Talking about death to young children

Love that Sussexpoet (On another thread, there was a suggestion for a 'like' box which would be great for this).

It's so true that children can be quite blasé about things that we adults find disturbing yet they can be really sensitive about things that are close to home and often not liable to happen.Only last week DGS found this fox skeleton which he found fascinating, and he is not at all afraid of seeing and touching dead things (unlike his grandma)

Last night we watched a really interesting programme on BBC4( can't remember the titile,or the presenter but I've seen her before and she makes astronomy really easy to understand) Anyway she was explaining the effect of the moon on the earth and I suddenly remembered one of my childhood terrors... if the earth just wobbles we could all fall off!!! I tried to get my dad to reassure me but when I said 'Why does the sea stay on the earth?'..........we were at sea in his little dinghy at the time....... his reply was 'Becaue it does'. Which was a great help(not!)

Talking about the programme afterwards with DH I realised that if DGS had been watchng it he would probably have thought it was fantastic...... everyone floating off into space.

When my youngest daughter first went to primary school, she became aware that I was a lot older than other children's mummies. Children being the little sadists they are, she was constantly told "Ooh, your mum's ever so old, she's going to die soon." She went and thought about this for a while and then made me promise that I wouldn't die until she was big enough to cook her own dinner! I duly promised and she was quite content. (I reminded her of this a few months ago - she is now 37 and an excellent cook and she was shocked that she could have said such a thing!) However, I assured her that my only thought at the time had been "that child will go far!" as indeed she did.I still have a quiet giggle when I recall the incident. So don't despair, children are not only resilient, they are also pragmatic.

absentgrandma I'm sorry your grandson was upset.

My grandson's daddy died when he was still weeks old and now at the age of four and a half he knows all about death, regularly visits his daddy's grave and is able to tell the story of how his daddy died. And yet, occasionally, he will become overwhelmed with sadness and cry for the daddy he never knew. We understand that this is because every now and then he processes the facts in a new way as he's growing up and maturing. I suspect this is also true of your grandson; it was always simply a matter of time before he realised that as animals die, so too will people. Perhaps this understanding was accelerated a little by what his teacher said (and we don't know the context for that), but your grandson's response couldn't have been predicted and his tears did provide your daughter with an opportunity to talk about the issue and give him reassurance.

Sorry Absent. The flack should be coming my way. Can I lend you my tin hat?
I didn't realise I was using half of someone's psuedo when I signed up for Gransnet. Remembering new passwords is bad enough but inventing forum IDs is even worse. No imagination, that's me

GrannyTwice Please note that the OP's forum monica is absentgrandma. In other words, "It wasn't me Miss".

Absent - I think you are bring a little harsh and unrealistic in your expectations of the teacher. As I said upthread, none of us knows at all the context of what was said. The idea that, especially with little ones, that there can be a clear line between teaching the curriculum and everything else seems bizarre to me.

I have posted about this before on a thread about first memories. When I was 2 years and eight months my three month old sister died of pneumonia. I can remember my grandmother answering the door, my parents were standing there and they said the baby had died. I was behind my grandmother in the middle of the room. The memory has always been very clear, so I would have been aware of death from a very young age. I remember feeling disappointed/sad, not sure which, but I also remember thinking of a big hand lifting the baby up to the sky. We weren't a religious family and I can't ever think why I thought that, but maybe it helped.

I was brought up next to a churchyard and it never bothered me as a child. I was fascinated by the graves even the ones of children. My parents were always matter of fact about death and I've tried to be the same - it makes life so much easier to be as honest as possible and as simple as possible for younger children. I've never hidden the fact that DD and DS had a brother and sister before them but answered their questions as simply as possible when they came across some little flowers encased in Perspex when they were poking round in a box of keepsakes. They never seemed to worry about it especially as we had umpteen pets over the years including mice from which they could ascertain a life cycle quite easily!

Difficult situation absentgrandma. I don't think anyone had told me about death at that age either.I did have a kitten that died [but that is not people.] I remember being about 7 and knowing people were buried in the churchyard, but it didn't bother me [seemed to have nothing to do with my life.]Anyway, going to a Catholic school we thought everyone went to Heaven and were very happy there.My grandson aged 9 often asks if I'm going to die soon [autistic children do worry more about death.]All children are scared of being alone in the world.It seems to me that the simplest answers are best for young children, regardless of what you believe yourself;give them hope and comfort at this age, by saying we will all go to Heaven. And who knows? maybe we all will.

