How often do you see DS?

There is no such thing as 'normal' contact with adult children.

Some people will see an adult child daily, others do not see them for years on end. The same applies to telephone, Facebook and every other form of communication.

Once children grow up and are independent they call the shots and what those shots are, is dependent on the character of the child, how they perceive their childhood, which is not the same as how you perceive their childhood or how their childhood actually was, where they live, family commitments their spouse and so many other factors.

So, as I said there is no such thing as a 'normal' relationship.

It is obvious that you are unhappy about how little you hear or see of your youngest son, and that is never a happy feeling. As older adults, we just have to accept what our children offer. It seems that it is only your youngest son you are unhappy about, so make the most of your relationship with your other children and reach out to your youngest child, but you will have to accept what he offers. he clearly still keeps in touch with you, and many estranged parents would give anything just to have that contact.

What MOnica said.

Maybe approach him and explain how you feel. Ask for a weekly keep in touch text.

Sally there isn't a "normal", relationships are built or destroyed by the people in them.

As Monica says, take what your son offers. Create and offer what you can yourself that is nice for both of you (ie not moaning or worrying or putting pressure on) and build the relationship in a way that works for BOTH of you

I absolutely agree with Monica. What did you expect to hear here? You cannot make your son keep in regular touch or want to have a closer relationship with his family. I would definitely not ask for a weekly check in call or message because it won't happen or your son will feel resentment and it would be unsatisfactory anyway. You have two other children who presumably you have a closer relationship with. Make the most of that.

I agree that there is no normal. Perhaps it is more “ normal” for a daughter to be closer than a son, but no guarantee.
There have been two periods in his life when my DS has chosen not to be in contact, for his own reasons. Even now he is not in touch regularly, but he has a busy job, as does his wife, and two youngsters at home.
As I recall, when I was at that stage, and my parents were still working, we were not often in touch other than an occasional phone call.

I agree with the previous comments.

I don't have any expectations. I go with the flow.

At the moment, I am very lucky because both DSs have settled in our area. Even so, I see far more of one of them than the other, but it's no indication of how they feel about me.

If they were to emigrate (not out of the question), I wouldn't expect regular contact. It would be enough for me to know that they were well and vice versa.

Like DS1, I struggle with small chat on the phone, dreading that moment of silence when I can literally think of nothing to say, so unless there is something specific to discuss, I am happier with brief WhatsApp updates than forced, awkward phone calls made because it is 'expected'.

My own Mum wants more actual contact than I can, or want, to give her, and her constant unsubtle hints about seeing me more make me dread our almost daily (long!!!) phone calls even more. I hope I never put my own sons in that position.

Thank you for your replies.

I think the matter is complicated in that when DS1 became married and had DGC, DS1 expected that DD and DS2 would be heavily involved in their lives (e.g. 'Aunt' and 'Uncle'). DS2 is just not interested in his niece and nephew (and why should he be?).

I feel that I have let DS2 down and that the reason he doesn't want to have a relationship with his original family is that he feels we have let him down, which I, as matriarch am responsible for.

You're not responsible for anything.
Your children are adults, and live their lives as they see fit.
You can't make life bend to whatever shape your grown children want.

I don't have sons but do have daughters,like others have said I go with the flow. One DD is like me and worries if we haven't spoken for over a week on facetime. The other can go for two weeks but then talk for three hours on facetime.
Neither lives near enough for visiting without overnight stays.
We got a text message from the second at 11.30 last night it's a family birthday today as she had printed the text it read. Parcel arrived safely,.... is dead. Scrolling down it then said excited about his birthday. We went to sleep with a chuckle.

Communication is the glue. Don’t expect your DS to be thinking what you’re thinking. Respect that he has a life of his own but always, always communicate honestly and calmly and check if he feels the same. Perhaps ask if there’s a ‘better’ time to ring so you can have a catch-up. That way neither of you are under stress or interrupted.
Good luck ?

I would send a weekly chatty email to him.

It’s his choice whether or not he replies, but at least he would know you are thinking about him.

My opinion might not go down well with some but it’s not a given that our children have to like us.
It’s lovely if “we” do have a loving relationship with our parents/ children but it’s not written in stone that this is the way it has to be.

MerylStreep

My opinion might not go down well with some but it’s not a given that our children have to like us.
It’s lovely if “we” do have a loving relationship with our parents/ children but it’s not written in stone that this is the way it has to be.

Again I agree with this you have to accept that your child might not feel as close or love you as you do them.
I once caused a lot of discussion in a staff room after a parents' night when a parent told me their child did not like me and I reported what had been said. I had nearly retorted and I'm not keen on them either with their sneaky bullying ways. I stopped myself. I said I would try and build a rapport with them.
Teachers have to have no favourites just parents shouldn't, it does not mean that your love or kindness will be reciprocated in an equal measure.

I would send a regular WhatsApp keeping him up to date with family news. Nothing long, just a How are you? Dad has got over his bout of covid and is thinking of buying a new car. Any recommendations? type of thing. Emails are most unpopular with the younger generation these days.

By the way, my son told me that a Whatsapp phone call was a very grannyish thing to do!

No less valuable for that Cabbie21 I use WhatsApp all the time to communicate with my family. They use other social media as well but keep me in the loop with WhatsApp. Adult children are all different with the amount of contact they are happy with, don't fret SallySmith I'm sure your son will see things differently in time.

sallysmith Your 'problem' with your younger son is such a common 'problem' it hardly counts as one. Within families and outside them, one person has perceptions about how other people should behave towards them and then takes offence/is upset when the other people do not behave as expected and extends that sense of grievance to anyone associated with the person who 'offended'

As for I feel that I have let DS2 down and that the reason he doesn't want to have a relationship with his original family is that he feels we have let him down, which I, as matriarch am responsible for.

Stop making rods to beat yourself with. How on earth can you have let him down? He was the one with the unreasonable expectations of his siblings. As for you being responsible because you are the matriarch!

Our relationship with our adult children is defined by our children not be us, and, from all I can see there is often precious little relationship between quality of parenting and how close are adult children are.

We all know that our relationship with every child is based on that child's personality. One child will by nature be more affectionate, or more independent or more touchy and liable to take offence. Once they are grown-up they make their own lives and relationships, and all we can do as parents is sit back, accept that there is nothing we can do about it, which is exactly what you need to do.

Your younger son expected his siblings to be far more interested in him and his family than they wanted to be

Forget last two lines, they should have been cleared.

Try not to beat yourself up. We mother’s do the best we could with what information and energy we had at the time (with some exceptions).
I wasn’t perfect, I had a favourite out of my sons, because he was more traditional in his outlook and career. My elder son finally raised this with me, and we had a wobbly year or two, but he has had a child since and I think being a parent (and some self reflection on my end) with all it entails brought us closer together again. Dare I say it he’s privately my favourite now, (though I’m very equal in my attention/gifts etc) because seeing him grow into a wonderful father and husband, I’ve become awfully proud of him.
Relationships change and grow. Try not to force it too much and it may repair over time.

One girl and 2 boys here. All live locally, but I don’t see them as often as you’d think. Monica has hit the nail on the head. It all depends on the personalities involved. Older daughter and son are quite difficult and have been known to say very hurtful things. But I just let it go over my head. Youngest has a very calm and amiable personality and so, I enjoy his company.
Your DS2 lives abroad and obviously, it must be difficult to arrange meet-ups, but just go with the flow. And please don’t blame yourself. I am divorced and the family dynamics are more complicated. But I can’t do anything about it …..good luck Sallysmith