This will cause a hoo ha !

Actually, definitely better.

But the real problem here is not really to smack or not to smack it is the lack of consistency revealed when the child asks what number the warning is. NanKate the talk you need to have with the boys' mum is why she isn't applying the 'one warning and then a sanction rule'. One of the things we were taught as trainee teachers was never threaten to do something you can't carry through, because children remember and your next threat will be ignored. It is hard work sometimes and you need real energy and commitment to carry things through. I don't think a smack would be any help in the long term. What might help is introducing 1 or 2 simple rules, for example "the living room is for quiet play or reading" and insisting that that is stuck to, sending a boy who charges in or begins to run about to another room or into the garden. Decide on the rules you want (not too many at first) and then insist on them together, making sure the boys understand what will happen. Good luck, it will be hard work but much more effective than a quick smack.

I don't agree - you should not be talking to your the boys' Mum. If she broaches the topic, then throw in any positive ideas that you have, but otherwise it is not really your place to be t4elling another grown adult how they should behave.

Even if they are staying with you and you are so stressed you consider smacking? Bury your feelings like that and they usually result in an outburst and argument, much better to discuss and express your feelings quietly.

As Trisher says, the question isn't whether or not to smack, but sounds to me more like being very cheeky, or insolent.
Most children go too far sometimes and need to be pulled up short.
Having been on my own for a while with 3 young children mine were all a bit out of hand when I met my current husband. He was great at discipling them. One of his methods was to write an essay on why it was wrong to do whatever it was that got them into trouble.
DD1 was cheeky sometimes and in her essay she wrote 'I'm too gobby and if I don't change I'll end up like Margaret Thatcher.'
They also had to earn their pocket money (by doing jobs etc.)

Thank goodness someone has had the common sense to point this out!

Pops it day don't ho with what it was to. I mean that some one gas pointed out that smacking your child is not illegal. I think if you were beating your child it would be !

Good grief predictive text? I mean Opps!

It is fine to state what is OK or not in your home, but not to criticise another adult's choices about how they discipline their children.

Advocating smacking is a rubbish argument. I never did nor has my daughter, neither did I shriek or shout. In my view if you resort to violence it is poor parenting.

..some one gas pointed out that smacking your child is not illegal. I think if you were beating your child it would be !

As is clearly explained in the text I posted, quoted from www.lawandparents.co.uk

my house my rules. Works with GC and a very annoying friend whose dog comes to stay a lot. His dog is not allowed on laps at home but he is in my house! The dog knows perfectly well where the parameters lie. Friend has surrendered and we have peace in my house. I also agree that punishment/sanctions whatever you want to call them should be enforced immediately after the transgression. Anything else is torture. How can you get a 5 yr old to understand that he/she wont be going to a party/swimming whatever later in the week for something they did 5 seconds ago? They do not have the mental capacity to associate the 'crime' with the 'punishment'. That is why sometimes (rarely in my experience) a sharp tap is way more effective than a long discussion. If a child pulls away from you when crossing the road, no amount of "you might get run over" will get through to them - how can they possibly know what you mean? I just think you have to have house rules and you have to stick to them thru thick and thin. tedious tho it may be.

What adult transgressions in your view will be prevented in future by a slap. None! So why on earth are the rules different for tiny children. When do you start slapping? 3 months? 1 year? 2 years? And when does it stop? Do you slap teenagers?

It is an absolutely ridiculous argument.

If your child is just about to poke a fork into an electrical socket, do you say,if you do that I will take your favourite toy away, or do you leap across the room and rap the knuckles so that the fork is dropped?

Hmm, I don't agree that a five year old doesn't have the capacity, as you put it, granarchist, to understand that the punishment for something they have just done will happen in the future. Minibags understood that concept perfectly when she was less than five years old when it was used to 'help her remember' not to draw on walls. She said she "forgot" that I'd been patiently telling her not to draw on walls and furniture ever since she first picked up a pen or crayon and did so at about eighteen months old. I had to think of something that would make her remember, something effective. I did so. It was depriving her of a much longed for treat that she expected but which was still in the future.

Nonsense you don't rap her knuckles you simply pull her arm away, with a firm No! Then a simple and short explanation for your reaction. How is that less effective than a slap?

I agree with annsixty , we reserve smacks for life threatening situations, running in the road , sticking that darn fork in the socket!!

In the 9 years we've had grandchildren we've used it once ..... For a running away in a car park, and one stern 'no' from Grampy for felt pen drawing on the table. Both were our eldest DGD now aged 9.

We don't smack, not because I don't believe in it - in the right place a small smack on the hand or on a well padded bottom might be necessary- but because we are consistent with our house rules.

There aren't many, they never change and we never threaten. The children 9,6,4 and 2 all know them . I watch their parents say things like ' if you do that again' for the 53rd time and I chuckle . The reason it's being said for the 53rd time is because they aren't consistent . They just want the path of least resistance. And I get that. It's exhausting raising children who constantly push the boundaries.

In our house, it's our rules. I gave up waiting for my DDs and SILs to discipline their children so now if a child misbehaves there's no threats , it's off to the naughty step where they stay till I fetch them ( unlike in their own home where the little ones make the rules ).

My DDs know how it works and at any time they could step in and do the necessary but that would mean getting up, stopping chatting or putting the phone down.

I don't chuckle when a parent is getting the discipline of my DGC wrong - I feel a bit sad.

In my eyes they are getting it wrong Luckygirl BUT having explained my rationale and demonstrated the success we have with it , at the end of the day they are adults . If they choose to get stressed by bad behaviour in their own homes there's nothing I can do about that.

I chuckle because I KNOW how it will go left to them and only one of us is getting stressed and it's not me. There are no raised voices from Grampy and I because generally our grandchildren behave well in our home and when out with us.

So I don't feel sad. Not everyone parents the same whether that's a good or bad thing.

thank god for Annsixty.
Had 5 children and only administered 2 slaps which had absolutely the required effect. Elder daughter couldn't walk but had strong arms and could balance well She scaled the sofa and then got on top of the bookcase behind it to retrieve my knitting needle ( hidden at the highest spot in the house).... scaled down and was just about to stick it in a socket when I saw her and slapped her She shrieked in amazement but never did it again Incidentally, she had previously managed to retrieve an apple core which she attempted to shove in same socket I hadn't caught her but witnessed the bits of mangled apple on the floor. To explain the niceties of electricity to a child of less than 1yo is not possible.
Case 2
Another child desired frozen goodies from chest freezer so dragged a bathroom stool into place to access it. Of course she denied it although her mouth was covered in chocolate. She got a swift tap too to foresall her falling in a chest freezer and all the inherent possibilities. last infringement there too

So we start slapping at less than a year?????!!!!!!!! widgeon That as far as I am concerned amounts to abuse.

How did my children or my daughters children survive I ask myself?

widgeon why not just get covers for sockets? and locks for freezer? Better than hitting a baby.

Why do they do this sticking a wire in a live socket!
DS1 did it at my parent's house, aged about 3. He even went to the trouble of straightening out the spiral hinge from a notebook then pushing it onto the element of an electric fire. Everything fused.
I can't remember how we re-acted, but he was frightened enough.
As for smacking, I think it has its place, but a small one.

I hope tnatis what I was trying to get across. I've never hit my C. They have never hit my GC Hitting is an awful thing to do. A tap to prevent somethind terrible happening is different thing altogether

Never hit my pets either.