Am I being Mean?

Charity begins at home! The war cry of the xenophobic

The people I know who spent time helping in the camps in Calais and Lesbos are the exact same people who have spent their lives doing youth work and working with people on the streets here "at home".

Anyone who claims that helping at home and abroad are mutually exclusive is missing the point.

Well, charity could begin at home and extend all round the world to those who need it if more of the money raised was directed there.

I think the point some posters are trying to make is that if £2,500 is raised for each trip, much of the money goes to these firms which have been set up to extract money from well-off, well-fed first worlders under the guise helping people in other parts of the world who are less well off or maybe starving.

£500 to the starving and needy, £2,000 going to providing fun and 'experience' to indulged first world youngsters.

Everyone I've met in RL who insists that 'charity begins at home' has gone on to make it clear that it begins at home and stays at home.

Why are you assuming that money raised in the UK needs to be used for charities in the UK Anya? I don't remember saying that and I do take strong exception to being called, in effect, a Little Englander. All my life I've disliked nationalism and lived almost half of my life out of the UK. You seem to be using your own prejudices to colour your reading of posts to twist them into what you want to read rather than what is actually there.

Jalima says it all for me!

The kids going on these trips are given approximately 10 months to raise funds in addition to getting themselves into a state of top physical and mental health to enable them to cope with the physical challenge of climbing to approx 6,000m and extreme temperatures.
The preparation involves climbing in the Peak District whilst wearing a 75 litre backpack filled with kit and sleeping under canvas in the depth of winter. I won't elaborate further but the training was relentless.
In addition to this they were at a stage in their lives where the were undertaking exams and the necessary work that involves.
So, in reality they had only a few months to raise funds. There is therefore no way a 16 year old can raise £2500 in donations from bag backing, car washing etc in such a limited time. As most struggle to raise £500, there is little point is saying they should stay in the U.K. and send the £2500 to the charity. They never raise that, it's the parents who pay, having made a choice that their child would benefit from the experience, some doing so at great sacrifice to themselves. And as parents, that's what we do.

Now, as for making reference to "indulged first world youngsters" I would like to tell you something of my "indulged first world youngster"....in addition to her training and studies she worked 3 evenings a week from 5pm to 10pm in our local Tesco and every penny she earned went straight into the charity pot for taking with her to hand over to the school in Tanzania. I can't imagine every 16 year old girl would be prepared to do that.

I would like to finish by saying, there is no need to make a donation to anything if you choose not to.....Simple!

It is I suppose a sort of "charity fatigue" that people can now only be attracted to raise money for a charity if it offers them some sort of dramatic, foreign challenge. It isn't enough to do a local walk or to do the Three Peaks challenge you have to go somewhere exotic and do something different. I'm not absolutely certain that a young person learns any more about survival if they are snowed in in Norway or in Scotland. I wonder what will happen when climbing Kilimanjaro or Cycling across Peru becomes just normal and everyday, what will the next great charity fundraisers be?

That's true, I know a couple of people who have been on several "once in a lifetime challenge"s .. at one point it was hitting at least one a year! It was clearly becoming just part of their hobby and I felt like asking them for some cash for my gym membership in return when they asked me to another "fund raising wine and nibbls night" .. but THAT would have been crazy and mean.. cause they did what they love doing in exotic locations FOR CHARITY

p.s. THANK GOD they all had children which put a stop to the annual "once in a lifetime" challenges.. I can go back to LIKING them now

trisher. I think you're making assumptions that people are only attracted to raise money if it offers some sort of dramatic challenge. In reality you have no way of knowing what these people go on to do for other home and foreign charities. Any effort made by a youngster to push the boundaries and do something that takes them out of their comfort zone and at the same time give something of themselves to help those less fortunate has to be a good thing.

Better watch out notanan their children will be coming round and wanting sponsorship soon.

