Trans Teacher

Dickens

Mama2020

As long as it's appropriate work attire comparable to what is standard teacher attire, I don't see what the issue is. Teacher isn't engaging in sex in front of the children, so I don't understand the comments about sexuality. I see others saying it's fine to be trans, but it has to be kept behind closed doors. Why, exactly? In what way does a skirt harm the children? My only concern would be whether this person is a good teacher.

In what way does a skirt harm the children?

The short answer is of course (as you well understand) - it doesn't.

The reality is a bit more complex. There are those - on here and in the wider public - who are sceptical, critical and worried, about the way in which transgender 'doctrine' is being promoted to children, some of whom are quite young and uninformed about the complexities of adult-life. We are not all on-board with Stonewall's ideology when it is applied to children whose mental health may well be in turmoil because of various complex reasons that are not all connected to gender-identity. There are many dynamics in children's family backgrounds that can cause problems for young children; divorce, ill-health of parents, drug-dependency, financial impoverishment, over-crowding, sibling-rivalry, parental neglect, etc, etc.

To the accusations of "transphobia" we are questioning whether it would be more appropriate to examine a child's background and its family history before assuming that it is suffering from a personal gender-identity crisis, or that the kid is "in the wrong body".

So in that context the skirt becomes something more than a harmless piece of clothing. In an environment where male teachers conventionally wear trousers, one who decides to wear a skirt instead is making a point. A point about his sexuality in a classroom where the focus should be on the children and not on him.

So if he openly states he is a healthy heterosexual male who likes skirts would that be OK?
A man wearing a skirt gives you no idea at all about his sexuality. He may be gay, he may be bi, he may even be hetero.
Sexuality is nothing to do with skirt wearing (Just like wearing make up for Bowie etc was nothing to do with their sexuality) Honestly I thought we'd got past all this stuff.

Great post, Dickens, but I fear you are wasting your time. It will be ignored, twisted, diverted into anecdotal discussions about trousers - anything but taken on board and discussed.

Mama2020

As long as it's appropriate work attire comparable to what is standard teacher attire, I don't see what the issue is. Teacher isn't engaging in sex in front of the children, so I don't understand the comments about sexuality. I see others saying it's fine to be trans, but it has to be kept behind closed doors. Why, exactly? In what way does a skirt harm the children? My only concern would be whether this person is a good teacher.

In what way does a skirt harm the children?

The short answer is of course (as you well understand) - it doesn't.

The reality is a bit more complex. There are those - on here and in the wider public - who are sceptical, critical and worried, about the way in which transgender 'doctrine' is being promoted to children, some of whom are quite young and uninformed about the complexities of adult-life. We are not all on-board with Stonewall's ideology when it is applied to children whose mental health may well be in turmoil because of various complex reasons that are not all connected to gender-identity. There are many dynamics in children's family backgrounds that can cause problems for young children; divorce, ill-health of parents, drug-dependency, financial impoverishment, over-crowding, sibling-rivalry, parental neglect, etc, etc.

To the accusations of "transphobia" we are questioning whether it would be more appropriate to examine a child's background and its family history before assuming that it is suffering from a personal gender-identity crisis, or that the kid is "in the wrong body".

So in that context the skirt becomes something more than a harmless piece of clothing. In an environment where male teachers conventionally wear trousers, one who decides to wear a skirt instead is making a point. A point about his sexuality in a classroom where the focus should be on the children and not on him.

Iam64

Rosie51
“Doodledog may I suggest you go outside, bang your head repeatedly against a brick wall, and then contemplate how much more enlightening and satisfying that whole procedure was than trying to plait fog or understand "some posters" lol”

I suspect a few of us could join.
I suspect that too Iam64

I haven't seen posts that say all trans people are responsible for the behaviour of the few, or that trans people should apologise for the actions of TRA's and their supporters, or that the aforementioned makes all trans people look bad.

I have seen, and said myself that the criminal and abusive behaviour of TRA's and their supporters is a great disservice to to the trans community as a whole, to those who simply want to get on with their lives without a spotlight constantly being shone on them.

Rosie51

Doodledog may I suggest you go outside, bang your head repeatedly against a brick wall, and then contemplate how much more enlightening and satisfying that whole procedure was than trying to plait fog or understand "some posters" lol

I suspect a few of us could join

Ok

Its a shame you can't see it doodledog

But clarifying what I meant once should be enough, if it isn't enough for you, you will need to reconcile that with yourself

I feel like it sometimes

Doodledog may I suggest you go outside, bang your head repeatedly against a brick wall, and then contemplate how much more enlightening and satisfying that whole procedure was than trying to plait fog or understand "some posters" lol

VioletSky

Especially the "everyone agrees with me about you" type of thing which is actually really harmful.

You are knowledgeable about this stuff, look from an unbiased perspective

Is this addressed to me? I haven't said that everyone agrees with me about you. I said that others had read your post and assumed that you were saying that you had been accused of lying. Rosie had posted to refute that accusation as well. You are twisting my words again - please don't.

I agree that a lot of time is spent with you accusing and people defending - it's tedious.

Mama2020

As long as it's appropriate work attire comparable to what is standard teacher attire, I don't see what the issue is. Teacher isn't engaging in sex in front of the children, so I don't understand the comments about sexuality. I see others saying it's fine to be trans, but it has to be kept behind closed doors. Why, exactly? In what way does a skirt harm the children? My only concern would be whether this person is a good teacher.

