Should brothels be legalised?

I know a few girls who have worked in the "lighter" end of sex work.

The type who "chose" it
They all did it for financial reasons. None of them had a preference for a career in sex work.

Had other financially viable options been available to those girls at those times then all but one of them would not have chosen sex work! (The one who did truly chose sex work had other job options but was extremely highly paid in her line of sex work) The others were in difficult financial situations (one escaping a chaotic home life, another newly separated single mum etc)

Welfare, education and other options would have kept them out of sex work.

I'm not sure that I am entirely convinced re the concept of the "happy hooker"

Mabon you clearly don't know what NIMBY means!

Maryeliza clearly doesn't want legalized brothels in anyone's backyard. And I agree with her.

You are a nimby clearly Maryeliza54!!

Skweek and her DS are living in a society where it is expected that men have sexual access to women. Until that changes, the dynamics of prostitution won't change. And the worst kinds of brothels will remain popular. We ALL have to change from the top down in order to make things better for sex workers.

Many women are in her DSs situation and many women don't find sexual partners until relatively late in life but women don't tend to feel OWED sex from the opposite sex and don't generally seek alternative routes to it where they have not yet attracted a sexual partner through mutual attraction.

Skweek, do you know any mothers of mentally and physically disabled females who would support, encourage or arrange for their daughters to be "serviced" by male sex workers if it was taking some time for her to find a boyfriend?

No?
Why do you think that is?

We all I think have a role to play. How we speak differently to and about sex to male and female young people etc..

Prostitution doesn't exist in a vacuum. It is PART of society. A symptom of the whole. Reactive solutions such as a few legalised brothels in bigger towns won't improve things for sex workers.

Addressing poverty, porn culture and social attitudes will

Many years ago, a senior colleague and a father of 3, was arrested for 'street crawling' ie, looking for prostitutes. His case hit the local paper headlines. What happened at work? He was moved to another branch with promotion.

Slight digression, I was glad the only lap dancing club in my neck of the woods was forced to close recently due to local residents' pressure, I believe the council revoked their licence. It was situated in a high street and allegedly late night Fridays and Saturdays weren't pleasant. I would like to think that girls who choose to work in such establishments do so of their own volition and without pressure. I don't like to seeing a lap dancing club in a high street where women and children will be passing by constantly, there is a girls school fairly near where this former club was sited. As we know some such establishments have a tacit policy to offer "extras" on the side. I hate the term "Gentlemens' lounge/club" it makes my skin crawl, " gentlemen" seems to be a euphemism for men who want to frequent such a smirky set up where the women are there to be grabbed and groped and generally leered at, which I suppose sums up a lap dancing club. I find them demeaning. I don't know what others feel about such places being on the high street.

The law needs to focus solely on the "purchaser" IMO.

But to really nip it in the bud I think that you gotta start with the porn industry. I dont mean banning porn but ease of access and classifications etc.

I agree that legalised brothels would not reduce illegal prostitution.

The kind of men that like to abuse vulnerable prostitutes won't suddenly change their sexual preferences and go to nice clean "vanilla" brothels!

They LIKE the dirty anything goes abusive hovels with trafficked and underage girls.

They like the vulnerable pregnant sick addict prostitutes that they can abuse.

In fact a sex work support worker I knew told me that the sicker looking street workers were more in demand than the healthy girls and made more money for pimps. I also heard a story from a nurse, won't go into the details, where a very visibly injured prostitute reported to her that she made more money that way!

Greer spoke sense (in the old days anyway). Women underestimate how much men can hate them. Dont overrestimate men who frequent brothels: I do not believe that the type who visit vulnerable girls now would actually WANT to switch to regulated brothels with healthy assertive girls. The exact same amount of illegal prostitution would continue.

Good point GrandtantJE65

inishowen it was harrowing but actually I thought it manged to portray the violence involved quite well. It didn't glamorise it, wasn't too graphic but made you very aware how dreadfully the girls are treated.

The arguments for legalising brothels are, as far as I know, that it makes it easier for the madam to call the police if a client becomes obstreperous, that the public health authorities can demand that the prostitutes are regularly examined for sexually transferred diseases and that both the women working as prostitutes and the madam would have to pay income tax.

I know that the Netherlands are re-considering the idea, but I still feel that the women working in legal brothels are better off than those working in countries where prostitution is illegal.

Sweden brought in a law some years ago now that made it possible to fine the men who used prostitutes. Unfortunately, it has not solved the problem, as the working girls pick up a pizza and "are just delivering it" to the man who called them!

