Regrets about being estranged from people..

Jem**You are just that... a gem. You saw a wrong in the family , you made the call and righted it. How many in laws would do that and realize the pettiness of it all.to you for being the grown up.
I agree with many of you but in my case we have reached out to my stepson and his wife with voicemails, emails and texts. They don't answer and to me that is worse than telling us to take a flying leap. We don't know what we did. How cowardly to run and hide instead of having a conversation. I cannot make anyone talk if they don't want to. We are going on two years of estrangement. We have called to ask to see the grandsons but we get nothing. How could they rip those children from us when we saw the oldest one each week for three years? The little one was only born two years ago.
The longer this goes on the less likely I want to make amends. I would always be walking on eggshells and living in fear of another estrangement. I only care about the GC not their parents as the children are innocent.

Wilmer, why do you think he would never have got in touch?

I would never underestimate the power of making the first move.

Donkeys years ago my Dad and I fell out. He said something that crossed the line for me and I got up and walked out of his house. The look on his face was utter shock.

Our family is very opinionated and my Step-Mum avoided conflict like the plague and would not give him a good argument - which frustrated him big time. So when I visited, he would try to press my buttons so he could get his opinion out there. Most of the time we just had a healthy argument discussion. This time though he went too far.

We had no contact for 3 months, which was a major thing for the family. My two brothers told my Dad he was out of order and he should apologise, but he was far too stubborn. I hated that we were not speaking, but I was not going to be the one to apologise. I told a close friend about it and she told me about a similar situation when she'd fallen out with her sister. Basically she got back in touch with her sister and never mentioned the fall out, they simply moved forward without ever mentioning it again.

So, as it happened, my brother and his wife just had their first baby and my DH and I were planning on driving down to see my new nephew at the weekend. I rang my Dad and my Step-Mum answered the phone. She told my Dad I wanted to speak to him and I could hear in the background just how surprised he was that I was calling. I asked him if they wanted to come in our car to see the new baby and he did, so it was arranged. That was the end of the matter. We carried on as if nothing had ever happened.

A while later my Step-Mum told me my Dad was really shocked that I made the first move. He had no intention of ever being the one to do that and it made him think hard about it. Years later and after he died, it occurred to me that by making the first move, but not actually apologising, I actually got one over on him - and I think he had worked that out too.

Maybe this will give some people food for thought if their estrangement is over a row. Be the bigger person and make the first move - without necessarily apologising. Of course, it's a different story if the other person causes problems on an ongoing basis.

Well done Pollengran. That is a really positive outcome for Gransnet. Hope your sister can respond lovingly.

Jemimavintage, your posts are very thought provoking and I have decided to get in touch with my sister because of some of the things you have posted. I might be making a big mistake (again), but it is time to reach out. It might take a while to pluck up the courage, but maybe our frequent fallings out wasn't all her fault.
The update may take some time, but thanks for making me think deeply about it.

We fell out with my SIL over something that started very small and escalated to the point where we had no contact for 10 years! In the end it was DD's wedding that prompted me to be the grown up and write to her saying we should let things go and try and make amends. She responded very positively so we arranged to meet up and things have been fine since. Sometimes it just takes someone to make the first step for things to be resolved.

disagree with that Jemimavintage, 'whims' dont even come into it! rifts happen in life more so in families, some can forgive and forget others wont. It only takes one toxic person to destroy the relationship.

Completely agree.
When my DH was a child he had no family on his moms side or his dad's side as MIL had cut everyone of them off, both sides!
In her mind, it was everyone around her who had the problem. He had no grandparents growing up, aunts or uncles. It was only after the birth DD that his Auntie from his dad's side got intouch and arranged to meet up.

If MIL hadn't allianted everyone around her when DH was young then things would of been so different for him. Abit like now really.

To be clear, imo no-one should be estranged from anyone, simply because of the whims of one individual who calls others toxic and seeks to create rifts, but is intact, very 'toxic' themselves..

Jem

The fall-out from that is massive - multiple family members have to suffer simply because of the attitude of one nasty person.

Completely agree.

Deewbw - I've just come on to say a similar thing.. My husband had a rift for years from his mother, caused by his ex-wife. His mother is in her late 80's. As a result, there was also a rift with his brother, and his brother had actually tried to do something very bad to my husbands business (wind it up through the courts), out of spite... so all quite horrible really.

One day I was thinking to myself: this is all so bloody petty, and all because the ex-wife wants to cause mayhem for good and decent people, out of pure spite. Life IS too short for rifts.

I wrote to my husbands mother asking her to meet with us on his birthday. She said yes. We've since had years of a good strong relationship, no problems. We've been on holiday together, dinners out etc. If I hadn't have made that move, and written to her.....she would have been in her late 80's going into 90's with no relationship with her son. No-one deserves that. Reading about this term 'flying monkey' - that's a very very negative spin to put on the behaviour of people who might just want to make the situation better in some way. Why have even these people got to be labelled by those who feel that throwing people out of other peoples lives is justifiable.