Sorry I've not seen the posts saying "it's fine to be trans, but it has to be kept behind closed doors. " perhaps you could use the quote function to highlight them?
As we've not been told exactly what the skirt is like we are all floundering in the dark, and the thread has wandered to a great degree which is fine and fairly standard for many threads.

Surely a 'good teacher' is one whose personal circumstances are irrelevant, and don't raise any interest? The best teachers in my day were those whose subject captivated you but you knew absolutely nothing about their personal lives.

As long as it's appropriate work attire comparable to what is standard teacher attire, I don't see what the issue is. Teacher isn't engaging in sex in front of the children, so I don't understand the comments about sexuality. I see others saying it's fine to be trans, but it has to be kept behind closed doors. Why, exactly? In what way does a skirt harm the children? My only concern would be whether this person is a good teacher.

Thank you Rosie51
There isn't one respected biologist who will vary from there being two sexes and only two sexes, and the immutability of a person's sex.

That’s not just my perception.

That’s reality.

VioletSky

I think it's a logical conclusion given gender dysphoria and scientific evidence I have shared many times

But you know, beliefs are protected and I am not calling your basis for your beliefs illogical, just your individual arguments when they don't support it

So there is that doodledog

Sorry VioletSky you have never shared peer reviewed scientific papers/evidence with any standard of proof of the things you claim. Every time you have actually linked to something (and not advised us to google) I have read it, and it has been full of "may be" "possibly" "might indicate" "could perhaps" etc etc. Never has any paper been able to demonstrate as fact any scientific evidence for the 'transgender brain' you have alluded to. Genuine gender dysphoria is a recognised condition experienced by a tiny percentage of people and can be helped in many cases by therapy. For a very few, sexual reassignment surgery is the answer and enables them to lead a happy life.

There isn't one respected biologist who will vary from there being two sexes and only two sexes, and the immutability of a person's sex.

Especially the "everyone agrees with me about you" type of thing which is actually really harmful.

You are knowledgeable about this stuff, look from an unbiased perspective

That is your perception doodledog

That's not my reality

If so much time were not spent correcting and defending against this type of thing, we could have a meaningful discussion

I've been present for many threads about trans people and trust me, I don't lie

That is what you said. Others have read it as meaning that you are saying you've been accused of lying. If I have misunderstood it is because it does read like that. We can only go by what you actually post, not what you mean when you post is, as we have no way of knowing that.

It's the same with you accusing people of saying that all transwomen are dangerous because some men impersonate them. That is not what is being said, but you accuse people of saying it and me of not denying it.

doodledog I did not say anyone accused me of lying

This is another example.pf what I mentioned to you earlier

I wish you could see it.

I (and others) have repeatedly tried to explain to you that saying that men pretending to be trans means that actual transpeople need to be banned from women's spaces - not because they are a danger in themselves, but because it is impossible to know who is a 'real' transwoman and who is pretending, but you don't listen. You seem to read one thing, it is clear to me that the poster is saying another, so no, I am not going to disagree with them.

Would you prefer me to lie and say that I think that there is nothing to worry about from men passing themselves off as transwomen?

That doesn't help with the question of who has accused you of lying, though.

How many times have you stood by or quietly agreed while someone said something along the lines of "all trans people are responsible for the behaviour of xyz trans people" or "why aren't these ordinary trans people apologising for the behaviour of this criminal" or "the behaviour of this criminal makes all trans people look bad"

Answer: Every single time doodledog

I don't tend to think along the lines of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" for 2 reasons, it's not logical and my values are my values across the board

VioletSky

I think it's a logical conclusion given gender dysphoria and scientific evidence I have shared many times

But you know, beliefs are protected and I am not calling your basis for your beliefs illogical, just your individual arguments when they don't support it

So there is that doodledog

Yes, we disagree. I think we both know that, and it's ok.

Who has called you a liar though?

VioletSky

It's the fact that people are willing to lump the whole of the trans community into a representation of male toxicity while allowing that some men are wonderful and respectful of women that highlights exactly the lack of logic in many of the arguments here

But, we don't. We don't lump the whole of the trans community into a representation of male toxicity!

How many times have you read comments where we've talked about the minority of vocal TRAs as distinct from the "ordinary" trans woman who just want to get on with their life - a phrase that I've read quite a few times here on GN?

Male 'toxicity' is men, whether trans or otherwise, who use their aggressive maleness to subvert, subdue and attack women, either verbally or physically.

Most women have been subjected to this toxicity, to some degree or other, for a part of their lives. The threat of rape is not a new phenomena and it's not peculiar to trans women activists... it's the male prerogative, and biological men posing as women threatening biological women with their "lady-dicks" is simply men threatening women with rape.

Where is the lack of logic?

I think it's a logical conclusion given gender dysphoria and scientific evidence I have shared many times

But you know, beliefs are protected and I am not calling your basis for your beliefs illogical, just your individual arguments when they don't support it

So there is that doodledog

VioletSky

I've been present for many threads about trans people and trust me, I don't lie

Who said you do? Are you suggesting that my post was a lie, because yours appears directly below it? I do hope not as I know I don't lie!