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I despair!

(141 Posts)
Madmeg Mon 12-Jun-17 21:16:32

I've been married for almost 45 years. It's not been a brilliant marriage, but we've loved and raised two children, done well in our careers, enjoyed reasonably good health and are not strapped for cash.

Apologies for the long rant.

We took early retirement about 7 years ago and spent the first 4 years bringing our shabby house up to date (mostly done by ourselves). We never really discussed what we wanted to do in retirement but I know he always wanted to improve his photography skills, see a bit of the world and have a model railway (he has most of the kit in boxes). None of it has happened, and he doesn't show any interest in making it, or anything else, happen.

He sleeps 10 hours plus a night, so it's late morning before he gets up, so too late to go anywhere interesting. He thinks that driving 10 miles is a long journey, so being in a rural area means even the next town is too far for him.

He has no plans for the rest of his/our life. It is down to me to organise holidays and he tags along. It is down to me to arrange to visit our girls and grandchildren, and he doesn't seem particularly interested in doing anything with them (they are aged 5 and 3) - he sits in a chair and watches them play. He would happily stay at home every day and potter.

His conversation is non-existent. Today I tried to discuss the success or otherwise of comprehensive schools and he seems to have forgotten what they were, calling them Secondary Moderns, and telling me that our daughters went to grammar schools (they didn't). And this is a man who spent years of his life involved in politics, both local and national, and whose career was in Higher Education. The conversation ended with me in tears cos his arguments were factually wrong and he couldn't see that they were. He told me I was being bossy.

The girls have noticed all this too, and basically have stopped including him in conversations involving anything that requires advice or an opinion - they just ask me, and welcome my input. The most they get from him is "I don't know" or worse, incorrect advice, or even worse a badly-told joke instead that they have heard tens of times before.

Before we took early retirement 7 years ago he talked of developing his photography skills, travelling Europe in our caravan, setting up a model railway (he has all the kit in boxes in the loft). But he's made no effort to pursue any of these. I found him a photography class but after a few sessions he declared it wasn't useful to him. I have drawn up plans to convert our garage for a fabulous model railway but he has barely looked at them saying he is "not sure about it". As for travelling Europe, he now thinks a ten-mile journey is long-distance and suddenly has declared that he has always hated driving - this man had a Triumph Spitfire when I met him!

He is slow and plodding at everything now (he never was fast, but it all seems worse), declaring that "it is bad for you to rush about" and "I like taking my time". Meanwhile I am boiling with rage inside. Even his speech is now laboriously slow, and I've noticed friends losing concentration and wandering off before he has finished his point - which is usually not even interesting.

Everyone thinks he is a "nice man", and he is. He wouldn't ever insult anyone or hurt any living thing. But two friends recently told me "He's a lovely man, but heck, he's hard work isn't he?".

He's nearly 71 (I'm 65). Is this what 71-year-olds are supposed to be like and am I being unrealistic expecting him to have enthusiasm for things? I certainly still have plans and enthusiasm, and could cheerfully take myself off alone to do them, but I'd much rather we did it as a couple, or at least know that if I were off doing something, he would be doing his own thing too.

How do I spend the rest of my life with this bore? Can I chivvy him up in some way to be more lively and positive? When people ask how he is, his standard reply is "Oh, not too bad considering". Considering what? He is fit as a flea.

I say he is as fit as a flea. This is another bugbear (and I apologise again for the length of my post). As I said earlier, his hobby involves politics, so you can imagine that with County Council elections in May and the General Election in June, we have been out delivering leaflets every day. Except I have delivered 80% of them myself, either because he was too tired to come with me, or because he was so slow. I must add that I am not fit. I am more than a little in the obese range on the charts, and he is at the bottom end of "overweight". One particular day we were delivering on a modern estate of semis and I devised a route for each of us that would end up back at the car. If either of us got to the car first, we would carry on and meet the other later down the road. So I did my half, and back to the car. I carried on. And on. And on. By now I was worrying that I was sticking a leaflet through a door he had already done. So I phoned him. Yes, he was fine, he was just round the corner. I had delivered 175 leaflets to his 35. When I queried it with him I was told that his arthritis was playing up. What arthritis? Never been mentioned before. But okay, his knee was hurting. A few days later we were doing another round with the same plan but I made sure that his houses had no steps or steep drives. I did 160 with steps and slopes to his 20 on the flat. His response was "Just because you can go like fury doesn't mean I have to do the same". But surely that isn't normal to have done so little? Is it another example of him having no enthusiasm?

