Make-up and the Menopause

Thanks espee.

And sorry for the derail, OP.

NudeJude I'm really pleased you got something sorted and to get the right shade first time too!

Apologies to the OP as we seem to have gone off at a tangent. Glad you have solved your problem Jude.

Gettingonabit, doctors are human with prejudices like everyone else, a gentle reminder of what constitutes best practice should work but I would be loathe to entrust my healthcare to someone like your male GP. I have described the feeling of HRT kicking in as being like having your battery replaced. I hope it works for you.

Maybe a trip to your GP may be in order. You are suffering quite a bit.

Thanks Espee. I very rarely go to the Doc in the normal course of things, so unaware of how I should tackle the situation.

I must admit I was a bit shocked (and I'm pretty unshockable most of the time). The Doc (an elderly male, for the record) basically told me that I should "put up and shut up", just like his wife did.

There's a female Doc at the practice now, but I don't get many symptoms apart from crippling tiredness and I don't know if that's just old age.

Anyhoo, glad the OP has found a cosmetic solution to her problem.

Gettingonabit,
If your doctor is unwilling to prescribe HRT for you change doctor or ask to be referred to a menopause clinic.
NICE recommendations (national clinical guidelines to ensure consistent high quality, evidence based care for patients) have changed recently. If you wish to remain with your present GP you should print out the NICE recommendations and mail them to your doctor to be read before you see them. A friendly note saying that in light of the new guidelines which you have attached you would like to make an appointment to discuss HRT should do the trick. Best of luck.

Lupatria,
The implants did become unavailable about 4 years ago. There was almost a riot at the menopause clinic. You have to be a very brave person to tell a woman with oestrogen levels at rock bottom that she is not going to get her implant. I was told to use patches but went home and contacted everyone I could think of from the minister of health down. I created such a fuss that I was asked to come back to the clinic where "miraculously" they had discovered a small supply. That gave me 6 months to do everything I could to ensure another supplier was found. For a while the clinic imported unlicensed oestrogen from the U.S. and we all had to sign a release saying we understood the product was not licensed. Now supplies are back but many ladies who accepted that they would have to change method are unaware they could come back to the clinic.
Pills would be my last choice, any transdermal method is preferable be it implants, patches or gel. Pills are much stronger because the liver eliminates the oestrogen. Transdermal methods avoid the first pass through the liver. I believe your allergic reaction to the patches was to the adhesive, not the active ingredient. Different patches use different adhesive. Estradot worked for me but I prefer implants. You only have to think about it twice a year.

NJ , excellent news every little helps to make us feel good about ourselves

Update!

Hi everyone

I have some news! I went on to the Estee Lauder website, and did live chat with one of the assistants, who talked me through the Double Wear product that some of you recommended. She even told me, after asking some questions, what colour foundation I would need. Needless to say, I was a little reluctant to buy a colour based on what she'd told me without seeing me, so got my lovely husband to take me into town briefly to visit Debenhams and the E. Lauder counter. The young lady there gave me a couple of samples, one of which is absolutely perfect, and surprisingly was the exact shade that the assistant on line had recommended. I came home and tried it and it's AMAZING! That afternoon I had 3 hot flushes making my hair drip but the make up stayed put! I was gobsmacked! Needless to say, I shall be investing in the product for longer term wear, and just to share what I've learned, if you want to try Estee Lauder products, you can order online, and if it's the wrong colour, or doesn't suit, you can send it back and they'll even pay the p&p. You can't ask for better than that, so well done all who recommended their product, and to E.L. for their EXCELLENT service.

i've been on hrt since my total hysterectomy in 1995 - i had ovarian cancer so my gynae removed everything [as he put it he took away the nursery but left the playpen - loved that description].

at first i had patches but was allergic to them so then i opted for the implant but, about four years ago, was told by the hospital that the manufacturers weren't making it any more so i've been on pills every since.

i get all my pills and potions from an online pharmacy and they email me every 28 days asking if i need anything. i've never had a problem with getting the hrt [or anything else actually] and would recommend an online pharmacy as it saves all that faff going to your doctor's to leave the repeat prescription and then going back a couple of days later to get the new one and have it made up.

i've decided to stay on hrt for as long as i can at the current dosage - i feel very well on it and don't look my age [or so i've been told]. and don't suffer from any symptoms. hated the hot flushes after my hysterectomy before i got the patches.

as for makeup - i tend not to use it unless i'm going out with the girls and even then i only use eye makeup and lipstick as i find foundation doesn't stay on anyway, especially in the summer.

i've used maybelline's 24-hour lipstick for years and find it DOES actually do what it says.

eye makeup is usually collection 2000 [or whatever they call it these days] and i always go for an eyeliner like a felt tip pen - much easier than liquid. mascara is one which bulks my lashes out.

as i wear glasses i tend to go slightly overboard on the eye makeup - just to make sure it's seen!! and i try to colour-code it with what i'm wearing at the time. i get many compliments thankfully!

