AIBU to be suspicious?

Siobhan Sharpe he will have a large company pension as he is at the top of the company pay scale for his role and has been employed 40+ years. Because I stepped back from my career to look after the children, keep house and work By the time I was inspired position to work at that level again things had moved on so much I took a different direction and the chance of promotion further long lost. I know that if I try to "talk to him" it will end in years(mine) and I will carry on as "normal". It's just that the last couple years there have been occasions (as posted upthread) where I began to feel uncomfortable and now I have found out about these accounts it has made me very nervous. My kids would be devastated if we divorce but I am losing myself and am frightened for the future either way. I think that there is some good advice and that I really do have to get some free legal advice. I posted as I thought there must be others out there who have spent their lives caring for husband's and kids and now find themselves in a similar situation and would have some ideas

I really feel for you. Some sound advice given above for you to contemplate. Most importantly get yourself a decent solicitor and try CAB, they can be really helpful.
I wish you well and oh stay where you are for now. ?

Property in the south are also expensive so don't know how I would afford to buy a home for myself and afford to run it !

I'm not the type of woman who lets the man deal with everything and thought we were a partnership. I always shared payment of household bills etc and clothed and shod the kids until they earned their own money. The things that make a home work (linens, soft furnishings, kitchen utensils, plates, cups, knives/fork/spoons etc etc birthdays and Christmas ) have been provided by me and replaced as necessary. Also some items of furniture have been purchased by me and I provided furniture when we first married as I had lived alone. He took on the bills some years back when my income was tied up (joint decision) for 7+ years. I was still expected to run my own vehicle and clothe the kids etc on what little was left. I have been made redundant 3 times and during periods of not working he never offered to help financially and fortunately I found p/t work quite quickly. He has in the last couple years bought himself a second car, a bike, joined a gym, had sporting weekends away. If I comment I'm told it's his money/inheritance. I can see his salary figure as have access to one account but cannot look into it in detail as he can see any activity and would query it. We sold a seaside property and that money was "put away" so I pushed to purchase another holiday property and was made suspicious when he looked at higher priced properties and said he didn't need a top up so had money I knew nothing about. He wanted this property in the kids names. He wants to change our wills so that his share of assets go to kids which again makes me worry as I have no inheritance coming my way and only have a share of joint assets (the house) & low income. My kids think he is just protecting his money from the "government getting it" and I only know because one of them let it slip that they had opened accounts last week. We have no sex life haven't for many years as he really wasn't interested and I gave up trying. I have tried to talk to him about how unhappy we are and just get told where the door is. I put up and shut up for the kids but am now becoming more and more resentful as I have to continue to work while he is planning holidays, trips etc for his retirement. I have no family to help me so would be on my own

When a bank or other company pay interest on a deposit account or similar, they notify the HMRC of the payments for tax purposes so it is impossible to hide it from them.

If the amount of interest indicates that a sum in excess of £10K may be deposited, the recipient is checked for Benefits against the DWP central computer and the HMRC Tax credits.

The only way you can hide money from the taxman is to put it under the bed. On the other hand, it is easy to hide money from a spouse/partner.

SiobhanSharpe, if the husband has opened up joint bank accounts with the children, upon his death the bank accounts could be put into just the children's names and that way the wife will not get any of that money. If a wife could prove that it was only the husband who put the money into the account, it is possible she could get a court to agree that it was not the child's money but that would set her up against her children. Either way, it is an awful strategy for a man to take with his wife and kids. Presumably he is trying to avoid inheritance tax but with no thought to the feelings of those involved. I think Tooyoungytobeagrandma needs to gather evidence and speak to a solicitor so that if she does go down the divorce route, she can make sure the courts know about all his income, savings and assets. Both parties could be asked by the court to fill in a declaration of income and assets with the court taking a dim view of those who seek to mislead it.

Hi OP -- I don't quite understand your statement that you suspect he is hiding money from you 'if anything should happen to him' -- as his wife (and as long as you stay married) you would probably inherit at least some of his estate if he predeceased you and died intestate unless you think he has made a will stating otherwise. Have you each made a will?
Or do you feel that he may be about to leave/start divorce proceedings and is hiding funds in anticipation of that?
(As for HMRC which a poster mentioned upthread I believe all taxpayers are now treated separately -- there is no longer joint assessment for married couples although a married person may claim their spouse's tax allowance as long as that spouse is not working . ) As you work you have your own tax allowance with tax collected through PAYE.
Is the same true of your husband - you say he will receive a company pension so is he too an employee paying tax via PAYE, deducted at source. OR -- is he actually self-employed/owns his own company? In that case he may have more opportunities for creative accounting and to hide income and assets.
Are your DC likely to know about the bank accounts? If so perhaps you could start by asking them what's it's about. I'm sure they wouldn't want you to be cheated out of your lawful share of the marital assets in the event of a divorce.

Violette I take my hat off to you for thinking of checking your ex husband's car with the spare keys.

