Moaning Leavers, an explanation

As an ardent Leaver, I don't envy the PM her job- she's on a hiding to nothing...with such a tiny majority, the whole issue's far from settled. Meanwhile the Remainers are opposed full stop, the Leavers feel it's all too softly softly, and then there's the EEC themselves constraining what she can get. Am totally bored with whole thing, rather disappointed in TM (if only we bould have had Farage...)

MargaretX
^The EU has bound Germany in a far greater union as everyone feared that it would become too powerful again
73 years peace in Europe^

You have failed to recognise that Germany is achieving by stealth what it could not achieve by war, that is European Federalisation with Germany (as the strongest economy) calling the shots.
Who was it who attempted to impose immigration quotas on other countries, some rejected these proposals but one wonders how long it will be before Germany starts dictating sanctions.

Life expectancy is going down now in many parts of the UK so the idea that “everyone is living longer” should be reconsidered www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/life-expectancy-uk-plumments-ons-data-hartlepool-torridge-amber-valley-barnsley-a8164171.html%3famp#ampf=undefined

I realise there were a lot of leavers who started from their own emotional feelings about the EU.

BUT from the moment that those buses started to appear on the TV screens there should have been warning bells ringing in their ears.
Now it is too late, we in the EU will carry on being friendly with our neighbours travelling freely to and fro and working together on scientific and social projects.

The EU has bound Germany in a far greater union as everyone feared that it would become too powerful again
73 years peace in Europe.

As to the NHS it functioned well when most people died 3 years after retirement but now most live on for years and you can't blame the EU for that.

The topic is about people moaning about the length of time it is taking to leave Brexit. ( we should have all realised it wasn’t a quick fix ,shouldn’t we!)
Not about actually leaving.
All we hear from Brexiteers is just - get on with it-
What do you think they are doing.?
Brexit has been likened to a Divorce by many people, & we all know how long & messy Divorces can be !

I agree JenniferEccles ??

I think there must be a misprint in the title of this thread.

From what I have heard and read since we voted to leave the EU, I am perfectly certain that the word 'moaning' belongs with the Remainers.

Leading disability activists have backed The Independent’s call for a referendum on the final Brexit deal, as the number of people signing the Final Say petition surged past 600,000.

With the prospect of a no-deal Brexit looming, groups representing disabled people have joined a variety of politicians and organisations in supporting the case for a public decision on the final deal.

In an open letter to The Independent, disability campaigners, including former Olympic star Tanni Grey-Thompson and a string of leading academics, warn that the “chaotic, uncertain and discordant” atmosphere surrounding the Brexit negotiations could be “psychologically damaging” for disabled people.

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/final-say-brexit-disability-disabled-nodeal-independent-a8486021.html

So I see ??

poppyred Varian is incapable of ‘giving it a rest’
Unfortunately.

Here are some brexitregrets from almost a year ago. I wonder how many more there are now.

"We were lied to during the campaign’ Had I known the truth I would have voted Remain. I am very angry that politicians seem able to lie at will to get what they want with no repercussions. It is increasingly clear that Brexit will benefit only a few of the super rich and most of us will be worse off. I am sure that the result would have been very different had we known the reality of the effect of Brexit on the majority of the country"....

"I voted for Brexit, but we were misled. We need to stay in the customs union and single market. MPs are being dishonest by not revealing how catastrophic a “hard Brexit” would be. They seem more concerned by their own futures that that of the country. "

www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/oct/11/we-were-lied-to-voters-who-have-changed-their-mind-on-brexit

Quite so - and exactly why we should have a second referendum.

Sorry for the typo.."large swathes"

I think all those who are now cross it is taking so long! Many on the day after the referendum felt we were "out" and were surprised to discover it actually had to be negotiated!

Do you really think everyone who voted, for or against leaving, knew how complicated it was to extricate UK from Europe ? I don't think so!

PECS
Large seathes of the voting public were conned into thinking it would be as easy as cancelling a standing order and we'd be back to the 1950s.

Can you define. who were the large swaithe. It cant be those who voted to leave as this swaithe understand that there will be bumps along the road and are looking to the future not backwards.

I just find it staggering that the government, leaving aside Cameron's debacle of a referendum, did not really have a plan. I know DC thought the outcome would be remain ...but really? If anyone had thought it through more thoroughly and prepared for various options the uncertainty that small businesses and farmers etc etc are facing might have been reduced. Large seathes of the voting public were conned into thinking it would be as easy as cancelling a standing order and we'd be back to the 1950s.

The benefits of being in the largest free trade bloc in the world have been peace in Europe, better , fresher and cheaper food and high quality manufactured goods, which is why our government are faffing around trying to hold onto as much of those benefits as possible. I’m sure most of the population enjoyed some of the benefits. Not sure when the benefits (?) of Brexit will be evident though.

Brexit myth that “we are the only country that follows the rules”.

crystaltips
Their rules are the same for all members. If someone doesn’t want to abide by the rules they won't have the benefits
I think the UK is the only country in the EU who has consistently played by the rules and this is why many feel badly done by. The majority countries manipulate or ignore the directives as they feel fit.

There are no benefits as far as I and 53% of the british electorate - so give it a rest now Ppleassse .....

Blame the EU for our government’s ineptitude. The EUs position has been in clear from day1. Their rules are the same for all members. If someone doesn’t want to abide by the rules they won’t have the benefits. Simples. Except we were told we could still have the benefits but not have the rules. It was never going to happen.

Was it arrogance in assuming that no one would want to leave this wonderful institution? ???? ??????

True, varian

But, discussing this with DH this evening, I asked why the EU did not have a strategy or even just guidelines set up in case one member did decide they wanted to leave?
Was it arrogance in assuming that no-one would ever want to leave this wonderful institution?

They are all floundering.

You are right luckygirl . It was ridiculous to invoke Article 50 when Theresa May had not even got a brexit strategy agreed in her own party.

Ridiculous and unnecessary, as were her stupid "red lines". Two years later there is still no agreement within the Tory Party, let alone within Parliament so how can we possibly hope that the other 27 countries in the EU could ever even start to negotiate with a country which does not even know what it wants?

Luckygirl
Corbyn wanted article 50 to be invoked immediately after the referendum.(He did change his mind later). That would have been a bit silly even to Leavers.

The speed referred to in the OP has been totally necessitated by TM's ridiculous faux pas in setting a leave date so early in the proceedings. Silly woman.