cut out of thier lives 2

Grief counselling was a waste of time for me. I had to work things through for myself.

[Wine] and (((hugs))) to you all

Morning,
Attended a family event where everyone asked after my DD and our GC. Very hard but they were all positive and hopeful. That's the difficulty for us , treading a path where maintaining hope causes so much pain because we are so aware of the clock ticking and missed opportunities . Crying is so easy for me , always has been ; it is ultimately healing but so upsetting for those around us who love us . My feeling is that we have to accept that we are not going to see them again , because that way we will not stop living our lives as our parents hoped we would . I have been rotten to my dear H ; I cannot imagine seeing him in so much pain but I know he has missed them all as much . I am hoping to see a grief councellor ; has anyone in this situation tried this ?
Dear Girls , wine and flowers and hope much appreciated !
Off today with a mission to lift the spirits of all those around .

Me too Celebgran 'till I die', if eventually we do recontect, the scare on my heart and soul will still be there. I didn't sleep a wink last night, Xmas coming up and all My ND and her other friend is coming round this afternoon with her new born baby [happy]. Her mum passed away and she now only has a sister, she tells my ND how fond of me she is, I did 'toy' with the idea of being her babies surrogate nannie, but that hurt too much, thinking it should be my Laila and Jack

Sorry otw and yogagirl.

Yes otw rationality does go out of window with the painless

I cry quite often the day oh found out dd was pregnant again he took me to pub for brandy the tears started and could not control them.

Even this week doing her god mothers pedicure I felt tears come when mentioned I still got my son.

Wish I had some hope but having another baby girl and still not wanting me not good.
Also my niece is now ignoring me due to trouble caused by her ex. I feel is up to her I can't go down route of more rows with her have stayed calm and nice but will miss my great nieces. Also feel stupid for getting involved with her ex but she did not even tell me they had split so not totally my fault.

Lovely that we do have my twins first grandchild living near but wish with all my heart was my own,

Otw if you can ring your daughter there is hope

Life goes on and somehow we have to try make most of it we only get one,

I would have and still would do anything to heal the rift but my s in law seems to rule the roost.

They live 45 miles away and impossible guess if he will be there but dd would have let her dad see kids if up to her. What do you do ???

Yogagirl I think is shame you can't cry in some ways it brings relief but can be draining part of healing process but will it ever heal? Not in my case I feel it will hurt me until day I die.

Q+A
1) The last two days I've had trouble getting this link up?
2) How do you get spell check on here? I do have it on this tablet
3) I really wonder why I have never cried, my heart cries to breaking point but my eyes don't tear

Morning Girls
Nice to hear from you Nanban. Yes Celebran You have to go to court to ask permission to go to court for a contact order, lots of forms to fill in first. I went to court three times; first time they didn't show up, so it was postponed, second time they opposed it, third time it was refused, I feel the judge was not a mother or grandmother, she had no empathy with me and she was the third judge so no continuity.
I had a lovely 'mother and daughter' meal last night with my ND's friend and her mum, her mum being cut off from her D and GC too, she believes in Karma, I should too, but the waiting for it is very hard.
Dear Otw what can I say to ease your pain, not much I fear, my pain never eases.
and to try and momentarily ease your and all on here's pain, save the for this evening though ladies

Thank you Nanban. Very bad day today. Rang my DD , felt in need of hearing her voice and she picked up and found out GC no. 2 on its way- it didn't end well! Cannot cope with all the beautiful little children I work with when I cannot see my own DD and little GD . My DH is a tower of strength but the pain can drive you so far from rationality ! I will be back on track tomorrow . Peace to all .

Thank you Nanban

Omg yogagirl I did not realise you had to go curt t get permission I thought was all done by forms maybe I would not have got permission .

Nanban lovely thoughtful post. Just wish then damn sadness would lift.

dear friends, how sad it is to come back to gransnet and so much pain. I want to convince you not to beat yourselves up, forget the guilt, you are grieving parents - grieving for the loss of your children and grandchildren but at the same time being blamed for it in some way or other. The fact that you are on this site, looking for help, looking for answers says it all - it says you are lovely, caring people in nightmare situations of someone else's making. And the most awful words in the english language - if only - but you do what you do out of desperation, and on the day see no other option in trying your best to make everything right.

