Where do we go from here re DD3 and the Idiot!

You wonder about the mother of a bloke like your SIL, Judthepud. She should kick his
arse backside and tell him to grow up.

Kitty I have been dealing with a very similar situation with our DD3 for the last 5 years! 2 little boys involved, the youngest of which(4) is besotted with his dad. The idiot first left DD when she was 6 mths pregnant with the little one and changed his phone no. Went back to mummy.
Since then he has come and gone on a frequent basis. Continually verbally abuses her by text calling her awful names. He has been back for a year now but the relationship is wobbling again with another bout of verbal abuse. It is always her fault of course. DH and I just never know how to treat him! Have to stay civil as we often facilitate visitation. And DD has often been very wobbly, trying to work full time and look after the little ones in the face of all this.
I think DD has become much stronger now and talking finishing the marriage for good. IMO should have done this when he first left.
It is emotionally exhausting, isn't it? I have had to work hard at holding DD and myself together for so long I am drained. Wish it was all sorted out for good. Our main focus is of course the little boys who are so vulnerable. They need to see their dad but when the 7 year old came out with 'you're a f--king bad wife Mum' I knew the writing was on the wall! Talk about planting horrible messages in little heads!

It is so hard to see your own child suffering and be unable to stop it! ((Hugs)) to all other Gnetters going through this. It helps to vent!!

Words fail me when people use innocent children to vent their dislike in this way. Fortunately in our situation, for GD's sake anyway, their Daddy adores them and they him but sadly all too late I'm sure he realises he has robbed them of a life with Mummy and Daddy and family life together.

I have managed to forge a, albeit false, friendly relationship with him for GD's sake as I would not want the girls or him to sense any animosity for fear he could do what your ex SIL is doing to your GC.

Fortunately for your DGC they have a loving Granny to,protect them with the right responses and lovingly dispel any worries in their little heads.

That's all we can do mcem love them and let them know they can talk freely to Granny about anything. As it's two GDs I have, natural chatterboxes anyway, they don't need much persuasion

If it means my house will be tidy then so do I mcem.

I'll just be glad if we can use the dining table by C*******s as, at the last count, it looks like we will be 14 for lunch! Oh, and I'll also be glad if the Idiot doesn't come that day as he has a large mouth with a big voice!!

Agus we're dealing with a very similar situation. Dd is away from him and settled but of course we still have to see him. It gets difficult when the 4 year-old asked if I like Daddy and I replied, fingers crossed, that of course I like him because he is their Daddy ( best answer I can muster). He then replied 'That's funny cos Daddy doesn't like you'.
I reassured him by saying that it really didn't matter as the most important thing is that everyone loves him and his sister. Seemed to take that ok!
Horrible when children are used this way - planting the message in his little head, knowing that in his open, honest way he would pass it on!
Kitty I believe you're at the worst stage now. The light will dawn, they'll separate, you'll be there for her and life will return to reasonable. I sincerely hope that it's SOON!

Hopefully Agus

Forget the frame Kitty. Karma will bite him in the bum.

Agus thank you for your post - I know we will all get through this and our priority is DD and the children. It's hard to do the right thing isn't it!

Today, is their wedding anniversary so I gave DD a card before she left on Friday as I could bring myself to take it round today. It is the Idiot's birthday next week too and we had bought quite an expensive present, that is only appropriate to him, before things came to a head. DH is insistent that we take it round to him at the weekend and I know it's the right thing to do. I'm just not sure I can. It is a framed print which could make a handy blunt instrument!

Kitty we are 2 years on from the situation you are in at present. DD also suffered PND and panic attacks and the'idiot' saying she was a mental case. All of this we discovered was to hide his own guilt at what he has done to DD and his two daughters. Something he will have to live with.

We supported DD in any way we could and had to wait till she realised she was looking for something that wasn't there and told him to leave. We had to let her go at her own pace.

DD's and our priority is the girls. He is their Daddy but on occasion when we have to be in his company, I just think of him as a bad smell that keeps coming back and I am damned sure I won't allow this lowlife to spoil the relationship we have with our precious GDs so I laugh and chat when I have to as I would hate my GDs to have any upset if they realised the hostility between Granny and Daddy. The girls are both very happy bunnies as they believe we are all friends.

I wish your DD strength to get through this Kitty and she will, in time! bounce back with the love and support of her family

' this is all just part of life in a big family like ours. I'm a woman - I can cope and we do support each other at difficult times'

kittylester I love your comment (above). I think I shall adopt it as my motto!

Good luck with everything, by the way

Thank you all for taking the time to offer advice. I knew I could rely on GNs

Cressida - I think you are right and that was our thinking but it's good to get other people's advice in case we've missed something.

Paula8, thank you for your concern but there is no need to worry about me, this is all just part of life in a big family like ours. I'm a woman - I can cope and we do support each other at difficult times.

kittylester, the best thing you can do for your daughter is just give her time. While she probably 'knows' the marriage is dead she isn't yet in the right place to do something about it. I was in a similar situation and it took me about a year on Citalopram before I was able to take control of my life and leave.