Sorry for the long post, I didn't know what to leave out to give you a proper picture.

BlueBelle Wed 14-Jun-17 06:42:37

Hi Madmeg I m glad you have come back to answer and add to your original post and of course I ll answer your question
When I wrote in reply to you (remembering on this site you only get a small snapshot of one side of the story ) I felt you gave many examples of why you were so upset and hurt and angry but I felt no compassion or love in your post that's what I felt was needed when I said medical and more The thought of everyone in the family ignoring this nuicence of a person felt very uncomfortable to me. maybe it's not really like this but that's how it read to me

It's a shame that any negative posts have caused you so much added heartache if you ask a large group of people what to do you are going to get some suggestions that you don't want to hear and some differences of opinion

I think you have said a lot in this second post about your marriage and probably this is where your anger lies, you are now feeling totally trapped and if I ve understood correctly you have been trapped for a long time and feel very resentful ...you say you will do your 'duty' Will that work? You are in a horrible position and I truely feel for you because you are now looking to maybe having to care for someone for the rest of your life and that someone is a huge irritation to you Excuse my directness but do you love this man ? Do you even like him? You imply he hasn't cared about you throughout your marriage so has it been a marriage in trouble for a long time ?

You say you are asking for advice as to what might be wrong with him you have been given post after post suggesting the man is ill I haven't altered from my original answer I still think it sounds incedibly like dementia or with the added information of his gait, possibly some form of a Parkinson's/neurological related illness but it doesn't sound like normal behaviour and is not going to improve now is it ? If you know you can never get medical help for him then get help for yourself go to your doctor and tell them you are at the end of your tether because you really sound as if you are your anger and resentment is bursting through every paragraph I think YOU both need help and I truely hope you find a way to get it

Madmeg Wed 14-Jun-17 01:36:53

I got angry with Nananina, so forgive the sarcasm. Bluebelle, I have thought everything possible about my husband, both physical and mental illness, and he refuses to accept any suggestion of the possibility. What do you mean "the poor man needs more than medical help"? Could you enlighten me as other people have done with their sensible suggestions? What is this help that you feel he needs?

Madmeg Wed 14-Jun-17 01:31:10

To Nananina, your opinion is callous in the least. Having posted my original message, I read the first tranche of replies and set about doing some online research into depression and dementia based on people's suggestions. I eventually fell asleep at my computer at 3 a.m. Nevertheless, I was up at 7 as I knew I would need to persuade my husband to go to the ONE thing he DOES like attending once a month, which is a short walk along the canal with a U3A group followed by a pub lunch. I usually go with him, but last Thursday I fell badly in the garden and have hurt my knees and face, and jarred my body. I KNEW he wouldn't want to go without me, hence the two hours of persuasion. While he was out I loaded the car with thirty bags of garden rubbish to take to the tip, the knees just about coping, as despite me saying he has no interest in things, if I find him a straightforward job to do he will take part. So on his return we went to the tip. Back home and he helped me to finish cleaning our two little greenhouses (again, a straightforward job with no complications).

Having not used this site much, I had no idea how to get back to my post (and still don't, I landed on it by chance) - but I have responded to three private messages sent to me. After several attempts to find my post I turned to researching a trip I have seen involving a steam railway (remember, he likes trains) and we are going on Friday.

So to anyone who thinks I don't care, am not interested, am not returning to my post, they are wrong.

To answer some of the points from the vast majority of respondents who have been kind and understanding, the main thing is that I am tending to think is it is not dementia. I know, it presents in many ways, and I have first-hand experience of it with my mother and a recent friend being diagnosed - it is easy to miss the early signs. His memory has always been lacking, I have spent 45 years reminding him of things, but usually "everyday" things, so the discussion about comprehensive schools was an oddity. I might be wrong, and will bear it in mind as so many of you mentioned it.

