to think the Idiot is wrong?

A friend of ours got into an awful mess by trying not to rock the boat or involve the authorities. When she separated from her husband she moved out of their council house with her daughter and left her son with his father. The Council decided she had made herself homeless and, after a lot of argument, gave her a nasty little flat in a not very salubrious area. All her furniture and belongings had been left with her husband who was living comfortably and collecting various benefits because the son had special needs. I can't tell you how much trouble she caused us for several years because of her "Not wanting to cause any trouble"

What about a bit of emotional black mail. Talk about the effects on the children of the families uncertain financial position and be honest about what it is costing you financially to have them living with you.

There comes a time when tough love is in everybody's best interests.

In fact, it has happened to several friends of ours, as well as relatives.

happened with relatives of ours- they had to pay for mortgage on the home, repairs, car, kids private education- for many many years as daughter didn't want to involve solicitors and wanted to be 'pleasant about it all' - in the end they just had to say enough is enough- and it was very hard but for the best in the longterm.

Kitty It is a problem when DDs need legal advice but refuse to take it. my DD's circumstances were different, she was seriously injured in a car accident, and was advised to make a claim for compensation. Her job means that she sees these ambulance chasing claim company adverts a lot and she initially refused to 'demean' herself by becoming a 'claimant'.

We worked on it gradually and in the end she permitted me to contact a firm of local solicitors who had a personal accident specialist, on her behalf and I accompanied her to her first appointment. Once we had got over the hurdle of the first visit she continued on her own.

Do you know why your DD doesn't want to contact a solicitor? Would she be happy to see a solicitor if you made the first contact and then accompanied her to the first appointment?

Agreed- your DD and children are so lucky they could move in with you- as you not only accomodate them, but help with the children and I imagine bear the financial cost of it all- he knows that and truly takes advantage of it all. But so does your daughter too, in a roundabout way, by not insisting on proper maintenance, access, etc, to be legally fixed. She must realise how much pressure this is putting on you, both of you.

I understand that your DD doesn't want to involve authorities yet but she needs to sort maintenance. He can't say this week you can have £x but next week you can only have £y. That's just him keeping control over your DD.

Fortunately we were able to form an escape committee for her and she is away from him and in a new and far better relationship. However we don't have sufficient reason to stop him seeing the children and he'd be the first to demand his legal rights.
Nothing would make me happier than to see him disappear from their lives but short of calling in the mafia I think we're stuck with him. As Mishap said 'if only we could choose their partners for them'.
Fingers crossed that tomorrow sees her home from hospital.
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I think it might help your daughter if she contacted Woman's Aid, they would be able to give her guidelines on things like overnight stays, and could discuss DV issues with her.

He sounds like a controlling bully, and that must be very difficult for her to cope with.

Thank you. I've been trying to contain my frustrations but kitty's remarks about unpredictable working hours and maintenance just opened a floodgate!

I wish we could just tell him to get lost but sadly can't. We've considered a solicitor's letter but unfortunately we don't think we can, as being arrogant and vile don't constitute a legal offence.

All being well she might just be home tomorrow.

What a plonker, mcem. Don't worry about his ridiculous chats with nobodies on facebook.
Hope your DD makes a good recovery and that you can all ignore him as far as possible.

What a difficult situation - I do feel for you. If only our DDs would let us choose their partners for them - the impotence that you must feel in the situation must be driving you nuts - it certainly would me.

Kitty I do absolutely understand what you're going through as our situation is almost identical - including the withholding of maintenance etc with the added stress that DD has spent nearly 6 weeks in hospital undergoing treatment and surgery.

This idiot has always been uncooperative about his working hours and availability. I suffered a week or two ago because I'm the one who has been primary carer for the wee ones and was trying to sort out their care. I said that I felt we had to plan a week in advance so that GP's and other caring relatives were clear about school runs etc.
Imagine how I felt when I was told he'd gone whining to Facebook complaining that I wouldn't allow him access. Replies from his 'friends' ( none of whom know me or the situation) made it clear I was an unsympathetic b****.

He chose the morning of my Dd's op to shout at me over the phone and point out that 'if anything happens to her remember that I'll be the one who decides who gets access to my children'.

I am truly thankful that the children esp GS have several good male role models to balance his cruel, misogynist and selfish attitudes.

Just because 'research' shows that contact with even a bad father is shown to be vital does not make it true, leastways not in every case.

Even if he is not physically abusive towards the children, he is verbally abusive about their mother and has been physically abusive towards her in front of them - very bad for them psychologically.

They are not old enough to state whether or not they want to see him, they are still very tiny and unless he treats them really well, lovingly and responsibly when they are with him and refrains from saying or doing anything at all about their mother in front of them then he is doing more harm than good.

You must be so worried about her, as well as the children. Perhaps it is time for her to be seen by a specialist rather than the GP- but walking on eggs, knowing you have to help, but unable to make any of the decisions must be so very hard. I wish I could say or do anything that might actually help ..... instead of just stupid words and internet flowers.

I love the thought of him as an unpredictable dog harri. None of us believe he would be violent with the children but I take all the points above.

The problem we have is that they are DD's children and he is her husband so all we can do is advise - as per usual. I suggested she shouldn't marry him and look what happened!

DH and I were talking about this last night and we think she needs to go back to the doctor and see about some alteration to her medication. She seems to be in a bit of a fog about most things at the moment.

I wouldn't leave children with a bully just so I could have a break from them. Isn't it in parent and grandparent's remit that they would go to any lengths to keep the children safe, bit like leaving your children with an unpredictable dog.

It doesn't sound like he wants to have the children overnight, anyway, so it's not likely he'll take proper care of them.
He sounds completely selfish and not someone who can be trusted so the less contact the DGC have with him, the better.
It can't possibly be true that children benefit from contact with their fathers, however bad they are. Listen to your DH and keep those kids away from that man abusive bully as much as possible.

(One thought - if this guy was a neighbour, would you or your DD ask him to babysit?)

What a difficult situation- but I must say I agree with Faye, thatbags and otehrs- they are far too young to stay with him in the current situation- I would not trust hime with them for long periods of time.

Just can't imagine what you are going through. DD2 has been in a similar situation with a similar man- but no children involved- so eventually she was able to just walk away (despite losing all her savings, etc...) and move on.

Thinking of you all

Will it really be a break letting him have the children overnight? Or will you all be restless wondering if they're ok?

I wouldn't leave any child of mine overnight with a man who had been violent towards me even if he was their father. I'd settle for short daytime visits, such as an afternoon here and there.

kitty bugger the break, I can't stress enough your daughter is making a huge mistake. Your GC are still very young, little more than babies, overnight stays with their father who is violent and they hardly see can't be in their best interests. How will your daughter feel if he treats her children in the same way. He really is a horrible man, doesn't seem the least bit interested in his children and I wouldn't trust him to care for them properly over night. I think the girlfriend is the least of your daughter's worries.

kitty, I think any research that shows children do better if they have contact with their father must be balanced against a wealth of research that shows how damaging it is for children to witness domestic violence. The effects on your DGC of seeing and hearing her mother being physically and verbally abused in this way really cannot be under-estimated. What a nightmare for you all [ flowers]

Fully understand the need for a break, kitty, but overnight stays with this person idiot could lead to a lot more stress for everyone.

Children of that age are a bit young for leaving overnight with anyone and if they were going to stay overnight I would want them to be with someone who wouldn't hesitate to call if they were unhappy or there was a problem. It doesn't sound as if you could trust the Idiot to do this.

I agree that contact with their father is important, but possibly not an awful lot of contact and your DD should be setting the ground rules.