Teachers toilet training

keepingquiet

There are lots of factors involved I think.

As some have mentioned the quality of disposable nappies has improved so much that toddlers can stay in a wet one all day with no issues.

Parents are much busier these days despite what some say- if both parents are working full-time and the child has been in nursery since infancy then where is the time? Nursery staff are too shorthanded to be chasing children around with potties every five minutes.

It has always be the case that some children wet themselves in class. This happened to me when I was teaching in a secondary school- we had some children who regularly left a puddle on a seat. I once found faeces on the school stage when teaching a drama class!

Teachers are not paid to toilet train, if it is an issue in reception class then it would be the TA who would deal with it, and if I were asked to as a teacher I would be onto my head or the union straight away!

Much can be made of this issue but most children starting school will make that transition quickly.

Finally, dismissing Covid as a factor does not act for the welfare of so many children affected, ignored and now being dismissed as having to take the brunt of the lockdown measures whilst being the least affected by the virus.

How the government failed to support young families at this time, including my own grandchildren is nothing short of shameful, and we will be dealing with the consequences of this for some time to come.

What responsible parent leaves a child in a wet nappy all day,would they stay in wet knickers all day, no of course not, why would you leave a little one open to bacteria infectious,nappy rash, UTI, urine is only sterile until it leaves the body, no responsible parent would do this. All my family have worked full time, non of mine or my grandchildren went to primary not toilet trained.
As for lockdown, parents were paid to work from home, does this excuse lack of toilet training, didn't the parents need to go to the toilet. Children are primarily parents responsibility, not the government. Of course children have accidents, children do, but to send a child to primary school,not toilet trained,is neglect on the part of irresponsible parents.

Part of the trouble is that young parents these days are told not to start potty training before the age of 2, as the hormone that controls the bladder spincter is not produced until about then.

Whether true or not, this is the received wisdom now, so nothing we grandparents say will be listened to.

45 years ago when I aged 24 started teaching we did have pupils, especially little boys of six who could not "find willie" or negotiate Y-fronts and a zip, but in the 1970s any woman accompanied a child that age to the toilet and helped.

Now in the climate of incessant accusations of inappropriate behaviour, I would advise all teachers to let children wet themselves rather than risk a false accusation of child abuse.

It is well-nigh impossible to prove that you are not guilty of such a charge.

Whether or not children should be out of nappies at 18 months as we were or not, parents should make sure that thier children starting schoolcan go to the toilet alone before they start school, in the interests of preventing sexual abuse, false accusations of it, which ruin a teacher's life and of shaming a child who wets his or her pants at school.

Lockdown was in Spring 2020. Second lockdown in Spring 2021. That’s a full three years ago. Three years in which parents have had time to potty train their children. It’s nothing to do with lockdowns and everything to do with can’t be bothered. There’s no excuse, outside of children with additional needs. I’m glad I’m not teaching any longer. We always had children who had the odd accident. We had spare clothes in school and nursery nurse or the teaching assistant changed them, but children attending school in nappies is ridiculous. Lazy parenting!

My granddaughter has just turned 4 and has been out of nappies for over a year. But a number of her friends of similar age are still in nappies, when I asked my daughter why the parents are not toilet training them she said the current trend is child led training and she thinks the pull up nappy pants are comfortable and easy children are not bothered to ask for potty/toilet. One of the Mums says she will not force her child to be toilet trained by September. I was really shocked by this.

One of the mum's says she will not force her child to be toilet trained by September but presumably she'll be forcing the child to start school in nappies when the vast majority if not all of his/her peers wont be.

Sorry keepingitquiet. Both my children attended nursery full-time from the age of six months and they were toilet trained earlier than most. Staff don't run around with potties, but the children were taken as a group to miniature toilets every couple of hours. They wore trainer pants for a few months, but they soon got the message.

Theexwife

I dont get this parents are too busy excuse, before starting school the child was being cared for by somebody, either nursery , carers or parents all of which can toilet train, it takes about a week.

Lockdown has no bearing on it now as children could be trained during that time, in fact easier as many were at home.

What has happened to this generation of parents where nothing is their responsibility, they can’t brush teeth, toilet train, cook or discipline their children, maybe if they spent less time on their phones they would have time to parent.

Bit of a generalisation. You seem to be saying that this whole generation of parents are completely feckless. My daughter and many others I know, are nothing like that. Offensive or what.