I doubt it is the lack of structure since he stopped working. It is 7 years ago, and his job was never 9-5, and in the last 10 years didn't take up more than about 25 hours a week, 35 weeks of the year. So little structure there. That issue is more likely a concern for me, as my working week was typically 60 hours, and I DID suffer depression after retiring - fortunately picked up by my doctor, but my husband didn't notice me sitting around doing nothing, not getting showered or dressed, ignoring friends. He has probably forgotten it. So when the few people on here have told me I don't seem to care about him, well he didn't care about me back then either. And I did say it hadn't been a great marriage.

Re my daughters noticing anything amiss, it is only in the last few years that they have been at stages in their lives when they needed help with things like mortgages, wills, child-rearing and so on, and soon realised that Dad was not much use at advising them. Other than that, they seem to think he has got a bit slower, a bit less talkative, a bit this and that, but not enough to make any real comments. Plus they don't see him often - three or four times a year for no more than a day or two - so they aren't aware of how he is day-to-day.

There is no way I could ask him to accompany me to a doctor's appointment on the pretext that it was for me. He would assume immediately that I was dying or lying. I have had many health problems over the years and have never once asked him to come with me to the doctor. Yes, he has driven me to hospital appointments, but sat in the waiting room while I went in. That has always been my preference, I don't know why - probably because he would complicate it by asking irrelevant questions!

There is also no way I could persuade him to go to the doctor for himself, unless I can convince him that it is vital. He does have annual check-ups, as a result of the fact that about 5 years ago (having developed severe varicose veins in the front of one leg at least 5 years before that, and having ignored my requests for him to see a doctor), one of his leg veins developed into an ulcer, (which he chose to ignore for about six months) and he was eventually forced to see the GP when he could stand the pain no longer. The result was two years of hospital visits, biopsies, visits to the nurse for dressings, etc etc. All of which I accompanied him to, and changed the dressings.

So he does not have high blood pressure, or diabetes, or a thyroid problem (that's me - I haven't got a thyroid gland any more!

We used to have Well Man clinics, he would never have gone, but they have been stopped.

Re his health, he seems to think he is invincible. We both smoke, and I have urged him to give up with me, or help me to give up. Our daughter with the kiddies has said they cannot come to our house till we give up, but it has no effect on him. I have BEGGED him to at least try, but no chance. Who is the one who is insensitive?

We are both unfit. I have tried to instigate a walk every day, but he can't be bothered. He manages to do it for a few days but then tells me he must spend the day doing something else - which doesn't get done.

Now, very interesting from Cherrytree - thank you. I did not mention in my original post his gait and posture. Whilst he has never been a particularly smart-looking man, who walks as if he has a purpose, he was, until recently, perfectly average. About 2 years ago I noticed that when he sat at the breakfast table opposite me he was slumped in the seat. I chastised him about it, and he rectified it - for a short while. I chastised him again a few weeks later, and again, and eventually gave up. He was 5-foot 11 when I married him. Now, if we are sitting round a table with friends, he looks like a dwarf compared to everyone else, scrunched up in his seat. I assume that is laziness - don't shout at me!

But about the same time I noticed him shuffling his feet across the kitchen floor, not picking them up at all. I told him he would ruin the (new and expensive) floor if he carried on like that, and after several repeats of this he stopped doing it. The next issue was the "plopping" when walking. He seemed to thump his right leg on the floor with every step. Kerplonk, kerplonk. It irritated me (yes, I am such a cruel person Nananina). He stopped doing that for a while, but to me it was a sign that something other than laziness was the cause. I mean, you don't plonk on a particular leg without a reason, do you? I further noticed that he was walking in a flat-footed manner, not via heel-and-toe. He denied all this, said he wasn't walking like that, said I was determined to find something that said he was ill, and I wouldn't be pleased till I had done so. Such is our loving relationship.