I agree that the marriage is dead Jess but DD doesn't seem to yet! The 'business' idea is just what she has always done for friends but is being asked to do more nowadays. It would never be a full time venture but good occupational therapy at the moment and a bit of extra cash.

I am hoping that we can make some progress after the weekend.

Kittylester it all sounds miserable. But to be blunt:
As a marriage it sounds dead in the water. If I was a betting woman, I'd have a tenner on the fact that the idiot has another woman (or man) in his life.
Also she is probably in no fit state to be starting a business. In her present circumstances this sounds like an escapist fantasy.

Like Granjura I have no practical advice to give. Just be there for her

Sorry to hear about this tough situation kitty. The age gap is quite a big one, and his unpleasant comments 'skew loose' etc don't make him sound in the least bit likeable.

Have you had any success in talking things through with your daughter, without the input of her (charming) husband. What does she want to happen? Emotionally abusive, and destructive marriages feed depression and anxiety. Getting on the Relate waiting list is something constructive, skilled and properly trained/supervised staff there, who can assist with communication as well as help couples either stay together, or separate in a more amicable way.

As for having a tidy house, good luck with that one kitty

I am so sorry to hear all this Kitty- I have no advice to give sadly- just my very best wishes and

roses They are in a rented house - long story but I said he was an idiot! We have noticed that the more time she spends at home, the unhappier the children seem and the more badly behaved!

She is trying to set up a wedding cake making business so that it fits in with staying at home with the children for now but would like to get a part time job when she is more on track. She was an event planner - not conducive to having tinies. She is also (nominally) a director of his company. It's a flipping mess!!

Luckily we can either have them here (in the short term) or help her financially for a while but (in fairness and much as it pains me!!) he seemed to play fair with his other children!

She is spending the weekend with her sister so we might get some more info then on which to base an approach!

Thank you everyone for your input!

Kitty a member of our family was in a similar situation, and leaving him was the best thing she ever did.The 2 children were happier as well, and the younger the children are when this happens, the better.Your SIL can either buy her a small house somewhere that she chooses and stay in the family home himself, or he can have the smaller house and she gets the family home, or they sell up and split the proceeds.She may need a mortgage though, can she work at all?

I feel sorry for your daughterkitty but also worry for you, it sounds like it is piling up on you slowly but surely.

Make some ground rules that benefit everyone re the mess..

I have alway ssaid your life partner can make you or break you, and it sounds like this idiot has broken your daughter..

Try and get shot of him by distancing your precious family from him, so as to give your DD some breathing space and to be able to move on from this disaster.

I know it looks bad now Dear but things will turn around and get better

On the whole I don't think seperation should be taken lightly and think that children are better with two parents, but this is beginning to sound like one of the exceptions.
There is quite an age gap, SiL doesn't sound either helpful or empathetic and I think come the end of the year your daughter may have to seriously look at seperation. It's an awful strain for you but I think you just have to be the stabilising inluence for her and the children.

kittylester you must be exhausted with all the worry. Thank goodness your daughter has such a caring mum but you need some time for yourself too. When people get depressed it drains the life out of them, I'm glad your daughter is getting help. Her husband doesn't seem to be giving her any support at all (I'm not sure idiot is the word I'd use for him I could think of some stronger terms).

Sorry I have no wise words or helpful suggestions but feel desperately sorry for anyone suffering depression - it is the worst feeling. I hope your daughter can have some happiness in her life soon.

Thank you for your thoughtful replies.

I think Petallus has come up with a solution that chimes best with me at the moment but it is soooo difficult - we don't want her to take umbrage.

Kittylester I wonder if your daughter is still hoping to save her marriage. It's not always easy to leave a relationship which was once good and has now gone sour. People cling on hoping for improvement and you might have to wait until she is ready to go.

I agree with posters who have said an open discussion would be a good thing but I am wondering how possible this will be if your SIL is not prepared to co-operate. You might have more luck with your DD but I wouldn't push it too hard if she is reluctant.

At the very least you can (if you can find the strength) keep on supporting your daughter in the way you have been for as long as she needs it, which won't be forever.

As for the tidy house, well, you might have to let that go for a while though don't think I don't sympathise. I have a similar situation myself.

I'm wondering why she doesn't change the locks and leave his suitcase outside the door whilst he's away working! The children need their home back full time and perhaps starting divorce proceedings will help everything else fall into place. My DIL was married to an idiot (having met him several times at family events, I can confirm that he is). As soon as she asserted herself, got the children's routine in order and made it clear she was having no more of his nonsense, all of a sudden her 'depression' disappeared. It was hard going, but she had the support of her parents and sister, and three years later met my son - they have a happy relationship and looking back she wonders why she tolerated him for as long as she did. He has plenty of access to his children (often lets them down, so then it's set by DiL) and her ex knows her extended family is aware of his antics so he has to curb it these days.