broader area of the UK.
I can't think of a solution that would satisfy /appease all.
But I do think different ideas and solutions should be considered.

Thank you for your posts, Graphite, I think it’s entirely possible to have a sensible discussion about housing AS, until such time as their claim is processed.

But I’m afraid for some, their only view is “they shouldn’t be here” and no solution will suit them.