Here in Denmark, where brothels are illegal, the expensive women work in high-end hotels or night-clubs, the majority work on the streets and have little or no protection, and the poor girls who have been trafficked from Asia, Romania or wherever are mainly forced to live in appalling conditions in illegal brothels and are being held as slaves.

Legalising brothels probably won't do these poor girls one jot of good, but it might mean that the police could concentrate on finding the illegal brothels and that the licensed establishments would rarely need to occupy police or court time.

I haven't managed to watch that programme. When the pimp said he was going to teach her a lesson I turned it off. So harrowing.

stella1949 I think it's interesting that there are legalised brothels in Australia. Do you know anything about people trafficking in your country and how this has been affected?

I agree with maddyone - that men who pay for sex should be prosecuted. Skweek1, what you write is sad, but surely there must be better ways for your DS to meet someone? I note (from a quick online search) that there seems to be a range of different groups which offer opportunities to meet socially, to people with a range of disabilities.

I believe that there is a place for well-regulated brothels, where the girls are protected, kept healthy and where men who are unable, for whatever reason, to find their physical needs met by just finding the right wife or gf, to get help without exploitation on either side. DS has phyical and mental issues and although he is anxious to find the right girl was over 30 and still not found anyone, eventually went to the local brothel where he met a girl who he grew to like and care for, but sadly she cost him a pretty penny, which he realised, but it did hurt him. He's still looking for the girl who will love him for himself, but where can he find that young lady?

I think this is a really interesting thread - thanks for starting it trisher. Re vested interests- men in power can generally get away with anything they want to if they want to so I doubt they care about whether the law is changed or not as it won’t affect their access to ‘sexual sevices’ if they require such services. The explanation might just be sexism - mainly an issue where women suffer/are exploited in the service of or to be used as men see fit is not taken seriously. Just think how long it took to take domestic violence including rape in marriage seriously. As for coming up with a system that would work and keep women safe- would anyone on here in a million years want their dd or dgd to be a prostitute( safely or not)

Thanks t everyone who has commented. I think the one thing we all agree on is that the law at present isn't right and isn't doing the job it should do-that is protecting women and girls. We diverge on how best to tackle this. I do wonder. Remembering the disclosures some time ago of a woman called (I think) Cynthia who provided services to high up men, is it possible that the men in power who use such services are reluctant to make it an offence to buy sex?

I don’t really know whether we should have legalised brothels, I have a foot in both camps. Greyduster, I agree with you that legalised brothels would at least provide the ladies with a safe place to practice their business, but I also agree with Maryeliza that legalised brothels normalise the sexual exploitation of women.

I do think that women should not be prosecuted for prostitution, I think the men should be prosecuted for using them.

It’s a difficult subject.

EllanVannin ... the need is there as there are so many vile perverted men on our planet who have no conscience whatsoever. Any decent man would not even entertain these establishments. They know these girls are young, vulnerable, controlled, drugged and threatened ... and they just don’t care as long as they can have sex. My friend worked for a refuge for trafficked girls and it nearly destroyed her, seeing the misery these poor girls have to live thro. Many are kidnapped, beaten, drugged and threatened that if they don’t comply, or if they run away, their families will be slaughtered. This entire scenario makes decent people sick to their stomachs, it’s heartbreaking that another human being would do this to another, without a care or concern for the distress. We struggle to apply logic to it all, but sadly greed and perversion takes over for these monsters ... the people who control these girls plus the men who use them, they all need stringing up !!

Indeed M0nica.

Amsterdam's red light district is now being gentrified.

Why the need for these places anyway ??

I'm with maryeliza on this issue, no to legalisation and no to brothels.
You don't need to be a feminist to accept that the majority (if not all) sex workers, male and female, are exploited and damaged by the work they do. Sanitising it by some form of legalisation in brothels makes no difference to that.

Why do so many men buy sex? This is a genuine question. You sometimes read that men buy sexual practices that their wives or partners won't consent to. That isn't a reason to go out and pay someone, is it?

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Brothels are legal where I live ( Australia). There is one in my area - they are often built in industrial areas and that is where our local one is. It looks just like any other commercial building, but inside it's very ritzy ! I know because they had an "open day" when they first started business there, and they encouraged visitors to walk around and ask questions . The sex workers are employed under good conditions and their health is cared for by the owner.

Obviously no system of prostitution is perfect, but these licenced premises seem to be a good option for men and women who choose to work in this business.

M0nica This is exactly what I was saying, regarding the China town and Soho raids, obviously criminals try to set these Massage Parlors up with trafficked girls but the Police very soon crack down on them.
Also the Wales online heading was a bit sensationalist, as when you read what was actually going on, the arrested people were flying in Polish prostitutes.
Quite different from trafficking innocent girls and then enslaving them for sex.