And then I read Cherrytree's swaying comment. We went to a model railway exhibition (organised by me, the wife who doesn't care, for the husband who likes model railways), and he went off in a different direction to me. He had been gone for quite a while and I was looking for him, down a corridor full of people walking towards me. I spotted him easily - his was the head going from side to side by about a foot with each step.

Is that a sign of dementia Cherrytree? Another friend who hadn't seen him for a while, witnessed his stooped and swaying gait and remarked "What is wrong with him? Has he got Parkinson's?". I relayed this idea to him and he scoffed at me, repeating that I wouldn't be satisfied till I had found him to be ill, and if I carried on like this I was actually making him ill.

However, I know not how, I DID get him to see his GP about 18 months ago, regarding the plopping and the swaying. She referred him to a physio who gave him exercises to do. He never did them despite me saying we would do them together. The physio eventually referred him for free session at a local gym. He went religiously two days a week for 3 months. I noticed no improvement. They also gave him exercises to do at home, and he did none of them. On his final session he proudly told me that he had done really well on the treadmill that day - he had got up to a mile an hour. A mile an hour? Isn't that a strolling speed? Hardly a notch on the treadmill I would have thought. And as I said, I am not fit either, but a mile an hour!

To answer the person who asked am I not worried, do you still think I am not worried? Maybe I am worried for ME, for the burden I might have to endure with a sick husband, but despite it not being a great marriage, I will do my best for him, cos I could not leave him to his own devices.

You can rest assured that if it were me who had a problem with my gait or posture or memory, he would do bugger all about it. He wouldn't be arranging trips to places of interest to me. I've been ill. I've seen how he copes. He sits me on the settee and I instruct him what to bring to make me comfortable, and then he goes off to another room to do, er, nothing much. I might get a cup of tea brought in, but no conversation, no stimulation, no suggested of a gentle outing somewhere. I could sit there for years in the same position and he would do nothing.

Whereas I am seeking advice on this site as to what might be wrong with my husband and how to handle it.

Yes, I am bursting with rage, but I have cried buckets while writing this, thanks to people like Nananina.

I don't think there is an answer.

Marydoll Wed 14-Jun-17 00:07:51

Kitty in response to your question. I have niggling doubts about DH. My father had vascular dementia and my mother Alzheimer's, and every so often I have brief feelings of deja vu. He can be fine for months and then starts behaving really strangely and irrationally. He thinks he has had a conversation about something with me about making arrangements and gets annoyed when I say he hasn't. I definitely know he hasn't. On one occasion, I came downstairs and he was waiting for me, car keys in hand, saying we had arranged to go and organise a new bathroom. We had definitely not arranged that, as I had a doctor's appointment! It's lots of little things. I can't work out if he is just getting old or it's something else. He is a very clever, usually a kind, placid man, but something has changed. He would be really angry and hurt if he knew I was talking about this. It's just good to get it out of my system. I actually mentioned this thread to him this evening. He didn't see what I was getting at.

Diddy1 Tue 13-Jun-17 23:22:07

It may be difficult, but try and persuade him to visit the Doctor.

singingnutty Tue 13-Jun-17 22:43:41

I haven't read all of the messages, but have read a good number which suggest that your husband may have a medical problem, dementia being suggested. I don't know if anyone else has suggested that it could be an underactive thyroid problem. My DH had all sorts of symptoms some years ago, including feeling very lethargic, tired all the time, and felt he was getting old very quickly. He felt there was something wrong and kept going to the doctors. By sheer chance, after a blood test, the lab suggested he should be tested for underactive thyroid, and that was the problem. He started taking medication and since then has been his usual active self. This is just another possibility - apparently it's not common in men, so the doctors had failed to diagnose it. Hope it can be sorted out, whatever the cause.