A slight derail, but when I started having flushes a while back my doc refused me HRT. I'm surprised to discover that its use is widespread, and I'm wondering how other women have managed to get it?

Incidentally, I wasn't refused to due to medical history, it was a straightforward "no".

Esspee actually I can see your reply from Tuesday, but I must have missed it. Thanks for explaining and taking the time to tell us about your HRT. My Mum stayed on HRT far longer than was recommended at the time and didn't want to come off it because she looked so well on it. Her skin retained its firmness and it was in great condition. She felt it kept her looking a lot younger than her age.

Unfortunately I can't take HRT because I have endometriosis and fibroids. A few years ago I had problems having my usual smear test and after an internal examination, I was sent for an ultrasound by my GP. In addition to identifying a large fibroid, the ultrasound showed a large mass on one of my ovaries. Blood and other tests indicated it was more than likely ovarian cancer. It was decided I should have a hysterectomy and both ovaries removed, but when I went into surgery, it was discovered that had more than one fibroid and extensive endometriosis - the consultant used the phrase 'riddled with it'. It had caused my womb to become attached to my bladder and intestines, so it was decided just to remove the ovary with the mass. She could tell just from looking at it that the mass was also endo, and this was confirmed later once it was tested for cancer cells.

My consultant told me I would not be suitable for HRT and I would go through the menopause in due course and hopefully the endo and fibroids would shrink. I had injections for 3 months of a hormone given to men with prostate cancer and these stopped my periods. Unfortunately I had the same problem with my next smear and so far the fibroids and endometriosis haven't shrunk. Luckily the only menopause symptom I have is these head sweats. I had one this morning, but it must be a week since the last one.

I do envy women who are on HRT and don't know anyone who wants to come off it. I certainly didn't know you could stay on it for life, so thanks for sharing that information.

Wilma,
I did respond to your question a couple of days ago but somehow it hasn't appeared. Those of us on HRT have opted to delay the menopause. I have no intention of ever stopping therefore it is a matter of the individual deciding whether or not they wish to suffer the change or not. The ladies I meet in the menopause clinic all say that they are on implants for life. We believe that quality of life is all important and fortunately both NICE and our specialist agree. We pop in twice a year and have a tiny pellet of very low dosage oestrogen implanted under our skin then for the other 363 days of the year we don't have to think of it allowing us to get on with our lives. Other options are mini patches to put on twice a week, gel to be applied daily, an aerosol to be inhaled every day (if still available), and a daily pill. The transdermal option (everything except the pills) is preferable. If you have had a hysterectomy you only need oestrogen, otherwise a combination of oestrogen and progestogen is required.
Hope this answers your question.

Hi Wilma,
Those of us on HRT have chosen to delay the change. Personally I will be taking it forever as life without oestrogen is unthinkable after my experiences following a hysterectomy.
I have a tiny very low dose pellet implanted every six months, so I only have to think about it twice a year. Been doing this for about 25 years and the benefits are enormous.
It is a bit like the freedom the pill gave us in our youth, completely life changing.

I'm a lover of full slap at all times, and although I don't have the sweats, my makeup stays on through thick and thin. For me, the vital ingredient is primer, plus matt foundation (loads of those around now). For lips, make sure you pencil around the lipline before applying colour, or the colour will bleed.

If you use eye makeup, use waterproof mascara.

You're welcome.

Esspee I don't understand what you mean. How is the menopause optional?

Hi Wilma (love your moniker, btw) thanks so much. I'll try Amazon and eBay.

Do you really want to suffer the menopause? It is optional these days.

Blinko the Dainty Doll range is especially for fairer complexions. It's by Nicola Roberts who was the very fair red head in the girl band Girls Aloud. I've got a feeling that it's been recently discontinued though, because none of the stockists on the website are selling it now. But you can get it from Amazon and eBay. You can see the range on the website here

Dainty Doll

On the make up topic, only indirectly connected to the menopause, as I am ageing, I am also finding that my pale skin tone is even paler. I'm having trouble finding a suitably pale foundation/BB cream. I've tried Ivory, Porcelain, and various others which sound as though they are really light. Only to find that they're still too dark and heavy. Does anyone else have this problem and how did you solve it?

I must look up `tubing mascara` it sounds interesting !

Eyelash and eyebrow dye or waterproof mascara

Powder blusher

Maybeline 24hr lipstick does not come off unless you use a makeup remover .

BTW are you on HRT ? it stopped all my menopause symptoms including the sweats .

