To be stressed by climate change

I would bet she didn’t Pamela

And yes, soap, any soap, will last much longer than shower gel. There is the plus side though that plastic bottles, water or shower gel bottles, are recyclable.

March and protest by all means, it’s one of the ways that our voices are heard. But stopping innocent people from going/getting to work, is plain wrong. People have mortgages or rent to pay, they have to put food on the table for their children, and they have to meet all the other financial obligations of running a home. Most people who live in London are not the rich, they are ordinary nurses, doctors, police, shop assistants, hairdressers, office workers etc etc. They should not be penalised because a group of people chose to demonstrate by blocking the routes of these ordinary people who were simply trying to go to work last week.

It’s a shame that the media probably wouldn’t give the same sort of coverage to the protesters if it didn’t cause a lot of aggravation.

A bar of Neals yard soap or a cheaper make will last much longer than a bottle of liquid soap. Maybe the soap is cheaper in the end?
It could well be, Pamela, but first the parents who are trying their best for their children on an extremely limited budget, as mentioned on other threads, may have to be persuaded that this is more economical than going to the £1 shop or eg Wilko's in their efforts to make sure their children are clean and cared for.

Some if this is rather like the 'Overheard in Waitrose' on FB.

"Why don't the poor buy Neals's Yard Products? Don't they realise they are destroying the earth with their selfish purchases of cheap products containing palm oil"?

No, it is the companies that need to be targeted.

I am sick of hearing about all these young activists bursting into tears every time someone says boo to them. Not to mention all the young people busily demonstrating before they head to Heathrow for their weekend flight to Barcelona or wherever. And don’t get me started on Emma Thompson......

And I’m sick of reading grumpy Old Bats complaining about those who have conviction and are passionate about their cause and get off their backsides to do something about it.

It’s not just young people protesting and WTF are you on about assuming these people are jetting off on holiday?

Very much a case of ‘don’t let the truth get in the way of a good moan’.

Callistemon, I did also point out that cheaper brands are available. You don’t have to go to Neals Yard but it is difficult to truly ascertain that a product is free from palm oil.

One of my daughters lives and works in London. She and her boyfriend walked on Waterloo Bridge, her comment was that commuters could walk and cycle through so getting to work was no problem. The bridge was full of happy, chatting, singing people, it was peaceful and the air was unpolluted. 'How it should be', she said. What is the problem with the UK mindset that says we must build more and more roads and fill them with cars and lorries.

Thanks Pamela
Now, I will have to find out about my favourite soap, certainly not the cheapest but affordable from TK Maxx (hope that is not an advert).

Apparently
No, none of our products contain palm oil, although some of our products contain sodium palmate which is derived from sustainable palm oil. We are committed to using only palm oil derivatives that come from sustainable sources. We work continuously with our suppliers to ensure that only RSPO (Roundtable on Sustainable Palm Oil) raw materials are used in our products.

So there is a difference which would seem to be important. I think someone has started another thread about this.

No, I don't think you are being unreasonable, but getting stressed won't help, taking action might - so do all you reasonably can, and don't forget dietary changes, because there have been a lot of studies and articles recently explaining the part that farming animals for food has played and is still playing in this serious issue. Some sources put the contribution of animal agriculture to climate changing emissions higher than the transport sector.

I read recently that we need upwards of a trillion more trees to sequester all the excess carbon dioxide we've chucked into the atmosphere over the past 50 years, so we should all definitely get planting - either in our own gardens or via organisations like The Woodland Trust.

I think I am doing all I can at the moment, being vegan, saving energy, sourcing my electricity for a supplier that uses only renewables, hardly ever travelling by car, even more seldom by plane, recycling everything possible, composting all organic matter, keeping a wildlife friendly garden, never using garden poisons, being as economical as possible with water, buying eco -friendly and vegan detergents, toiletries etc. - but I am learning all the time about what else I could do and embracing it all willingly. The current trend seems to be plastic reduction, so I'm taking that on board too as much as I think I can. I often go out picking up litter - it could blow anywhere and all of it could injure wildlife.

It has been estimated that we could feed many more people than we currently do if everyone ate a plant-based diet - we already grow enough food, but most of it gets put through factory farmed animals first, at great cost to the planet. Perhaps we would plant more woodland if there were no animal farms. I can hope!

I am not convinced so much by the over population argument - I think it's over consumption that is more problematical - people in subsistence, rural Africa, even if they have large families, do not impact upon this earth in anything like the same heavy fashion as a family of 4 in this country. We also have to sort out world poverty if we want people to limit their family size - children are still an insurance for old age in many cultures that have no welfare system in place.

In rich countries, lifestyles count for a great deal, negatively in the main. We can't wave a magic wand, but we can all try our best not to be a larger part of the problem than we need be.

Anja:

" And I’m sick of reading grumpy Old Bats complaining about those who have conviction and are passionate about their cause and get off their backsides to do something about it."

Hear!Hear! Anja!

I hope you both got off your backsides and joined the protest!

Those who could not or did not want to can only do our best in other ways, one of them by not travelling there.

An interesting and well-informed post, MaudLillian.

people in subsistence, rural Africa, even if they have large families, do not impact upon this earth in anything like the same heavy fashion as a family of 4 in this country.

I once read that the average pet dog in the West has the carbon footprint of two people in the poorest countries.

Careful, Maggiemaybe - it's very dangerous saying anything on Gransnet that could even remotely be considered anti-dog

I once read that the average pet dog in the West has the carbon footprint of two people in the poorest countries.
Yes, I read that somewhere too - we don't have a dog now but I wonder if it will be one of the things frowned on in the near future?

I am afraid it will , Callistemon. I consider my dog to be my luxury, and luxuries will be things of the past for most people.

It won't be. The Brits have always kept dogs and will continue to do so until the end of the human race. Many folk in the poorest regions of the third worlds must have a carbon footprint of practically nil. Let me think, what's twice nil?

I agree, Alexa. Dogs used to be fed on household scraps - now they have a choice of 239 different items in the dog food section of one major supermarket.

After shouting at us all about not caring about the future of the planet/our grandchildren, Gonegirl, your attitude’s a bit puzzling.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.theverge.com/platform/amp/2017/8/4/16094674/cats-dogs-meat-diet-greenhouse-gases-climate-change

I have an old, much loved cat myself. I shall think very carefully though about whether I should get another. We have to face facts really, don’t we?

Eating less meat and dairy is the one thing individuals can do to cut down human impact on the planet.

Rats are said to be intelligent pets. I cannot keep any small furry as my dog is a lurcher.

Gonegirl:

"Many folk in the poorest regions of the third worlds must have a carbon footprint of practically nil."

I think of that as my own default standard. The thought actually does encourage me to cut down.

maggiemaybe - I have not shouted. Surely I can use capital letters to highlight a point without it having to mean "shouting". Do we really all have to follow some newly invented internet code?

Getting rid of polluting transport, especially cars and aeroplanes is the most important thing. Not doing without dogs!

(Not that I've got a dog, but you've got to keep it sensible)