BlueBelle Tue 13-Jun-17 22:21:57

I totally agree with you Nananina I thought the original post showed no feelings for the poor man and no understanding It didn't seem to enter Madmegs head that her husband could be physically or mentally ill only that he was a nuiscence and the way that it was thrown in so casually that the daughters no longer include him in the conversation and just ask me and welcome my input really made me feel the poor man needed more than medical help

tidyskatemum Tue 13-Jun-17 22:05:20

Getting him to the doctor id undoubtedly the best idea but one he may well resist. It may take some subterfuge - getting a home visit or you seeing the doctor and expressing concerns. I had exactly this situation with my dad but got the GP out to see him, resulting in a referral to the memory clinic and social services. Please don't see his behaviour as him being awkward - chances are there is a problem so best to face it head on.

kittylester Tue 13-Jun-17 21:39:29

Those of you whose partners have had a diagnosis of dementia ( of any sort) please see what services are on offer. The Alzheimer's Society have lots to offer: advice, befriending, outreach workers, carers courses and groups and dementia cafes. Don't struggle on by yourself.

KaazaK Tue 13-Jun-17 21:30:01

I am in the same situation as you. However in my case my husband had a head injury following an RTA 18 months ago. He sleeps on average 22 hours in 24, doesn't do anything around the house or garden and his personal hygiene leaves a lot to be desired. Doctors have told him he must try and exercise more and lose weight but it all just goes over his head. He doesn't like me going out and leaving him so I am restricted in what I can do. I would love to have a holiday but its difficult to take him away. I would certainly suggest you have a chat with your GP. I can understand your frustration though, even though I know my husband can't help how he is to a point, he doesn't try to help himself at all.

farview Tue 13-Jun-17 21:15:54

...could have been my thread...?...know exactly how you feel...BUT you have to get on and fill/live your own life...?

Riverwalk Tue 13-Jun-17 18:54:19

nananina I think you should cut Meg some slack - it's less than 24 hours since her OP and she's obviously having a hard time at home.

I'm the first to be irritated with posters who start a thread and never return despite members giving long helpful replies. In this instance whether she returns or not I think the thread has been useful for other posters, and has certainly opened a can of worms.

haporthrosie Tue 13-Jun-17 18:52:41

I know you probably don't want to hear one more person say this, but sadly I can say from very close experience it sounds exactly like the onset of dementia.

It can be completely infuriating to live with, no matter how much you love someone. At the moment, I'm battling every minute of every day to live with myself over things I said, and ways I sometimes behaved, to my mother, who died in April.

There are also all sorts of infections that can cause the problems your husband is having - urinary/prostate, lung, blood infections can all seem exactly like dementia.

The fact that he's sleeping so much can cause dehydration ... another dementia-imitator.

Please look into all possibilities. I hope and pray it's nothing serious. I know how hard it is, but for your own sake please try and be patient till you know more. Forgive me for sounding melodramatic, but despite taking care of my beloved, wonderful Mum for 17 years, I'm wracked with guilt. It's a pain I never could have imagined and I wouldn't wish it on the devil himself.

Sorry if this sounds like I'm turning the post into my little story, but it's because I can't bear the thought of anyone else going through this. I really hope that it's nothing, and that if it is medical it can be taken care of easily. But please try to find out.

Barmyoldbat Tue 13-Jun-17 18:47:07

Forgot to say I am lucky, my husband is 70 and is fell running and his brain is far sharper than mine!

Barmyoldbat Tue 13-Jun-17 18:45:30

whatever the problem, whether it's medical or that he is just plain boring you need to make a life for yourself following your own interests. Anya has the right idea and I would suggest you have a long hard think about what you want to do in retirement and get on with it. Life is so short.

nananina Tue 13-Jun-17 18:36:46

You are getting far more sympathy Madmeg than you deserve and you don't even have the courtesy to come back and thank people for their posts. I actually feel sorry for you husband because if he has depression or the beginning of dementia he isn't going to get much sympathy from you.

grandtanteJE65 Tue 13-Jun-17 18:32:27

Dear MadMeg,
No, this is not what all 71 year olds are like. In your place, I would be boiling one minute and weeping the next, so good on you that you are only boiling!

My father was more active at 88 (he died at 89 after two months feeling tired and then pneumonia), so as I am not a doctor, will you please, dear, hurry and consult yours? To me it sounds as if your husband is depressed - sometimes retirement takes men that way, because they have identified themselves more with their work than we women ever do. If it is retirement that is the cause, I would have thought it would have started earlier, but perhaps he feels now that your alterations to the house are finished that he has no purpose in life any more?