Linsco56 charities would not go to the bother of organising and advertising these foreign trips if they didn't feel the need to do so because other things are not proving as lucrative as they once were. It's really nothing to do with what people do as well, or youngsters not pushing boundaries (which as I said could be done in a number of situations.) It is about competing and trying to offer something more glamorous and more exotic that other charities. It's really not judgemental simply a comment and a query when the exotic becomes every day what do you do next?

Better watch out notanan their children will be coming round and wanting sponsorship soon They already do , although one little girl of a friend of mine who used to take great pride in her shoeboxes did a bit of research and stopped, am quite proud of her for that, she now calls round much less frequently, she still does collect for certain things, but not EVERY think that the school send her home with a sponsor sheet for any more.

We need to stop using charity as an adjective. It doesn't mean "kindness". It's just a type buisness model, like plc or sole trader. We need to teach more kids to look beyond "it's charity" and be a bit discerning.

Climb down off your high horse Badenkate it wasn't you I was critisicing but another who was waving the 'charity begins at home' flag - which is all too often a way of saying they don't think we should give a helping hand to 'foreigners'.

I'm well aware that wasn't what you were suggesting.

Incidentally my acute dislike of this phrase doesn't come from 'prejudice' but from experience of hearing it from the mouth of cupboard racists on numerous occasions.

So, if we are supporting charities such as WaterAid, and/or sending money, clothes, blankets for refugees, donating every time there is a disaster, perhaps supporting a child through school in a 3rd world country, are we being 'mean' if we say 'no' to someone trying to raise money for a charity expedition when only one-fifth of the money will go to help the needy and the rest goes toward a youngster having the holiday of a lifetime?
Bearing in mind, of course, that, as linsco says, the parents (who must be well-off to be able to do so) contribute a proportion of the cost.

Does refusing to donate to that project mean one is being a little englander if one donates to the local scouts because the roof is falling in on their scout hut?
And every penny raised will go towards mending the roof?

I am going away to have a think.

Ps not getting on a high horse just an interesting point to muse while I carry on sorting out cupboards

whilst

Wish I could climb on a horse again! I used to ride at one time. Good fun.

I have never felt the same about real horses since I fell off Yg.

Right, I think the thing is you feel mean when you say 'no' so is that a form of emotional blackmail, ie 'we're doing this for charity'? So you may hand over £1 for them to pack the bags which some people can afford without thinking but others may not.

Walk to the door and just outside in the lobby is someone collecting for another charity or trying to persuade you to sign up to a direct debit for the Woodland Trust (can't get past them even when you say you do buy trees occasionally but don't want a monthly commitment), the Red Cross, or whatever. And someone collecting for a person who cannot get the groundbreaking treatment they need on the NHS.

Then you go outside and there is the lovely man selling 'Big Issue', smiling appealingly.

You need deep pockets to go to the supermarket,to walk through town these days.

I sometimes just smile and say 'I support the charities of my choice'.
Which I do.

I tried that Jalima, I told a chugger that I give to specific charities and he just said one more wouldn't make much difference.

We added up how much we would need a month after counting the adds for all the Give £3 a month charities on tv one night. Like someone said you would need deep pockets.

I fell off too after a car back fired, lucky for me we were still going round the paddock and I got straight back on so it didn't bother me. My son could not get the hang of the rising trot so he went swimming while I continues with my lesson. Each to his/her own. We used to go together on a Sunday morning.

I tell chuggers for charities I already support that they are will make me reconsider giving them money. After one said 'But this is my job' I suggested she looked for another. The chugging thing really offends me.

In addition to the traditional appeals there are now many crowd-funding appeals. All have a story behind the appeal and people can choose whether or not to contribute. I'd like to know how successful this method of raising money is, compared to collection boxes etc. Any one have any experience?

Nfk cheeky!!

I think there were a couple of threads on crowdfunding pensionpat

I think some charities can be unscrupulous if they think someone is an easy target. There is the sad case of elderly Olive Cooke who was a fundraiser all her life but then got targeted by many charities, bombarded with phone calls, junk mail etc and in the end took her own life because she could not cope with it all.

Thanks Jalima. Found the thread.