Is it becoming impossible for some older people to manage their affairs independently?

I'm 83 and it's not getting any easier. I really struggled this year with having to do my car and house insurance online, then dowload the paperwork etc. I can do it, but hate it.

muse

MOnica
I would immediately be on to my local council, or local newspaper/radio to point out the absurdity of not having a return address on the form.

I'm presuming the forms are sent out from one central place (Electoral Commission Office) making it impossible to give an individual return council address . There are 100s of councils.

This link I've posted does work to enable someone to find the address needed.

Simply not true. Ring your local council, receive forms and return envelope.

I think many people, not just elderly, like to use cheques and many organisations find that their members pay fees by cheque too.

Life could become very difficult if people don't want a computer or perhaps don't want to do online banking.

Thank you all for your helpful and sympathetic comments. petunia your father's situation is quite common. Also, people with neurological conditions, like Parkinsons, may find it impossible to use phones with touchscreens, so that rules out smartphones, and others just don't feel save carrying the key to all their financial details in their pocket or handbag.
Providers are just interested in cutting costs rather than the reality of people's circumstances.

muse All electoral matters are dealt with by local councils.

To confirm that I have just had a look at my polling card for next months elections and it is sent out by The Local Returning Officer(LRO) and includes his address, which is the local council offices . It includes information on postal voting which makes it clear that all applications have to be returned to the LRO.

So the OP, and anyone else can complain to their local council, or local newspaper or radio with confdence that they are going to the right place.

In general, I think that if people don't want to manage things in the way that works for the majority, they should bear the cost of being out of step. I don't think that people who simply 'don't want to' get on board with technology should push up the price for the rest of us when councils, retailers or whatever have to provide alternative ways of paying bills etc.

However, I think that there should be exceptions for people who are genuinely unable to access the internet, such as the very old, the disabled etc. This is particularly important when it comes to voting - it would be unconscionable if people were unable to vote because of lack of access to technology. I know that usually it is possible to vote in person, but the fact that many people might be uneasy about going out in a pandemic means that there has to be an alternative way of voting that is accessible to everyone.

So in answer to the OP's question, I do think it is unreasonable for individuals to expect to do everything to suit themselves, but I also think that there should be some exceptions, and that this is particularly important when it comes to fundamentals such as voting.

my postal vote came through today

I think it is a huge worry.

I have a brother who is almost 70 but who just cannot cope with computers. As one example, he hasn't changed his energy provider since they moved to their current house. He is loath to let me investigate cheaper providers for him because he is very private. I worry about how he will cope if he lives another 20 years.

Our village library runs help sessions for older people struggling with 'new technology'.

It's not just elderly people that get caught out by so much business being done online.
My son (36) recently arranged to view a house, for sale through Purple Bricks, via email.
He went at the appointed time but no agent was there. The house owner said they'd already accepted an offer so had cancelled that day's viewings via the app.
My son hadn't downloaded the app so didn't know. He assumed the agent would have contacted him via email, obviously not the case.
He'd had a wasted trip and wasn't very happy ?

It's not only older people, who struggle. I used to run IT classes for parents, who lacked IT skills and were trying to get a job.
My colleagues cursed me, when one very difficult parent discovered word processing. She used to type very long epistles, full of her latest complaints. The bit which really irritated them, was the plethora of graphics they contained. ( My fault too!).

i tried to get a postal vote.
but you have to download a form and fill it in by hand and send off to apply.
i don't have a printer. and only an intermittent second-hand laptop, although it's been v good this week, and i really appreciate it, honest; in case it's reading this, no offence.
today i received through the post a letter telling me the polling station had changed, as already shewn on polling card received some weeks ago.
it also invited me to apply for a postal vote.
so i rang the number given. they said they couldn't send the forms out because there would not be time to get them and send back. i could actually deliver them back by hand, but that wasn't asked. they told me to do it online.
the person sounded so uninterested and like a schoolchild.
i got a bit cross.
vast swathes of people are effectively being disenfranchised.

Marydoll, I used to work at the local library, where they did run ‘silver surfer’ classes now and then, but sometimes if we had time we’d try to help someone unfamiliar.

I particularly remember one woman, not much older than me, who needed an email address for something. I went through the whole rigmarole with her, but she wanted to use a very complicated password - nothing at all memorable - and refused to write it down since her husband had said she mustn’t. (!)
I made it quite clear that when she came to log in, she’d have to enter the password exactly or it wouldn’t work, but she insisted that she’d remember it.