Sorry to be alarmist, but it might be the first signs of Alzheimer's so do please, consult your doctor, and I meanwhile will cross my fingers and pray that I am wrong.

Have you tried (I'm sure you have) telling him that you love him, but that you miss the man you have been so happily married to for so long? Sometimes I genuinely don't think that even the best of men, and yours sounds like one of the really good ones before this started, realise that being grumpy, lazy or whatever we are going to call his present behaviour is quite literally the outside of enough. Sometimes, I think, they don't even realize they have changed their behaviour or mood.

If you can't get through to him, perhaps some other member of the family can.

I do hope you will not have to live the rest of your life like this. If you have to, because it is some serious mental disturbance then at least a diagnosis would tell you what you were dealing with, and probably enable you to find others in the same situation who can help by discussing and understanding what you are putting up with, if that is your choice.

I know for a fact that the Alzheimer's association is able to provide voluntary helpers and a support group, and I am sure there are support groups for relatives of people suffering from depression and practically everything else you can think of these days. One of my school friends found these support groups enormously helpful when she went through something similar to your problem.

Please, don't just boil and try to accept that this is your life from now on, as I am sure it doesn't need to be. Try and find the right help, starting with your GP and anyone else you know who you feel able to confide in.

AlgeswifeVal Tue 13-Jun-17 18:18:33

My dh is now disabled aged 76, Our retirement plans went down the pan about 7 years ago. He is now reclusive. I am his carer. However, I also enjoy lots of different activities on my own. I have to or go mad.
Madmeg, make a life for yourseif, get help for hubs, but don't give in and shut down yourself. Life is to short.

Cherrytree59 Tue 13-Jun-17 17:17:44

Hope you don't and me asking Madmeg
Has your DH's walking step changed from the usual one foot in front of the other to Shuffling or lumbering side ways whilst moving forwards?
A change In walking behaviour can be a Dementia indicator .

Charly Tue 13-Jun-17 16:44:37

Must be very challenging, but I go with Bluebelle and others who have pointed to the possibility of illness. Your rage may be your fear in disguise. Be as kind and loving as you possibly can to both of you!

Chris4159 Tue 13-Jun-17 16:35:31

Sounds like my H just got bone lazy!! He is 63 but could be 80 from bed to tv and sofa then pub every eve. Retirement was worse thing ever he done. I still work but also do everything else now. You have my sympathy I know exactly what you mean.

Lewlew Tue 13-Jun-17 16:04:00

willia Tue 13-Jun-17 14:10:22 Oh you get the clever clogs awad of the day. Wonderful idea. I will keep that in mind as it may be necessary some day. So far we are OK, but mine can be so medically-stubborn!

Madmeg flowers

EmilyHarburn Tue 13-Jun-17 15:35:18

Just finished the medscape quiz on Vit B12 deficiency. It all seems relevant. Madmeg you might like to go this route first and try to sort it by diet if possible with GP's help.

www.webmd.com/vitamins-and-supplements/vitamin-b12-rm-quiz?ecd=wnl_spr_061217&ctr=wnl-spr-061217_nsl-ld-stry_1&mb=ypkAdVmorLbPJRYSIVo%40%40eHnVev1imbCqOUymtOtmmI%3d

EmilyHarburn Tue 13-Jun-17 15:29:40

just seen this on Medscape slideshow.

Fatigue is the most common symptom of people who have low levels of vitamin B12. But fatigue by itself can be a sign of almost any health condition — or just that you haven't been sleeping enough! Other signs of B12 deficiency include confusion, cognitive impairment, unsteady gait, numbness, tingling and fatigue.

lovebeigecardigans1955 Tue 13-Jun-17 15:25:21

I'm sorry to hear this Meg as it does sound like he is maybe getting dementia. It is also fairly typical of many men to not want to go to the GP, perhaps because they may hear something that they don't want to acknowledge - which sadly doesn't make it go away. All I can offer is my sympathy. flowers