No,no not at all Anya I really feel for you at this time and I'm sure you will find the right words to say to your GC. They are bound to ask some difficult questions and finding the right answers is going to be hard.As you're now their only other Grandmother they might ask some very unsettling questions about your longevity. Children can be so brutally honest without realising it, bless them. I hope this discuasion has provided you with a few thoughts to help you through the next few days .

I meant to say that the lad is 7

The grandmother of one of my grandson's friends died 6 months ago and they haven't yet told him for fear of how he will react .He didn't see her often because she lived abroad but I feel sorry they haven't given him the opportunity to grieve. I wouldn't like that to happen to me.

My 6 year old grandson was nearly 3 when his maternal granddad died, he saw him nearly every day, so they had to tell him. He was told that Grandad had died, and had gone to live in the sky. He still talks about Grandad in the sky. Although I knew from an early age that my father had died 6 months before I was born, I didn`t really think much about death until I was 11, and a little boy of 6, one of my grandma`s neighbours who I played with, died suddenly, and I went to his funeral. Then a few months later, my maternal Grandma died, she`d been staying with us for a few weeks and died at our house. On the day of the funeral I was taken upstairs before the lid was placed on the coffin, to say goodbye to her. Surprisingly, it didn`t really phase me, although I don`t think I`d like it now.

But his teacher would have had to have had a word with every mum in the class, and not knowing the context, her comment could have been almost an aside.

The difficulty is that teachers - and indeed parents cannot know what element of something will suddenly distress a child. When DD was about 6 she bought a Noddy book at the school fete, read it and then 8 year old DS picked up to read in bed. Half an hour later I had him downstairs, in tears and inconsolable. The Noddy story featured a naughty monkey and in the end he was arrested and put in prison. DS was deeply upset because the monkey wasn't deliberately naughty, he just didn't know what the rules were in Noddy land and DS was in a state because he considered it to be unjust and unfair to lock the monkey up for breaking rules he didn't know existed. It took me an hour or more to calm him down and get him to bed and asleep.

His reaction was in character but unexpected. It happens to parents, it happens to teachers. It is not their fault that they do not always know where in individual child's sensitivity lies, nor what may cause a sensitivity.

I think the difference between what your grandson already knew about death and what he has just realised is the finality of it absentgrandma and also the realisation that it comes to us all. It's a hard concept to take in.

Are you cross with me for something I said?

I agree with so many of the posts here. I cannot remember a time my GC, 5 and 7 now didn't know of death. They both love learning of nature, the seasons, finding squashed bugs in the garden and as they live in the countryside finding the odd squashed wildlife on the country roads around their village.
I have gently flagged up that at 55 I am not so sprightly as their other Gran of 72. The GC only know I am sometimes a bit "poorly" (cancer) and I think like most young children they had assumed we all die in chronological order.
DD had the Badger's Parting Gifts book and I recommend the wonderful book by Julia Donaldson, The Paper Dolls, the circle of life beautifully told.

I'm so glad this has helped someone Anya. Death is inevitable ( like paying taxes) and my DGS has spent all his life in the countryside where death of animals is accepted. He and his mum found a mummified fox in a field while blackberry picking last week and he was fascinated. So, to the posters who have implied he should have been taught about the finality of death before now... perhaps she should have delivered him the 'Life and Death' lecture then . Naughty Mummy!

Perhaps where we have gone wrong is by being a family with longevity in their genes. (this is with tongue in cheek for those who don't get my warped sense of humour). Sickness and death have not come into his spectrum yet.... lucky..... or unlucky?? He's still a child, the dark side of life should be...well, a year off at least.

My anger is directed at the teacher who didn't bother to have that quiet word with his mum. His little brain couldn't take in the fact that his mummy and daddy were not going to suddenly die and leave him, a child, all alone. I thought teachers studied child psychology these days..... in this case obviously not.

I do hope your GCs have a positive attitude when you pick them up Anya
It is such a difficult subject and can have a devastating effect on childen. As a Christian I believe there is something (I really don't know what) after we have left this life and that is what I would try to convey to my DGS in the event of a death in the family. (Grabs tin hat and dives below the parapet before the flack starts.)