My husbands brother contacted us recently after 10 years of estrangement. I'd sent him xmas cards etc but he'd always ignored them. He asked to meet us. We went out for a curry. Neither me, or my husband had any feeling of animosity towards him, despite him very very nearly finishing us off, business wise, and costing us thousands. It just all melted away at the prospect of a very nasty rift being able to heal. It was absolutely fantastic.

To be clear, if someone has to be estranged from someone because of something very very serious, then so be it. I would not be advising people to be friendly...in situations where they feel they have done all they can, and the other person really is dangerous. But in petty circumstances, I feel it's usually the agenda of one person......who normally has a lot of support themselves and feels that the person they're trying to alienate is superfluous to THEIR needs... The fall-out from that is massive - multiple family members have to suffer simply because of the attitude of one nasty person.

Jem

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The meek get the earth. Peacemakers get called children of God.

No no no Luckylegs you mustn't think that youve let your daughter down!! It was your daughters choice that she doesnt want you in her life likewise my daughter to. As you say we have to respect their wishes no matter how much it hurts.

Dee, what wise words, I am so pleased you and your sister are now close after your long estrangement. Blessed be the peacemaker, for they shall inherit the earth. I am not religious but that passage sticks in my mind because it is so true. I have always done that, although it hurts to make the first move when you feel the injured party, I do it and swallow my pride. Pride is so futile, unfortunately it hasn't worked for me, but at least I did everything I could, I love my girl so much but cannot alter what is in her heart and am more than sorry she feels that way, but want her to be happy, that doesn't include me in her life, somewhere along the lne I must have let her down, but I did my best. I have to respect her wishes.

You're right notyetagran and it's also just as important that the person or people who've estranged themselves from you, don't portray themselves as victims. Our ES has spent the last 4 years casting himself as the victim of our abandonment when he's the one who abandoned us.

jemimavintage excellent posts, everyone of them.

Anya "Typically their new best friend is tomorrow's enemy"; our d.i.l. to a 'T'.

Ah rosina ...'what might have been, what should have been' that's it exactly.

Jemima it was you (I think) who asked us to put ourselves in the shoes of the one who was alone and isolated. Often they are alone and isolated as they have brought that on themselves by turning on everyone.

Typically their new 'best friend' is tomorrow's enemy

Dee I think what you describe is true when two people have fallen out over a particular incident and have now calmed down, but neither wants to lose face or risk being rebuffed by making the first move and it is such a pity when pride gets in the way of re-establishing what is basically a good relationship. However, when one person continually behaves in a way that makes others unhappy, sometimes the only solution is to distance yourself from that person; particularly if they don’t feel they are doing anything wrong and protest that they are only acting out of care and concern. If they continually try to re-establish contact, but don’t make any effort to change their behaviour, it is just seen as harassment. In these situations, one person will always be unhappy if contact is maintained and the other person will be unhappy if contact is cut off, so there is really no solution, but sometimes, cutting contact with a relative who is causing distress to you (and maybe also your children) is the only thing you can do for your own peace of mind.

Jemima I can see how hurt and bewildered you are by the situation you find yourself in, but, from your description of your family situation, your daughter seems to be getting caught in the middle of the “weird feud” between your ex-husband and yourself and I wonder if she feels that removing herself from the situation is the best way for her to deal with it at the moment?

Not easy Dee when you make the first move and its thrown back in your face every time! Nearly 7 years now and I still get the verbal abuse! Im not putting myself in that position anymore, Im done!

Hi Jem,

As a counsellor, and in my own private life, I have come across this many times. Silence happens because, even though people want to get to talking again, it’s measured as ‘giving in’ or as a weakness. The truth of the matter is that being the first to mend the problem actually has a braveness about it as, while you hope it goes well, it may not, as the other party/ies may snub you and get a feeling of superiority from doing so. Believe me when I say that that feeling of superiority that they may get will be on the outside only. You, however, will be able to hold onto that attempt you made to heal the rift and no-one can knock you for that. My sister and I didn’t speak for twenty five years and, when I made that first move, our connection was instant, with an apology from my sister for what had caused the disconnection all those years before. While we lost those years, we now have the icing on the cake.

not immature at all Jemimavintage! different families different circumstances, we all deal with estrangement as best we can.

But jem I don't think my FiL's wife had any regrets about being estranged from her whole family. I think she was happy to play the victim as a way of justifying why they had all, one by one cut her out of their lives.

My reply was to Mumsy and Elegran

WilmaknickersfitIt all sounds so immature tho... someones new wife wants them all to themselves etc etc... It obviously happens like that at times.....but I'm making the point that all it causes is destruction of opportunity.... Of course, the person at the heart of the feud will feel a sense of smugness at having caused pain to one or more people, or whatever.....but ultimately, it can backfire. My ex-husband has never had any success in relationships because he's been so focused on his weird feud with me, and refusal to just 'be normal'. He seeks feud and estrangement.....probably feels completely justified in that....has poisoned countless peoples views/minds..including his own.. and for what? certainly NOT peace of mind...

Jem