To think that London, or anywhere else for that matter, does not belong to any one demographic

If police do this thype of thing, as Dickens suggested, to make their own lives easier because of lack of manpower, is that really the best way of dealing with things?
I dont know, about that particular point.

But apparently, he threatened the solitary Jew with arrest for behaviour liable to cause a breach of the peace - which sounds like rabid anti-Semitism to me!

No he did not, grandtante, as anyone who had actually taken the trouble to read the Sky News transcript of the encounter would know.

Nor was Falter “solitary”.

No AGAA4, in this case, in my opinion, I dont think he should have been prevented.

It makes him in the wrong, instead of people who may[or may not] have attacked him.

teachkate

This young man was being deliberately provocative and argumentative.
I thought the police officer dealt with the difficult situation in a very quiet, tolerant, patient and professional manner - plus the young man wasn’t just wearing a kippah he was also carrying something wrapped in some red velvet material which had Hebrew writing on the front ??? The Torah perhaps? Anyway something which I’m sure he doesn’t carry around everyday!

Read the reports.
It was a prayer shawl, a tallit. Is that not allowed to be carried in the UK in case it offends someone?

Then look at the photos of the protestors too and think about what you just said.

Google

Breach of the Peace is not a criminal offence: you can be arrested, but you cannot be charged. The police have the power to detain or arrest you if a “breach of the peace” has occurred, or to prevent it from occurring.

The police officer feared the marchers, the answer is
‘Remove openly Jewish ‘ .

This young man was being deliberately provocative and argumentative.
I thought the police officer dealt with the difficult situation in a very quiet, tolerant, patient and professional manner - plus the young man wasn’t just wearing a kippah he was also carrying something wrapped in some red velvet material which had Hebrew writing on the front ??? The Torah perhaps? Anyway something which I’m sure he doesn’t carry around everyday!

fancythat

If a breach of the peace was prevented -

if say there was a march by Christians[not sure they march], and a Mus lim wanted to walk across the street -

Just musing.

a. I would expect him to be able to walk across safely

b. I would expect a policeman to let him do so. Why not?

c. if he did cause trouble, then I would expect the police to then act. At that point, and not before.

So you think the police should wait till a fight begins before acting.
Have you ever seen what happens when a fight starts on these marches. It very soon becomes a riot.

If a breach of the peace was prevented -

if say there was a march by Christians[not sure they march], and a Mus lim wanted to walk across the street -

Just musing.

a. I would expect him to be able to walk across safely

b. I would expect a policeman to let him do so. Why not?

c. if he did cause trouble, then I would expect the police to then act. At that point, and not before.

Yes - even if they then try to get him disciplined and get his boss sacked.

Seems as though the police officer was doing his job - protecting members of the public.

Callistemon21

Pantglas2

For all anyone knows, the Sky cameraman an is Jewish.

And there we have it! Being Jewish isn’t the problem with so many folks as long as they don’t flaunt it by wearing the Kippah or any other sign of their faith. When they do, they’re provoking people….asking for it!

Try telling Muslims/Sikhs/Rastas they shouldn’t do the same and see how ludicrous it sounds!

👍

Don’t flaunt it among a mob of militant antisemites whilst trying to film them might be considered good advice.

Germanshepherdsmum

I agree. It was possible that the man’s presence could provoke a hostile reaction from some of those on the march. The policeman rightly foresaw that and was trying to prevent trouble and to protect the man.

My thoughts exactly.

Surrounded by heavies. , good grief

Germanshepherdsmum

Anniebach

Why would the marchers have no probl em with being filmed
but Gideon was stirring up anger?

because Gideon was wearing a kippah thus being openly
Jewish

What do antisemites do Annie? They attack Jews, verbally and physically. He advertised his faith to them by wearing the kippah - you might say, a red rag to a bull. He would have been having them filmed by his cameraman (not wearing a kippah) to expose them. What reaction would you expect to that from a militant antisemite?

I'm speechless!

Anniebach

Why would the marchers have no probl em with being filmed
but Gideon was stirring up anger?

because Gideon was wearing a kippah thus being openly
Jewish

The police officer thought that there was the potential for provoking the marchers. He didn't accuse him of doing so. For goodness' sake, he was walking in the road into the march against the flow and surrounded by "heavies". If he had been in obviously Muslim dress walking into a right-wing, anti-immigrant march, I would expect the police to do exactly the same.

Anniebach

Why would the marchers have no probl em with being filmed
but Gideon was stirring up anger?

because Gideon was wearing a kippah thus being openly
Jewish

What do antisemites do Annie? They attack Jews, verbally and physically. He advertised his faith to them by wearing the kippah - you might say, a red rag to a bull. He would have been having them filmed by his cameraman (not wearing a kippah) to expose them. What reaction would you expect to that from a militant antisemite?

It cannot be a breach of the peace to' walk against the flow of the road', surely? He/they were on the outskirts and no-one was hindered; there was no contact or opposition, except from the police
I have watched more of the footage, and calling 'scum, scum' would seem a provocative action but the perpetrators were neither identified nor warned.

The police have lost control of protest marches and demonstrations; I believe firmly they should be stopped as they are clearly not going to fade away, but I wonder what the reaction will/would be if someone was brave enough to implement it.

It has always been so Pantglas

Pantglas2

For all anyone knows, the Sky cameraman an is Jewish.

And there we have it! Being Jewish isn’t the problem with so many folks as long as they don’t flaunt it by wearing the Kippah or any other sign of their faith. When they do, they’re provoking people….asking for it!

Try telling Muslims/Sikhs/Rastas they shouldn’t do the same and see how ludicrous it sounds!

👍

For all anyone knows, the Sky cameraman an is Jewish.

And there we have it! Being Jewish isn’t the problem with so many folks as long as they don’t flaunt it by wearing the Kippah or any other sign of their faith. When they do, they’re provoking people….asking for it!

Try telling Muslims/Sikhs/Rastas they shouldn’t do the same and see how ludicrous it sounds!

And so it begins.

undines

If I were obviously Jewish (and wearing a kippah) I would have the sense to keep away from such a demonstration
It's sad that things are that way
But it's just common sense
I do not blame the police officer. Despite all the iniquities of the Met I think he was just trying to keep the situation calm

I'm not Jewish (or obviously anything), but I'd have the sense to stay clear of such a demonstration anyway.

growstuff

Germanshepherdsmum

fancythat

What I still dont understand is where is the legal point of view on all this?

There doesnt appear to be one.

It cant be all up to what a policeman says, on the day?
A breach of peace had not occured. As far as I can see.

A breach of the peace was prevented by the much-castigated policeman. I have no doubt whatsoever, having heard what some of the marchers were shouting and chanting, that had the policeman not prevented GF from getting amongst them with his friends and cameraman, a violent breach of the peace would have ensued. We should be praising this very patient policeman rather than a man who would have him and the Met chief lose their jobs and pensions.

In 2009, he was a witness to an incident, in which a senior civil servant did lose his job. At appeal, it was agreed that the civil servant didn't say what Mr Falter alleged and Mr Falter was discredited as a witness because he wasn't within earshot.

That’s interesting growstuff. I believe the wide dissemination of an edited film clip, misrepresenting the facts and seeking to discredit the police has further discredited him. He is a man with an agenda. I sincerely hope he doesn’t succeed in damaging police careers through what he has done.

Thank goodness for the Sky video.

Why would the marchers have no probl em with being filmed
but Gideon was stirring up anger?

because Gideon was wearing a kippah thus being openly
Jewish