Take some time every day just to be kind to yourselves; or do a small kindness for a stranger. It will lift your spirits and give you the strength of keep going.

I wish I could give you purely good news and sure and certain hope for the future, but one day at a time, and very small cautious steps.

'Morning Girls
Like you Celebgran I just can't stop myself thinking about them, and yes beating myself up about it all, 'if only I had said this in the court room, if only I'd stayed queit'
You are doing the right thing in not sending presents and cards, your GC my not even get the cards, mine never did, and the present may be given but not told who they are from! Get your GC cards write them out and keep them for them till you do see them, which you will one day. I think you and I are in the same boat in which we wont see our beloveds till the s.i.l is out of the picture, I pray for that every day.
I've just realized that I've never made clear to anyone, and I should have, that in fact the last court case was still to get permission to apply for contact order, and so I never actually got as far as the big court where they would say 'yes' or 'no', the final court paper I recieved read;
The applicant's permission to make an Application for contact to Laila and Jack is refused'

Oh yogagirl please do not best yourself up I am just the same only wish we had gone to court still would if husband would.

At least you can feel you did all you could I will never know if I could have got contact!

There are 2 baby granddaughters never met and it hurts like hell to cope with this and every part of me wants go see her again have not ruled it out but not going take all that trouble with presents again after 5 years I had enough.

What we did wrong we will never know but s I law is desperate to keep us out of their lives and is so immature involving police ???

Otw well done for helpful comments so good we can try support each other through this hell !

Morning Otw thanks again for your wise words, I wish I had had some wise words when this first happened. I did wait 3mnths before starting the court procedure, only found this forum some time after that. I did ask my son (best mates with s.i.l) to help and my previous f.i.l but both got sucked into his (s.i.l) dark world of deceit and lies, believing him above me! I had done and said nothing wrong! and still don't know what was said against me. It all started with s.i.l doing the same to my D; not letting her back into their family home after a big argument and not letting her see her babies, even though Laila is not even his child! I came back from my hols to help them both, mediated successfully and got them back together, ( not knowing till after what a nasty cruel husband he had been to my D) I said to s.i.l in a quiet voice "Jenni will get custody of Laila, therefore Jack and its the mother and babies that stay in the family home, its the man that leaves" so it was with that sentence my fate was sealed, even though that same sentence got them back together.

Dear Yogagirl,
Don't let it haunt you; your actions were based on trying to maintain some sort of contact with those you love. That's not a bad thing nor is the situation of your making . You and I have a rocky road to walk but we have to take our strength from the fact that this crazy situation is not something we chose but something we have to live with .

I wish now that I had stayed quiet and just waited in the hope that it would all blow-over, but then 'hind sight is a wonderful thing'(as my dad always said) At the time I just wanted the fastest way to seeing my GC and through them my D too. But then you did just that Celebgran and it didn't work for you so, 'damned if you do, damned if you don't'

Hello Celebgran
So glad you enjoyed your w/e, apart from the last evening
I'm not sure whether I'm officially allowed or not, but I do know that Laila and Jack wont get to see them, so there's no point. I hope our daughters miss not getting a loving card from their mums and then miss us and think about what they are doing! Its 11mnths today since this hell began for me, I cant believe it!
Seeing the terrible news about Madeleine McCann really makes it hit home about our loss too, as my Laila looks like her,same age too (3yrs). When my ND saw the news programmes on it she said her heart stopped! I actually woke up 2mornings thinking about little Maddie (normally my Laila) and how terrible it must have been for that little girl to wake up in a strange place looking for her mummy!!
I just can't rid myself of this deep sadness and I don't think I ever will. I'm going out for a nice meal on Friday night with my ND and one of her best friends and her mum, unbelievably, she too is cut out of her GD's lives! Again spiteful jealousy. Joe's mum adopted two babies before she gave birth to Joe, Joe's adoptive sister has always been jealous of her, saying there was a special bond between her and their mum, when AD had two adorable little girls she decided it would be a good time to cut her mum out of their lives, after all the bonding had taken place, her mum, like us, had done and said nothing wrong

Oh sorry yoga giro forgot to say yes hard to it will be are going give daughter chance to miss our cards and presents tho she will probably be relieved.