Of course, once it was all done and she wanted to send an email, she couldn’t remember it exactly and it didn’t work, grrrr...
OTOH an old chap who must have been 80+ came in one day with a newspaper article containing a website about something he was interested in.
He’d never even touched a computer before, but I showed him the basics and he got it all straight away - went away so chuffed, saying how marvellous it was, he was off to buy a computer straight away!

welbeck

i tried to get a postal vote.
but you have to download a form and fill it in by hand and send off to apply.
i don't have a printer. and only an intermittent second-hand laptop, although it's been v good this week, and i really appreciate it, honest; in case it's reading this, no offence.
today i received through the post a letter telling me the polling station had changed, as already shewn on polling card received some weeks ago.
it also invited me to apply for a postal vote.
so i rang the number given. they said they couldn't send the forms out because there would not be time to get them and send back. i could actually deliver them back by hand, but that wasn't asked. they told me to do it online.
the person sounded so uninterested and like a schoolchild.
i got a bit cross.
vast swathes of people are effectively being disenfranchised.

Which country are you in? The deadline in E is next Tuesday and it’s clear from the EC that you contact your local council if you can’t print off the form.

Doodledog there are folk who actually cannot afford to have access to the Internet.

Chapeau, a very fair point, as I well know from my teaching days.

.... and there are STILL plenty of places with little or no broadband.... the people who are simply being nuisances or difficult or thick are still paying their council tax, income tax, road tax, car insurance fuel bills etc etc etc
Everyone is all for people living in their own homes for as long as possible... cos it's cheaper for the NHS etc, but heaven forbid we provide them with the wherewithal and support they need....

my dad lives in england, i am in scotland, he got himself into a state with the recent census in england, they never sent a form out to him and all he saw was the tv adverts, he started to panic when he found out that he could be fined a £1000 for not doing it, he is not a tech person, has a small nokia phone and does not know how to text, i sorted it by finding a number he could call, not everyone has a pc/laptop, i have a mobile phone with 5 numbers in it, i don't like it or use it unless i need to, people are shocked when they ask for a number and i give them the house phone.....usual answer is....we need a mobile number...if they really need to talk to me they can call my home and leave a message. i still write letters and send cards because it is what i prefer to do.

Chapeau

Doodledog there are folk who actually cannot afford to have access to the Internet.

Yes, of course there are, and as I said, there should be exemptions for those who are genuinely unable to use it, as opposed to those who 'just don't want to'.

Doodledog "^there should be exceptions for people who are genuinely unable to access the internet, such as the very old, the disabled etc^."
Ahh, so these folk (nearly 2 million of them), would be the "etc"? You might find this interesting: www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/28/digital-divide-isolates-and-endangers-millions-of-uk-poorest

I think the answer is to provide the means to overcome those issues not exclude them from something that the rest of society can access. So we shouldn't be saying well there are people who cant afford a phone/laptop so they should be able to do it non digitally, we should be ensuring those people can have access to technology.

Galaxy Absolutely

I think the amount of on-line business has indeed become unreasonable for some. I do think for any government or utility service there should be paper or in-person options. Think of all the people without computers, smart phones or the needed literacy in english to manage.

My older sister recently lost her husband to a quickly worsening illness. She had always paid her bills at the bank or at the utility. She had to apply for his short term, then long term benefit, then all the paperwork to do after his death. Because of Covid, even the government offices were closed with notes at the door to log on to the website. She has never really had the capacity to be tech-savvy and thank goodness for my younger sister who lived nearby and could assist. It was a lot of work.

Many people need advocates to assist them. It seems there should be some sort of agency or volunteer organization to assist people with that, although think of the danger of security issues.

You should hear the grumbles and swearing when my DH has to apply for his fishing license on line! Here we have both federal and provincial licenses needed, depending on if you are fishing salt or fresh waters, then all the special tags per species, etc. Ykes, it is quite a process.

Suziewoozie, yes i know that, i am in england. that's why i began to get cross when the woman refused to send the form.
i told her that i had just received a letter from them inviting me to apply for a postal vote, i explained that i could not print a form out. and i complained that i felt i was losing my vote.
she didn't care. sounded bored. and about 15.
i may try tomorrow, see if i get someone more sensible.

welbeck

Suziewoozie, yes i know that, i am in england. that's why i began to get cross when the woman refused to send the form.
i told her that i had just received a letter from them inviting me to apply for a postal vote, i explained that i could not print a form out. and i complained that i felt i was losing my vote.
she didn't care. sounded bored. and about 15.
i may try tomorrow, see if i get someone more sensible.

Get onto the candidates tomorrow who are standing in your ward and say you are being prevented from exercising your democratic right. Don’t bother again with the council - you were treated appallingly. If any candidate is worth voting for they’ll deliver you a form tomorrow

I remember not so long ago hearing about an elderly couple whose landline was down for some reason.
A friend or neighbour phoned the provider for them, asking for it to be fixed as a matter of urgency.

The bloke on the other end - evidently young and clueless - said, ‘Can’t they just use their mobiles?’

Presumably this is often the mindset as regards phones/ internet now.