To think that London, or anywhere else for that matter, does not belong to any one demographic

I had no idea that black people use the N word to one another. You have opened my eyes there.

I think it is very easy for people who are under pressure or haven’t been coached in the niceties of the English language to say ‘openly Jewish’ or ‘the Jew’. The latter is a statement of fact and I doubt it was said in a pejorative manner - but someone’s precious, pearl-clutching mindset was offended and they reported it. Shame on them.

Germanshepherdsmum

TerriBull

Not you GSM, but I saw one post earlier, I think it's been deleted now, the poster said something like "The Jew was in the wrong" to me that sounded as if it had come out of 1930s Nazi Germany referring to a person as "The Jew" and then the poster went on in this vein, "if that makes me an anti semite so be it" not verbatim because I can't remember the exact wording, but yes I rather think they described themselves accurately there.

I saw that post and entirely agreed as regards who was ‘in the wrong’. Maybe clumsy wording, as with the policeman, but the sentiment and lack of antisemitism was clear to me. Is it now unacceptable to refer to someone as ‘a Jew’, even though Jewish people do so?

Well GSM, black people refer to each other using the "N" word which I think is horrible, an awful word, there's no way a white person should use that word even if they do. Equally, maybe Jewish people refer to each as "The Jew" I suppose that is their prerogative. . Both these demographics have suffered racism and persecution. We all know their histories, or should do, and I think we have to bear that in mind in how we couch language given the pejorative way nouns have been used towards them.

eazybee

^Of course not, but it’s a matter of how you go about it. of anyone who tries to deceive and thereby lose others their jobs Many were deceived until the full picture emerged with the Sky video. Some still refuse to see him for what he is. And that is not an antisemitic statement - I would say the same of anyone who tries to deceive and thereby lose others their jobs, whatever the person’s faith, race or cause. He has shown himself to lack integrity.^
There is an awful amount of supposition in this statement and I do not agree with it.

anyone who tries to deceive and thereby lose others their jobs'
Whose jobs?
Many were deceived until the full picture emerged with the Sky video. Some still refuse to see him for what he is.
Which is, precisely?
He behaved in an orderly and respectful manner.
The protesters did not.
The policemen were civil but not particularly polite, in fact, hectoring on occasion.

I beg to differ.

The jobs of the policeman involved, and the Met Commissioner, are threatened.

See the Sky video and transcription of the verbal exchange for the full picture.

He behaved in neither nor a respectful manner,

Indeed the protesters didn’t.

The police were patient and polite. They did their job, which was to keep him, his entourage and other members of the public safe. Again, the Sky video gives the full picture, GF’s does not, and we can see from the Sky video that his was carefully edited to give a misleading picture. Now why wouldn’t he have disseminated all the footage captured by his cameraman?

GrannyGravy13

GSM you are correct, as a family (with young GC) we haven’t been into London on a Saturday since the marches started.

Not sure what point you are trying to prove by bringing this up though? If anything you are validating the posters and the posts that are worried about the pro-Palestinian marches and the knock on effect it is having on all Londoners especially those who are Jewish.

All Londoners, and people visiting London, absolutely are affected by these wretched, and totally useless, marches. The problem doesn’t affect only Jewish people. If there were a far right march for example we would I expect feel very uneasy and avoid it, but only those targeted by the far right would feel threatened. Feeling intimidated by these marches is not exclusive to the Jewish community. They include too many members of rent-a-mob, who will have a go at anyone.

Post references deleted post Talk guidelines.

I am pointing out that not only Jewish people are concerned for their safety when these marches are happening. I am Christian but wouldn’t go anywhere near one. They intimidate and threaten everyone and will achieve nothing.

Of course not, but it’s a matter of how you go about it. of anyone who tries to deceive and thereby lose others their jobs Many were deceived until the full picture emerged with the Sky video. Some still refuse to see him for what he is. And that is not an antisemitic statement - I would say the same of anyone who tries to deceive and thereby lose others their jobs, whatever the person’s faith, race or cause. He has shown himself to lack integrity.
There is an awful amount of supposition in this statement and I do not agree with it.

anyone who tries to deceive and thereby lose others their jobs'
Whose jobs?
Many were deceived until the full picture emerged with the Sky video. Some still refuse to see him for what he is.
Which is, precisely?
He behaved in an orderly and respectful manner.
The protesters did not.
The policemen were civil but not particularly polite, in fact, hectoring on occasion.

GSM you are correct, as a family (with young GC) we haven’t been into London on a Saturday since the marches started.

Not sure what point you are trying to prove by bringing this up though? If anything you are validating the posters and the posts that are worried about the pro-Palestinian marches and the knock on effect it is having on all Londoners especially those who are Jewish.

tickingbird

Some of the posts on here disgust me. Truly sickening and just highlights what simmering anti semitism lies beneath the surface.

I haven't seen any antisemitism on here. Can you point out the antisemitic ones please?

Not you GSM, but I saw one post earlier, I think it's been deleted now, the poster said something like "The Jew was in the wrong" to me that sounded as if it had come out of 1930s Nazi Germany referring to a person as "The Jew" and then the poster went on in this vein, "if that makes me an anti semite so be it" not verbatim because I can't remember the exact wording, but yes I rather think they described themselves accurately there.

tickingbird

Some of the posts on here disgust me. Truly sickening and just highlights what simmering anti semitism lies beneath the surface.

Which ones?