Are you not allowed to send stuff to your grand kids?

Morning yogagirl! How are you now? Try find something to smile about each day .

We enjoyed weekend was lovely our roo. Was so. Icy nicer tha. We expected and our friends are great company.

We only got bit sad on last evening when discussed daughter between ourselves and unfortunately I did not feel well after meal so missed last evening.

On way home we stopped at Freeport quick wizz round shops the. Onto tesco for few bits not keen on tesco our salad dated 16th was horrid ! Just convenient. Was tired and felt tearful when saw little girl about mollie age just out school this is going to happen sadly.

Yes, KatyK your right, I know IF I was ever reconciled with my D, I would always be afraid to speak in case something set her off again, but actually I don't think it would because I'm sure once she is away from her cruel husband and his mum, she will be back to my loving sweet D again.
Oh Celebgran I'm so sorry, as I've said before, you have the same nasty, cruel s.i.l as me. I will not be sending cards or making any contact (can't even if I want to anyway), I will get cards for my GC and put them with their Xmas, Birthdays and presents of last year, in December I will open a bank acc for them both and put money in for Xmas and Birthdays. My D doesn't deserve a lovely Birthday card, I want her to miss not getting one from me and her sister, then perhaps she will miss us and dare I say even think of us. Its all so very sad and unnecessary, I didn't do or say anything wrong at all and nor did my other nice D who has also been given her marching orders, along with my sister, her dad's sister and mum (aunty + nan) and her best friends! Funny not one person from s.i.l side!! I think you will give your D a deserved shock by not sending any more gifts and presents to any of them, I think you should do just that, Its not going to make things worse is it, 5yrs!!! Enjoy your w/e Celebgran, and so much for my not thinking about them any more

Reading some of these makes me realise my situation is not so bad. I wish you all well.

I read all these stories and feel so bad for you all but getting on with your own lives (and I am not underestimating how impossible it must seem to you) perhaps will show your daughters that you are not letting their treatment of you ruin the rest of your lives.They maybe get some horrible pleasure from this. Don't let them, and their partners, have the satisfaction of breaking you.

Oh how very hard I a finding it! Greatnan I do not think anyone whatever they may have done or not done could deserve the cruelty that sadly a lot did us are suffering.

I Try so very hard but since dear husband latest visit and the knowledge that we have a new baby granddaughter not allowed to see and horrid s I law prevented my husband from seeing it has been so very hard.

We keep going and have good friends and a lovely son but my heart aches for my daughter and then little ones. Have been nearly 5 years now so I guess not much hope of the pain disappearing for me.
This latest birth has flung it all up.
Daughter told my husband is mum still in denial ? Denial of what?
The cruellest thing was when husband asked for photos and she said no don't want get your hopes up!
Part of me feels let her go to hell but the mum
Part won't leave me alone! I have gone back to waking up sick inside and it is mental torture. We have now decided to walk away and. Ot contact her or little ones against breaks my heart and we have no idea what else to do except as otw says to give her chance to hurt and reject us again.
In 5 years not one acknowledgement ever of any loving card or present sent even to little one we never seen.
Now a third enough is enough.
On brighter note we booked 2 holidays for next year and are away this weekend.
Yogagirl I have to stop myself thinking of my beloved oldest granddaughter or I will go made as missed all the milestones not seen her since she was 9 months old and now 5

Yogagirl Yes I have realised keeping quiet is the best policy but it is VERY hard. We should be able to express how we are feeling without being cut out. Unfortunately it doesn't always work like that. Best wishes to you.

flowers]