Molly given the OP thinks he's hidden money with their children, surely in the circumstances described the best time for communication between the OP and her husband is once she knows more about the situation -and preferably between their solicitors? If there is something underhand going on, then raising the subject now could lead to him becoming suspicious and as holdingontometeeth say, he could move the money elsewhere.

The OP has said she wants to leave her husband, so she now needs to start thinking about herself.

Please get legal advice...my hubby is a retired lawyer and he would STRONGLY advice you not to leave the marital home as this will put you in weakened position.

Whatever happened to communication?

Are you very savvy about money? Is it a case of he always dealt with the finances as you had no interest or didn't understand investments etc? The answers to these could be the simple reason to you being left in the dark about the family financial matters.

Is he waged or self employed? If he is waged paying tax then where he invests the money is not squirreling from the tax man.

Do you have a lot of assets that would bring you over the inheritance threshold? If so maybe that is why money is being invested with your children.

There are so many scenarios here the easiest option would be to sit down and have a financial discussion with him with a view to future retirement. His reaction to this will be all telling and you will have a better idea whether he is trying to deceive you or not.

For one if you are such a low earner have you discussed with him, the legal, married couples allowance which can be backdated and bring you some extra money.

There are so may things that it could be you really should have a talk with him and or seek professional advice.

I don't think leaving the marital home prejudices your entitlement so I would leave if you want/can. However if you do leave it would make it harder to gather information about his assets.

Sorry to hear your situation ...its very hard ! Firstly, good advice on here ...before you do anything ,,consult CAB or a lawyer ...AND collate all the 'evidence' you can find ....paperwork, bank statements if you know where they are ...I assume from what you say you have separate accounts ?..if you can find them, his pay slips would show earnings and tax paid .......and since you are also a tax payer, do you do separate returns ? If not you could look for his ...unless he employs an accountant to do his ?...HMRC should also be able to show you the returns, but only if you are jointly taxed ....then you could compare declared income with actual income, less allowances (HMRC probably have a website where you can do some things anonymously).....but before you do anything, do not have a confrontation ,,just prepare everything ...preparation is the key ! If you try to open up the conversation he will immediately remove any trace of evidence of income, outgoings savings, etc !!....in my case I drove to the station my ex husband used to commute from, and with the spare key to his car, unlocked it and had a good hunt round ...I found details of a new bank account he had opened, various other things ! I kept all copies of various papers at work in my filing cabinet, and he never realised until he walked out that I had all this evidence. It served me well when the time came ...so I suggest as a first priority say nothing ...act normally.....and collate everything you can ! If he turns nasty and leaves, you can report your suspicions to HMRC ...unless it would implicate your children ! Good luck !

Good advice from Wilma.

I agree with don't leave the home and get legal advice as soon as you can. Explain to the solicitor that you think he has 'secret' accounts (and a court will order him to declare all his income). Also you should be entitled to a share of his pension as you are married. Do what is right for you. Life is too short to be unhappy x

I hope he is only trying to hide it from you as if he has done something dodgy and involved your children you could all be in for a lot of trouble at some point. If it was one of your children who told you about this you must speak to them for their own sakes. He may find of course than when he tries to get it back off the children there is some resistance as time will have moved on and so will their lives. There is a lot of talking needs doing before any kind of authority gets involved. Maybe he didn't tell you as he knew you would stop him. As you are alone a good bit what about turning the house over and seeing what turns up.

Don't leave the marital home until the divorce comes through if that is the way you wish to proceed.
Try speaking to him but if he is that secretive he will not give you the full picture.
If he becomes suspicious of your intentions he may even cash in his assets and move them elsewhere, perhaps in the name of a trusted relative or friend.
He could tell the court that he had spent the money foolishly.
Collect all the info you can, without telling him and present this to whichever professional you go to.
You must be aware of his bank account(s), examination of which over the past years will show up other accounts or shares etc to where he may have transferred money to or received money from.
You already know about ISA's.
Examination of these will show where the money had come from, whether from his bank account or elsewhere.
You could just bring it up in passing conversation with your children and ask innocently how are their ISA's doing.
There would be no reason for them to be suspicious and perhaps you may glean helpful information from the conversation, unless they are complicit in his actions.
A horrible thought but only you can decide what you believe.
I have only mentioned that because it has been raised previously, but there was no indication of this in your OP.
I hope that you attain the result that you seek.
Meanness in a relationship is a detestable trait.
The lady who admitted to stealing from her two drunken husbands has my admiration.
My mother did the same with her spouse.
He fathered three of us but always kept her short of money whilst he was Mr. Popular in the local hostelries due to the amount of alcohol he could consume.
She used to take a few pounds out of his pocket whilst he was in a drunken slumber on Thursday and Friday nights.

Talk your concerns over at the CAB or with a solicitor recommend by them who will give you a free half hour.
For a start search the .go.uk website to get all the relevant information you need. for examplehttps://www.gov.uk/savings-for-children
Savings for children do not pay tax.