GrannyGravy13

^Another question. If there had been no display of antisemitism - would the Jewish journalist have been there^

Again an excellent question, which I doubt we will get an answer.

Gideon Falter was not being provocative, he wanted to film the protest, to prove that antisemitic slogans and banners are being blatantly paraded through our capital city, but according to some he is in the wrong?

We are stepping back in time, know your place, stay in your area, t some streets/areas are not for you on your sabbath, what a shameful message to send to the Jewish community.

Could he not have filmed the march from the pavement? Yes he could, as Sky did, very successfully. (Rather too successfully for his liking perhaps.)

Not long ago, GG, I remember you being very concerned about going into central London with your family when you knew a march was going to take place. Perhaps you decided to ‘stay in your area’, I don’t recall what you eventually did, but you were certainly seriously considering doing so. And I don’t think that was because of your faith, if any, but rather a matter of concern for your family’s physical and emotional safety. You know full well why Jews feel threatened by the pro-Palestine marches and the eruption of antisemitism since 7 October. People of other faiths and races have been similarly intimidated by marches - this is not all about the Jews, but some posters’ memories seem to be short and selective. As has already been said, ‘antisemitism’ seems to have become the slur du jour, replacing racism’.

Some of the posts on here disgust me. Truly sickening and just highlights what simmering anti semitism lies beneath the surface.

fancythat

^He ended up proving that our police try to protect members of the public without fear or favour.^

The man did not want "protection".

Whether he wanted it or not, it’s pretty clear that he needed it and the policeman did his duty in providing it.

Namsnanny

Germanshepherdsmum

Anniebach

A police officer remove a man from a crowd he considered to be violent, the man is threatened with arrest the crowd carries
on

Are you being deliberately obtuse? Perhaps the policeman should have let him carry on, be beaten up and cause a riot?

In a country where free speech is cherished, the violet person would be the one breaking the law. So therefore he should be the one arrested.

So the policeman should have stood aside and allowed violence to erupt?

The only thing necessary for evil to triumph in the world is that good men do nothing

He ended up proving that our police try to protect members of the public without fear or favour.

The man did not want "protection".

Namsnanny

GrannyGravy13

Callistemon21

Germanshepherdsmum

Anniebach

The police officer feared the marchers, the answer is
‘Remove openly Jewish ‘ .

No. Prevent obviously Jewish person from getting amongst militant antisemites who shouting antisemitic abuse at him. For his own protection and to prevent a breach of the peace.

Which brings us to the question:

Why are anti-semites allowed to march in this country?
I realise not all protestors are anti-semitic but a good proportion are.

That Callistemon21 is the million $ question that I have asked numerous times over numerous similar threads, as of yet no answer has been provided.

When are people going to understand the lessons of the past?

Come for one minority, and next it will be another, and another until it is everyone

How long before we ask jews not to leave the areas they live and shop? For their safety?

Would this be considered a ghetto? Or a precaution for their own health and well being?

Too many crimes on the statute books that don't result in actually criminality.

Just there to set a precedent, to warn others not to step out of line.

I agree especially with your paragraphs 3 and 5.

Another question. If there had been no display of antisemitism - would the Jewish journalist have been there

Again an excellent question, which I doubt we will get an answer.

Gideon Falter was not being provocative, he wanted to film the protest, to prove that antisemitic slogans and banners are being blatantly paraded through our capital city, but according to some he is in the wrong?

We are stepping back in time, know your place, stay in your area, t some streets/areas are not for you on your sabbath, what a shameful message to send to the Jewish community.

I obviously dont agree with anyone trying to deceive.

And I am not sure anyone should lose their job.

true Namsnanny. The difference in this instance is the one
under threat of violence is a Jew

Why couldn’t he have had the march filmed safely from the pavement (as Sky did) and publish the resulting video? The antisemitic chanting and abuse would have been heard. Because obviously that wasn’t enough for him. He was prepared to risk injury to himself and his companions in his search for something more newsworthy

He wanted to prove more, yes.
Which he did. And worldwide apparently.

Germanshepherdsmum

Anniebach

A police officer remove a man from a crowd he considered to be violent, the man is threatened with arrest the crowd carries
on

Are you being deliberately obtuse? Perhaps the policeman should have let him carry on, be beaten up and cause a riot?

In a country where free speech is cherished, the violet person would be the one breaking the law. So therefore he should be the one arrested.

GrannyGravy13

Callistemon21

Germanshepherdsmum

Anniebach

The police officer feared the marchers, the answer is
‘Remove openly Jewish ‘ .

No. Prevent obviously Jewish person from getting amongst militant antisemites who shouting antisemitic abuse at him. For his own protection and to prevent a breach of the peace.

Which brings us to the question:

Why are anti-semites allowed to march in this country?
I realise not all protestors are anti-semitic but a good proportion are.

That Callistemon21 is the million $ question that I have asked numerous times over numerous similar threads, as of yet no answer has been provided.

Why are anti-semites allowed to march in this country?

... because anti-Semitism is being 'reframed'?

I realise not all protestors are anti-semitic but a good proportion are.

I'm not sure about that. I thought the majority - including Jewish groups - were peaceful?

Another question. If there had been no display of anti-Semitism - would the Jewish journalist have been there even?

Anniebach

A police officer remove a man from a crowd he considered to be violent, the man is threatened with arrest the crowd carries
on

Are you being deliberately obtuse? Perhaps the policeman should have let him carry on, be beaten up and cause a riot?