Devastated for Son

A good solicitor is vital - my DB didn't bother and I'm sure came off worst in his divorce.

Hope things do get resolved for your son and family ExD; I know divorce is a horrible time for all the family but these are the early stages and so long as your son knows that you're there for him if he needs you, you're doing as much as you can.

I think its time we drew a line under this thread.

I started it because I was shocked and gutted by the news, as well as being upset on behalf of my son who genuinely seems to still love his wife. It was a selfish post really, as I needed comfort and help to know what to do with this broken shell of a man who is my son.
Advice on asset sharing wasn't in my question, just a need to know what to do to pull him out of his depression and talk of life being no longer worth living. They are still sharing the house and his (married) daughter is cooking and washing for him. He declined my help, probably because I'm 80 years old and not in good health - otherwise he's working even longer hours on keeping the business running along the covid rules and just sleeping in the matrimonial home and seems to have accepted the marriage is over and full of remorse.
He isn't really communicating with his father and I, and I needed advice on how to cope with this silence without intruding, I was not asking about taking sides as no-one knows the ins and outs of a marriage, so I wasn't going there, and I don't want to try to share out the blame. That is not my place. He doesn't seem in a rush to see a solicitor.

But I think this thread has outrun itself, don't you.
Thanks for those who helped, its appreciated.

Try to be supportive, caring and positive around him. Divorce is hard but after all that time she is entitled to.half. I don't know about the pension but a lawyer will.know. Even if she didn't work she raised the children and we as women know how hard we worked. We don't know what went on in their marriage. You are only going to.hear one side. Try and stay out of it so you can have a better relationship with your ex daughter in law for the sake of the children.

He needs to see a solicitor but first he should offer to go to see a counsellor to see if the problem in the marriage can be fixed.

All assets less liabilities have to be worked out, plus income of both parties. If the matrimonial home is mortgage free then it sounds like there is a large matrimonial asset to be split. The son' s business assets less liabilities can be valued by an accountant to work out value of son's shares in business which might be offset by any cash savings of equivalent vale to the wife. Both parties still have earning capacity so likely to be a clean split, but a divorce now will take current assets and current liabilities into account. Late divorce is expensive and usually results in fall in living standards for both sides, but at least it sounds like there is enough money to provide for 2 smaller houses.

I was awarded a little more than half as I had one child still at home. My ex had offered me house and nothing else. If I had accepted that it actually worked out at 29% of joint assets so I was very glad I paid out on solicitor.

nannan2 I divorced 16 years ago and we had to pension share. My ex was in such a rage as I had stayed home until youngest child was 6 before going back to work and then only 30 hours each week. He even tried to argue with the judge he did not think it was fair I would get 50% of joint pensions as he had earned more. Judge gave him a lecture about being at home with small children and cleaning the home is hard work.

If you did not pension share you could not have had good legal advice.

It is always sad when a marriage fails and 33 years is a long time. However the children have all left home and if one party is really unhappy it is better to divorce than remain in an unhappy marriage. As no children living at home everything will go into shared pot: the marital home, any pensions or assets including jewelry, cars, and the cafe business. The house and business will get valued professionally, pensions will also be valued and the value of everything added together and most likely split 50:50 as no children involved. Your son will probably not be expected to pay maintenance for his wife as she would be expected to get a job unless she was disabled. In reality if for example total assets were 800,000 then they would be awarded 1/2 each but be encouraged to trade items off against each other e.g. his car is worth 12,000 hers worth 8,000 both keep their cars and she is owed 4,000. She has jewelry of 5000 he has none so she keeps jewelry and now he is owed 1000. If he wants to keep the businesses he will have to concede her share of value against his share of house. If none of them want house it will be sold. Any pensions and investments are shared but so are any debts business or personal eg credit card. Basically with no children living at home it will be a straight forward 50:50 split.

I divorced my ex and we had long marriage of 22 years, a shared home with only 3 years mortgage left to pay and a successful business. My ex offered me the house as he wanted to keep the business. It sounded ok but my solicitor said both house and business should be valued as businesses are valued as going concern. Both were valued and business value was almost 3 times that of house. I was very surprised by this and my ex was furious. Business valuations are valued as a going concern and multiples of profit for last calendar year are usually used but not sure with Covid 19.

It sounds as if your son has worked so hard on his multiple cafes that he forgot his wife needed attention too and left her to do everything at home.

If he sees he made a mistake would his wife reconsider and give him 6 months to prove to her she is important to him?

The courts take into account if wife stayed at home to look after children so that husband could build up family assets which include pensions
Ofcourse if children have been in no need of childcare for a long time this would be relevant too what has she been doing since then? Why a big mortgage after 33 years of marriage ? To finance businesses? Doesn’t sound like there will be much to share he needs legal and financial advice

My husband walked out on me after 40 years married, after numerous indiscretions on his part over the years but I drew the line when he flew to the Philippines to be with a woman he met online. He returned 2 weeks later when he realised he couldn’t afford the goods. He took the caravan and I kept the house, my home for 40 years. He kept his pension. If he’d had half the house that would have gone to the philippines as well, and I needed to keep a roof over my head.
Has your sons wife found someone else ?