Usually when people retire they take financial advice as well as taking action to do up the house etc. If you are suggesting that this is the moment to divorce your husband then work this out with a solicitor who is competent.

Good luck.

There was a much publicised court case not that long ago where two husbands were accused of misleading the court and hiding assets to avoid them being taken into account in a divorce settlement. The judgement was expected to result in thousands of cases coming back to the courts where the ex-wife thought her husband misled the court and had money/assets hidden.

I remember reading at the time that this happens a lot where the husband is earning a lot more than their wives, particularly when any children are grown up.

So OP I think you're right to be suspicious. I also think if he was being straight with you, you would have ISAs in your own name and probably a private pension fund too, both of which are tax efficient options.

Often when someone comes on here and is thinking of leaving their husband, they're advised to start saving up money as a kind of 'getaway fund'. In your case you need legal advice before doing anything. The more information you can give your adviser the better, so if you can, start copying anything like bank statements or anything else that shows income. Do your children think you knew about the money they are keeping for their father? Tread carefully there. Good luck.

On the basis that you don't know where this money is going, then it would not seem to be unreasonable that he his hiding it for his own reasons. You do need legal advice, I would try to get evidence, eg. wage slips, bank statements, perhaps talk to your children about these accounts he seems to have opened with them? I would think that you must be entitled to 50% of any assets and that would include pensions, property etc. But the more you can prove what is coming into the house the more likely you are to be able to get your entitlement. I would not leave, but get legal advice first then decide what action you want to take, if any.

Most solicitors have a 'first half hour free' service. Take advantage of this. It might also be worth googling 'forensic accountants' their job is to find 'hidden assets' The solicitor should be able to recommend one, I believe they are common practice in divorce/separation nowadays.

Most important take care of yourself, put yourself first - sending hugs ???

Agree with most of posts, don’t leave the home and get legal advise ASAP. You don’t mention that you love him anymore and you say that you want to leave ( him not the home !)
If he has never been open with discussions it’s difficult to start now, but do attempt to so that you can tell a solicitor if he refuses or is evasive, at least you tried. I openly admit that I stole from both of my exes I had no choice with 3 children to care for. My 1st was so mean and controlling financially even his own mother named him Scrooge or Shylock ! My 2nd was the opposite, cleaned my bank account out and spent every single penny we had, even sold my car and kept the money. Both liked to drink, so I had to wait till they slept then pinch £20 notes. If either of them thought they had spent the cash on alcohol, they must have thought that was fine as neither ever mentioned money missing. But, money for basic food and clothing was clearly me being demanding ! Please take control of this as I had to and find out as much as you can about his situation. I wish you luck and start planning your future as an independent woman ?

Get a good divorce solicitor one who if he refuses to cooperate will freeze his assets-that usually makes them deal!

Maybe he is using their ISA allowance? If so why isn't he using yours.

I think you are feeling how many of us retired women feel. We gave up our careers to look after the children, employment laws were against us and it has left us dependent on husbands. We must welcome the change for the new generation of women but they still don't get equal pay whatever the law says.

In 1970 I was working as a nurse in the medical at Fords, Dagenham when the small group of women who made the seat covers came out on strike after being down graded. With the help of Barbara Castle they started a change in women's employment law but still today it is not equal pay. See the film Made in Dagenham. I was paid well on the Whitley council scale but after seeing the film I wondered how much the male nurse was paid.

Sorry that is deviation.

www.citizensadvice.org.uk/family/ending-a-relationship/
This link should provide a lot of useful information.
Are you on good terms with your children? If so, perhaps you might like to ask them about these accounts? I wonder how you found out about them. You said about this”latest idea” which suggests you have maybe other reasons to be suspicious. Is it just about money?
My DH is fairly secretive about money, although we have a joint account for household expenses to which we both contribute, but otherwise we each have our own money we can do what we like with. It works for us.
Yes, you could go to a solicitor or CAB but in either case I suggest you need to know what it is you want to know, to make best use of the time.
Or are you at a stage where Relate might be useful? They don’t just exist to help patch up a marriage, but they can help you to determine what it is you really want, and help you take steps to achieve it.
I hope you get some clarity on this. All the best.

Hello TooYoung

There are quite a few posts similar to yours on mumsnet with good advice on so might be worth a look or even for you to post on there for up to date advice.

This sounds like a difficult situation - if it's true that he is keeping money from you this might be considered financial abuse - is he controlling in other ways?

Perhaps take a look at the womensaid website for more info too.

I'm assuming he has separate bank accounts? Is he open to discussion about it or do you feel he wouldn't tell you the truth anyway? What do your dc think of whats happening?

I'm not a solicitor of course but with a long marriage like yours and your earning capacity being compromised by you taking responsibility for the home and children I'd assume you'd be entitled to 50% of the house, any savings and his pension.