Another reason to not have a death penalty

FriedGreenTomatoes2 - you are right that your contributions are often out of synch with the general consensus. I suspect this is because many of us on here have experience of the results of disadvantaged or frankly horrific backgrounds, either personally or professionally, and understand that people are often victims of their circumstances. This does not mean we do not wholeheartedly condemn serious crimes nor place a high priority on public protection, but we realise that there but for the grace of god .......

Many people on Gransnet share a desire to see a fairer society and stand back from simplistic judgements - but all of us, both me and you, come to this from our personal experience.

On the side subject of religion that has been raised on this thread - the statement Christianity isn't terrifying is one I cannot get behind and would cite the Crusades, Northern Ireland, catholic guilt and the misery this has caused generations of people, retrograde hierarchies, evangelism and swamping other cultures with beliefs, the covering up of sexual abuse - I could go on.... Every religion is capable of being terrifying because it deals in fundamentals and is drawn towards fundamentalism. I am fully aware of the apparently benign brand of Christianity practised by my many friends, but that is not the whole story sadly.

Christianity isn't terrifying Luckygirl and the apparently benign brand of Christianity practised by (your) many friends isn't a ^brand of Christianity it is Christianity.

Every religion has 'followers' capable of being terrifying and willing to commit acts of atrocity.

I hear you Smileless2012 - every religion where atrocities or insidious evils are perpetrated in the name of that religion will say that this is not the true religion and their version is the right one! They all do it!

My take is that if we all just adhered to the principle of kindness then we would be on safer ground and do not need a potentially corruptible religion to be able to do this.

"FriedGreenTomatoes2 - you are right that your contributions are often out of synch with the general consensus".

I would say she is out of synch with posters on here, but I think the general population would agree with her.
I am sick of people saying that because you have a terrible life, and Christa Pike did you do not know right from wrong. The murder of Coleen Slemmer was brutal and premeditated.
I have mental heath, I take medication and I worked with disadvantaged people who have had terrible lives, they don't go out and do what she did.
Coleens Mother May has lives with the murder of her daughter everyday, she wanted the death penalty carried out.
After 30 plus years my own view was she should not have been executed, and she should have been listened to about her health condition. If the sentance was going to be carried out it should have been done years ago.
As someone who suffers from mental health I find it patronising that people make excuses for wrong doing.

With the general consensus on GN anyway. A niche (small) group of viewpoints. I’m just happy to contribute. Oh and btw you really assume too much about my childhood as a five year old little girl. My parents were lovely is all I will say on a public forum.

Do you have stats on how the general public feels about the death penalty in the UK, rafichagran, to back up your claim?

Google?

Too many wrongful convictions since DNA used to identify suspects. Can't bring back those wrongly found guilty. Will never know how many.

It was about 50/60 last time I looked but I think it rises to more in support for specific crimes.

I don't think anyone has suggested that Christa should not be punished but many believe that the death penalty is wrong, whatever the crime. There's no evidence that the death penalty has prevented people committing terrible crimes, there's some evidence that juries are less willing to convict people when there is a possibility of a death sentence and we have seen people convicted of murder who have been found to be innocent. IMO it is also dehumanising for those who carry out the sentence. Lots of reasons for not having a death sentence and nothing IMO to commend it.

FriedGreenTomatoes2

Yet Rudakabana is in his cell playing FIFA 27 ….

I think what you are saying is that the death penalty should be applied to certain people. If so, I agree totally but not sure I'd actually be able to administer the means of death unless it was one of my loved ones.

What has happened to Christa Pike is awful, not least because of the 30 year wait. It would be the kindest thing to let her go now, using an instant, painless, and trauma-free means.

foxie48

I don't think anyone has suggested that Christa should not be punished but many believe that the death penalty is wrong, whatever the crime. There's no evidence that the death penalty has prevented people committing terrible crimes, there's some evidence that juries are less willing to convict people when there is a possibility of a death sentence and we have seen people convicted of murder who have been found to be innocent. IMO it is also dehumanising for those who carry out the sentence. Lots of reasons for not having a death sentence and nothing IMO to commend it.

I think that sums it up perfectly.

Whitewavemark2

Dignitas use the same method as vets. Morphine is not the lethal drug of choice because of its unpredictability.

Dignitas use the same drug as UK vets ,Pentobarbital of Sodium.

The method of application is different .

Vets use a preliminary sedative followed by the lethal injection.

Dignitas use no preliminary sedative; and several different different methods of ingestion ( (via mouth, existing tube, IV drip etc) all actioned by the patient themselves.

dignitas.ch/en/documentation/how-dignitas-works/

I didn't make the claim, Fried.

Some States in the USA use the death penalty. I wonder if that has reduced offending in those States?

I feel the same as Luckygirl and Syracuse.

Although I have no idea how she actually tortured the young teenager before killing her I am glad someone has brought up about the lady on death row having bipolar which can be a terrible condition. Although for some, it does not affect their daily lives..
A chap who lived near me had two sons with the condition, one was worse than the other. The father used to tell me the cruel words one son would say to him and how he sometimes became difficult to control, although this son adored his father so much he just lost control and committed suicide not long after his father died.

Research has shown that using the death penalty in the USA DOES NOT reduce offending.

Research also shows that States who do not use the death penalty have lower rates of offending.

Is the death penalty a deterent?
Doesn't seem like it.

Plunger

Too many wrongful convictions since DNA used to identify suspects. Can't bring back those wrongly found guilty. Will never know how many.

I don't understand your point.
Are you saying that more people have been wrongly convicted since the use of DNA techniques were used to solve crimes?
Of course, DNA profiling is not 100% accurate but the chances of a wrongful conviction using DNA is very rare indeed.

This touchy feely liberal wishy washy concern doesn’t ‘rehabilitate’ we are fooling ourselves
FGT that’s not a kind thing to say
I rarely agree with your posts although I don’t believe we ve ever been rude to each other, personally, but I do think it’s a very poor way to get your point across by dissing people with warmer views that yours

The death penalty seems to operate in the US without trial. The US police killed 270 people (approx seven every two days) within the period 1 January-19 March 2026. I would guess that not every case was a kill or be killed situation as not all the deceased were carrying guns or other weapons and those that were carrying weapons were not necessarily threatening with them.

I suppose it depends on whether or not you regard the death penalty as a deterrent or the ultimate punishment for the ultimate crime of murder.

If it doesn't reduce crime, then it is not a deterrent.

I am totally against the death penalty and feel for the parents of the murdered girl.
This has got me thinking would I rather be the mother of the murdered or the mother of the murderer? The thought of either reduces me tears.

Data suggests that the death penalty has no deterrent effect on crime statistics.
Interestingly, I understand that until recently, there has been a consensus that a referendum on the return of the death penalty would cause it to be returned, but that the most recent polls suggest there would not be a majority in favour, now.
I wonder what has changed.