I thought I'd said, the house isn't mortgaged, after 33 years.

Neglecting her needs, not his

To find a good solicitor, find a firm that specialises in family law . These firms have much more experience in divorce law than firms that do a variety of areas of law .

This is between your son, dil and their lawyers.

You clearly do not approve of your dil and you dont like her.
You imply she demands too much, she never worked and she is unreasonable

They have been married for almost 40 years.
If she wasn't taking care of the kids and of the home, he wouldn't have been able to work on the businesses.
So she does a legitimate claim.
She also worked there as needed.

You also admit your son hasn't been the best husband as he was neglecting his needs.

Please take a step back and let them handle it.
Your son is 60, he is old enough to look for his own lawyer.

How many posts we have seen here of 60 or 70 ish year old posters who want to divorce their husbands after years of neglect?

Your dil could be one of them

You’ve only got his side of the story. There must be a reason for the break up after that length of time.

Be careful what solicitor you use, I chose one and thought I didn't do too badly. however she was sacked shortly afterwards I heard as her work wasn't up to scratch, and I must admit I expected more. My ex husband picked the nastiest one available and he got off lightly. Wish I had hired him.

I can't believe there are people on here that think a woman shouldn't have half of their husband's pension in divorce. In a lot of cases and this one it seems, the husband has been enabled to work and pay into a pension, including SERPS, by the wife being a SAHM therefore not having the luxury of paying into a pension herself. As many have pointed out all the assets will be taken into account.
Obviously OP this probably won't be any consolation to your DS who sounds broken hearted. All the best to you all.

I am so sorry for you. It’s so hard seeing our children suffer whatever age they are. He will get through it but it just takes time. You being there to offer your love and support will help I’m sure. Some good advice on other posts for good legal advice so I hope he finds someone suitable. Take care xx

In my divorce 16 years ago the financial starting point was to add up all assets ( house, savings, cars, caravan, both private pension pots) and deduct all debts ( mortgage, loans etc). Then our earnings were looked at but disregarded in our case as although I worked part time ( three children aged 11 to 16) and he was a very high earner, I did earn enough for my needs taking into account the child maintenance he was prepared to pay.

Our solicitors were then able to agree a split that worked for both of us. His huge pension pot was taken into account to make up for the 8 years I did not work and my part time salary, I actually got 20% of the pot to start a Stakeholder pension of my own. As I recall, there was a new pension act in 2014 to allow a pension pot split so people could have a clean break rather then be dependent on a share of a future pension.

You do not need to go to court which can be very expensive if you can agree terms ( we used solicitors as comminucation between us was difficult) but kept costs low. I trick I used was to email my solicitor with questions rather than phone or meet face to face too often as the charges for her time or formal letters was very high. It helped me to write things down in a notebook then email with several points.

But for now, it's emotional support he needs from you, try not to take sides whatever your feelings about your DIL but just allow him time to grieve and let him talk when he is ready. At his age and after such a long marriage, it will take him a while to get into the right frame of mind to look at the different possibilities.

Because he’s hurt and upset he can very easily make a bad decision. I signed house over to my ex as I was upset hurt shocked etc and to this day I regret it, my solicitor didn’t agree with my decision and signed a document saying she’d advised against it as I wasn’t thinking straight. She was right. There is life after divorce but he probably can’t see that, as all he sees when he looks at his future is starting all over again which is scary at his age. Just guide him gently in right direction.

If couples counselling is off the table, he needs legal advice NOW.
Unfortunately, he needs to crawl out of the slough of despond that he is in, and take action.
If necessary, go with him to any appointments.....
Sad as it is, he's a grown man, and must get it sorted ASAP.

Its become a whole new ballgame these days, 20 yrs, even 15 yrs ago, the judges seemingly 'forgot' about pensions, and never even bothered in my case about giving a monetary award for myself, and even in regard to my now 21yr old) son.No mention made of any pensions at all.(15 yrs ago,same but a very small maintenance allowance for son only.Still no pensions mentioned) How times have changed.its no wonder some more mercenary other halves just want to jump ship and take all they can..As for ExD's son- wouldnt the wife only be able to include any private pension?i doubt a 'state' pension would be taken in account would it? ??isnt that just individual to each person, decided upon by gov't when you actually retire? In any case they would take her pensions (if any) into account too, so its not all based just on what he has to give- covid19 has changed a lot of things, so i would imagine its same in law now too, i think they would see a reflection of how its affected his earnings, & takings in the business and will take that into account now too- a lot of businesses were doing well last year, but have now even closed down.I doubt they'd assume all 3 were still flourishing just on the face of it.He needs a lawyer who deals in family AND property law and Pronto.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

I'm so sorry that you're going through this dreadful time. It's been a long time since my divorce but this is my experience. I went with my BiL to a solicitor that he really recommended to me but I could tell fairly quickly that he wasn't going to be able to get his head round my complicated situation. I then went to a second solicitor who was fantastic. At the time the first 30 min interview was free.

He shouldn't agree to anything with her until he has taken legal advice, it could be a financial minefield.