Tony Blair on leaving Europe

No need to lower the tone POGS by introducing Bliar into today's mix!

No matter what this war criminal, filthy-rich man has to say, I'm not listening

Glad I missed him POGS - he's a total hypocrite

What an irrational diatribe, Pogs. It's obvious that you don't like Blair and I don't like him either. Possibly we have different reasons for our dislike. Mine is based on his taking us into a war in which there have been no winners. You imply that his wealth has been derived from his support of the EU. In my opinion, it is more likely to be based on his popularity across the Atlantic. And BTW, do you include the sainted Margaret in the political elite who have caused so much trouble for us and gained so much personal wealth on the back of it?

Each to our own then Annodomini.

Well said POGS, I find TB sinister in the extreme.

Whenever I hear TB I remember my grandfathers advice to remember that politicians only lie when they speak (and he included most politicians of all parties in that)

But POGs is only criticising Blair! Quelle surprise, balanced as ever ! And do elegantly argued!

And Blair was never a socialist - and to be fair, never argued he was! Now how did Farage get £2m?

The Sainted Margaret who made so much money supporting Phillip Morris and the tobacco industry?? And dodgy deals all over the world, including her best friend Pinochet the Dictator?

Now I am not friend of Blair's, for the same reasons stated by Anno- but compared to MT, he is practically a saint.

I still feel sick whenever I hear that beautiful poem- where there is disharmony...'

I don't think we need to make this personal. I'm firmly on the left and I detest what Margaret Thatcher did to this country, but I detest TB equally because he took a political party and used it shamelessly for his own ambitions. Not to mention his other crimes already mentioned.

The thing about MT was she was what she was - a right wing Tory who made no pretence to be anything else. At least she wasn't a hypocrite. TB pretended to be whatever suited him at any one time. I stopped voting labour in 1997 when I saw which way things were going. I could never have imagined how bad it would actually get.

Well said, nightowl.

Why the constant comparisons with Margaret Thatcher. Has she become an excuse for every political wrongdoing?

Goodness me, what a confirmation some follow the poster but not the topic.

I have no idea why you have chosen your wording Granny Twice and made a personal attack but it I suppose it is your right to say it. Never saw it coming I must admit.

I suppose MT never pretended to be anything other than a Conservative whereas TB pretended to be a Socialist.

TB has the distinction of taking us into more wars than any other Prime Minister, Anno.

My DH thinks it was forward planning for when he left office and could then become a 'Peace Envoy'. But that would be a very cynical view of course.

Blair deliberately renamed the party as New Labour to distance it from Socialism. By no stretch of the imagination could he ever be described as a Socialist.

But he did take over a readymade socialist party. What's worse is that we let him.

Yes, he did, and he carried some of the old Labour brigade with him - perhaps they should have distanced themselves from him and his cohorts at the time, and made him call his party something completely different. New Democrats?

To be fair, he just had to do something after Michael Foot and co. Foot was a true socialist, but totally un-electable. So the party had to re-'brand' somehow. It is all very nice sitting on that pedestal- and in order to indluence things you have to be elected. And in order to finance education, social benefits, education and the NHS- you have to generate wealth- somehow. Very naïve to think otherwise.

We can really argue about the way it was done, and how the way was lost- but...

Now call me naïve, but I still believe he was misled about weapons of mass destruction in Irak by Bush and co. Had he not taken it seriously, and it had been found to be the case....?? As said, no fan of Blair, but ...

I know a few people who think like me and now espouse green party thinking, granjura, having voted socialist previously. Now they are trying even more to distance themselves from the unions, the very people that set them up in the first place, I certainly do not want to back them.
It seems to me that once Blair and his cronies had said they were relaxed about people earning lots of money, they were going away from their roots, and betraying their supporters. At least the Tories have never done that.

I agree- but how do you finance a fair a great public health system. education system, social welfare, etc- without tax coming in?
Foot and Benn were truly intelligent, but un-electable.

Brown trusted the bankers to make good money in a fair but business way, and pay their taxes fairly too. I'd say it is the bankers that failed by their greed- Brown never saw it coming because he is a good, honest man with a true Protestant work ethic. Had the bankers done what they were supposed to do- lots of money would have come in to support the other mentioned above.

Far too many backseat politicians around- who would all have known better, done better, been fairer- blablabla- from the comfort of their lounge or kitchen, and with the benefit oh hindsight.

Never said you do not pay taxes.The problem is that there are far too many who do not pay their share of taxes. They take money out of the country but do not put enough back in.
Brown, Foot and Benn all had the protestant work ethic. Unfortunately the party was hijacked by those who wanted to reward their friends and themselves, forgetting that building and manufacturing are what makes wealth be distributed more fairly, not making money out of money, which is what Blair does now.

www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2014/05/23/this-mornings-political-landscape-is-a-victory-for-the-cowardly-state/

Richard Murphy says it so much better.