OK, some are no doubt, just like some of my (our) generation and neglected their children. The NSPCC has been going since 1884.

Perhaps you need to get out more.

If many parents now think toilet training is best left to school surely it's time for teachers to insist that children are trained before they start school. Modern trends or not.

I agree Greta. Without extenuating circumstances maybe schools should insist that all children need to be toilet trained before they start.

Legally, schools cannot turn away children who are not potty trained and are in nappies. It is in the equality act

Equally two members of staff do not need to be present to change a child. That is not the case.

Some parents are struggling and some children are struggling for many various reasons.

It's just not that simple and we should never be standing in judgement over individual situations when we do not know the cause

Poor staff. Poor children. Forced into formal education , a 10 hour day at age 4.

What a mess.

Surely (currently) most children are trained prior to reception?

It seems not Norah. This was talked about over the weekend on the BBC and one school with an intake last September of 27 reception children had 8 that weren't toilet trained.

Three/ four is way too old in my books once they re walking they are perfectly able to be encouraged it’s not the childrens fault it’s the parents No child that isn’t disabled in some way should be in nappies at school age Blimey I was on the school bus on my own at 4
Nappies at school is a complete no no, lazy parenting and the new way of allowing a child to decide

Smileless2012

It seems not Norah. This was talked about over the weekend on the BBC and one school with an intake last September of 27 reception children had 8 that weren't toilet trained.

I misunderstood.

I listened whilst doing other things, mentally heard nursery, thought "well, many aren't trained until before reception"- so, I asked.

That's only if they fall under the protected disability characteristic though VS. I know numerous schools that are requesting parents to come in to change nappies.

Yes, some schools ask parents to come in to do that but they cannot turn children away from school on those grounds

We preferred our TA's to have another adult " witness" in the toilet area at these times, for their own protection as well as safeguarding the child.

zakouma, what makes you think that four year old children have a school day of ten hours ?

Chocolatelovinggran

We preferred our TA's to have another adult " witness" in the toilet area at these times, for their own protection as well as safeguarding the child.

Thank you.

I wasn't even going to question two/other adult supervision - I know that occurs at my GC/GGC school - as it should, imo.

My children were born in the nineties. It was considered normal for a girl to be toilet trained around her second birthday and a boy by around 2 1/2. Some playgroups started at 2 1/2 and children had to be toilet trained before they started. My oldest son is autistic, but I didn't realise at the time. I was horrified that he was still in nappies until just before his third birthday, but he was immediately dry day and night. Once we realised that he had a serious problem, the late toilet training made sense. He had problems in the other direction until he was eight. My younger son and daughter were trained at roughly the expected times. Over on MN, it seems that three is the earliest many modern parents seem to consider starting potty training and four is common as they wait for "readiness." They wonder why their children are unwilling to co-operate, but three-year-olds can be very stubborn. It is easier, ironically, when they are younger. I do think laziness is involved in many cases. In the same way, so-called "gentle parenting" seems to mean no parenting. I do think that children should not be allowed to start nursery or school if they are not toilet trained - the odd accident is an entirely different matter - unless they have significant needs.
As for general parental responsibilities, I started school in September 1969. My mother has never forgotten the teacher standing at the school gates (parents were allowed no further) and telling them all that they didn't need to worry about teaching their children to read because that was her job. Their job was to make sure that their children could put on their shoes by themselves and button up their coats by themselves as she did not have time to button up forty coats. No classroom assistants in those days, of course. She was an excellent teacher - firm but fair and everyone knew exactly where they stood. I have very happy memories of my first year of school. My teacher, Mrs Scales, would be turning in her grave if she knew that children were turning up to school in nappies.

My dc were born 1990 and 1993 and both were dry by 2 and a half . I had a 2.8 month gap and was keen to have my eldest out of nappies by the time my dd was born . Both went to nursery at 3 and had to be dry in order to attend . That was the case for all the nurseries in our area .

Why are people blaming Covid for this? Surely with mothers at home all day, it would be the ideal time to get children trained? This is something I really cannot understand at all. A child should be out of nappies by the age of 2 and a half. To have 5 year olds starting school still in them is absolutely ridiculous.

These are the children born just before the pandemic, where people were isolated from their support systems

It's undoubtedly had an impact in many ways

we are an academy school so we have access to a bigger support system and every reception class are facing a big challenge this year we haven't seen before in many ways