I just could not give up makeup , it makes me feel so much better about my appearance . Perhaps go into Boots for a makeover (free) and some advice xx

I am a great fan of Jane Iredale mineral foundation. I use Dream Tint Moisture Tint which you put on with a brush. And using the brush is real easy after a couple of tries - it feels light and even when I sweat, [I play a lot of tennis] I can come back home and it is still on. I need waterproof moisturiser though and I always put a couple of drops of lavender essential oil in a new mascara which allows me to keep it on for longer without any irritation.
It seems like once you find a good base the other stuff seems to stay put!
I take off the mascara with a DIY pot I make of a mix of extra virgin coconut oil and castor oil. I also use that for full face wash/clean at night, removing it with hot flannel or muslin. Then eye cream and moisturiser after.

NudeJude if I were you I wouldn't pay for the samples because you'll probably only get small sachets with small amounts of the products. Also, some brands only supply samples when you buy something from them. Estee Lauder does some product samples and I know it does skin care and fragrance samples, but I don't know about makeup or if you can get samples without buying something. You can get makeup samples for a very good price from Paula's Choice but I don't think she does anything that will help you with your head sweats.

When I want to try something new and I don't want to pay for the full size product, I look for it on eBay. You can buy samples there for brands that do samples and usually you'll get several samples for your money and that will give you a good chance to try it out. Lots of people buy products and either don't open or only try once or twice, you can buy these on eBay too. I only buy samples from sellers in the UK. If you do give eBay a try, just watch that you don't pay too much. Remember that you can buy almost all makeup online direct from the company or from shops like Boots on Superdrug.

Hope this helps.

WilmaKnickersfit - What a lot of useful ideas and information, and thanks to all you other ladies for your thoughts and advice.

My Mum ALWAYS wore a little bit of slap, even up until she died aged 83. She always looked so lovely, and I feel that I'm letting her down by giving up on makeup altogether, so I shall try the various ideas, as and when I can. Unfortunately, getting into town to get samples etc is really difficult too, as I'm disabled, and find the shops a bit daunting these days. Bearing this in mind, I came across a product by MAC online last night and so went on their website to follow it up. They have a live chat available for advice etc., and the person I spoke to was very helpful, but said that they couldn't do samples with their online service, even though I explained my difficulties. I thought that this was very short sighted in these days of online shopping, and while she did ask questions so that she could advise me on the colour I should get, I would be very reluctant to spend £25.50 on what amounts to pure guess work. Does anyone know of any online suppliers that do send out samples?

NudeJude I too suffer from a hot head, although I think I might be lucky because it's the only menopause symptom I get. But it is bad and I now wear my hair in an asymmetric bob cut short into my neck because of how wet my hair gets at the back. It is so embarrassing when drops of sweat water suddenly hit the table in a café or somewhere and that's the first sign you get.

I don't have any solution to the hair dripping problem, but I can tell you what I do make up wise, some of which have already been mentioned.

Get your eyebrows and eyelashes done, or learn to do them yourself because it's not hard. It takes me longer to do it myself, but it's worth it.

Use a moisturiser with a fake tan built in. It builds up a natural healthy looking colour and evens out your skin tone. I use the one by Simple, but there's others out there. It doesn't contain any SPF, so I use it as a night cream several times a week and then just use my usual moisturiser in the day time.

If I want to wear makeup then the foundation I use is Revlon's ColorStay liquid foundation for Normal/Dry skin, but it's also available for Combination/Oily skin. It doesn't budge, but you do need to learn to apply it quite quickly to get the best finish. EL Double wear is great, but at almost 3 times the price it's too expensive for me. If I'm really going to town with my makeup, I also use Revlon's ColorStay concealer. If I think I can get away with it for a few hours, I just use Garnier's original BB Cream in Light and hope for the best.

Panda eyes became a thing of the past for me when I discovered tubing mascara. The original one is Blinc, but several big brands do one now. I honestly believe tubing mascaras are played down because they would take away a big share of the maraca market if they were advertised more! You don't get great volume, so if you like big fat lashes, then you're out of luck, but if you like natural looking longer lashes then go for a tubing mascara. I now use a Japanese brand mascara called DHC Double Protection Mascara that I buy from Amazon and love it.

I use a lip stain for colour on my lips and then something moisturising on top. At the moment I love Revlon's fat lip pencils that come in different finishes. The shade called Honey is my current favourite.

This all might sound a lot, but it's not really when you break it down. Apart from the DHC mascara, I think you can buy everything I've mentioned in Boots. In one way it's been a real pain finding out what works best for me, but I love trying new things so it gave me a great excuse! Hope this helps.

Two useful links for makeup and skin care

MakeupAlley
Beautypedia