Yes! That's the one. It does feel sad when you have to teach a child about the less pleasant aspects of life, but you are doing them a huge favour in the long run.

Do you mean 'Badger's Parting Gifts' Janerowena? It's about a badger who dies and his friends talk about their memories of him and the things he taught them. Lovely book.

Teachers are there to teach, and would be criticised by many others for ducking the issue, the poor things can't win! They have to teach sex, bullying, about relationships and religious customs - why would death be omitted?

My son was four when he asked me about death. It was hard to explain, but it was his great-grand-father's funeral and I thought he should start to understand. His grandma bought him an excellent little book written by the Percy's Park author. I remember it was narrated by a badger. I shall have to look it up.

I don't fear death, I wanted to bring my children to not think of it as a taboo subject. Keeping a pet is also an excellent way to prepare children for death - even if it's only a woodlouse! Nothing can lessen the grief, but knowing about it can lessen the shock. I was eight and I think that's too late, I remember running home every day from school to check that my mother and sisters were still alive.

I cannot remember ever not understanding what death was. It was spoken about regularly at church, not fire and brimstone, just a fact of life. One of my grandfathers died in WW1 so I knew I only had one grandfather because the other one was dead and that he died when my mother was only a very young child. I cannot say it ever bothered me.

Skipping DC whose experiences were similar, DGC, now aged 7 and 4 have known, almost since birth, that Grandpa Tom died when Mummy was only 5 and is buried in the grounds of the church they attend, they have visited his grave, that I have a sister who died in a road accident. They have also had to cope with the death of family friends.

Like others I am really surprised that a child could get to the age of 5 without knowing about death and what it means.

I would imagine it probably never occurred to the teacher that any child of 5 would not know or be aware of the concept of death. It wouldn't occur to me.

Thanks for all your replies, I will read them all thoroughly later. I don't know what happened this morning as I haven't bothered DD yet... I can vaguely remember what school mornings were like!

The last I heard (late yesterday eve.) was that DGS was sitting on DDs knee talking about their elderly labrador who will probably pop his clogs soon, and also Grandpa... who I hope will not, any time soon. It was quite fortuitous because he (G.pa) was 86 yesterday, and he and DGS had a long chat on Skype at tea time when he got home from school. He (DGS) was as bright and cheerful as ever (so was G.pa for that matter) so perhaps that was what triggered DGS's upset. He was probably mulling it all over in bed when what the teacher said came back to him.DD used her dad's age to illustrate that not everyone dies when their children need them, and when G.pa dies we will all be sad but we will have so many happy memories the sadness will fade in time.

I am not inhibited about discussing death or relationships, sexual or otherwise, with children or adults... far from it... my DDs sometimes say'Too much information, Mum' when I discuss their father! But I do not think these subjects are within the remit of the teaching profession. Their job is to teach to the curriculum which is too burdensome anyway, as we are always hearing ( I can hear the collective ruffling of feathers from the retired teachers on the forum)

As I said in my post death is such a tricky one for children it should be discussed at home in a calm, secure environment . If DGS had brought up the subject himself with his teacher, would it have been too much for said teacher to have had a quiet word with DD when she went to pick him up??

Must get some work done now, but I'll read all your replies with interest. Thanks again.

This thread has helped me. As I mentioned in my post it's only 24 hours since my two young GSs lost their other Grandma and this is something we are going to have to deal with as a family, and I will be picking them up from school today.

I hope it's helped you too absentgrandma

I agree with all that has been said and would commend the teacher for not ducking out of the question. I am surprised that a child would get to the age of 5 and not ask questions at home about it. Death is all around us even if it is a wild bird or the leaves from the trees. My grandson with autism has been asking about it ever since he could talk with questions such as gillybob mentioned : "how do you know when you are dead?"
"will you be happy when you are dead?" and "will you come back to life again ?"(a difficult one if you have different religious views from the parents ).A somewhat amusing incident happened when we took him to the Natural History Museum aged 5.He hadn't quite grasped the concept of "extinct" and asked will Auntie A (a much loved great aunt who had died the year previously ) be here? When we said she would not he replied "well she is extinct "
I love the analogy of the glove purpledaffodil