Difficulties with grandchildren's nanny (employed person, not other grandparent).

Cornergran, your last two sentences really hit the nail on the head. Whatever happens, my husband & I and the other grandma want what's best for our children & grandchildren. This makes us vulnerable yet uniquely valuable. I have to believe that my daughter knows this in her heart, even if the stresses of daily life get in the way. I'm trying to be philosophical about this situation ... also recognising that, in so many ways, it's a trivial problem compared to what others have to face in their lives. Thank you all for your empathy and thoughtful suggestions.

Another suggestion is to have the other Grandma with you at THE meeting, or telephone her to get her input to present to your daughter. I think you can prove that the Nanny is systematically destroying "good contact". It's not as if your daughter is the Royal Family, or President of USA now is it, although I do appreciate how busy she and her husband might be.

mutti, this obviously is very painful for all the grandparents and yes, there is a risk that your grandchildren will lose out. I am intrigued that the nanny takes out the younger child and leaves you with your elder granddaughter, do you know where they go? Is it something that is only available on that particular day or perhaps something not appropriate for the older girl? If you can find out gently, or get your husband to, that might help you both to argue knowledgeably for a different day/time. I so hope your husband will be successful in his negotiations. I can understand your instinctive reaction, really don't think you can be blamed for it, your frustration came from a place of love. Don't give up, I am sure your daughter will understand eventually. She is very reliant on the nanny and there may be a desire, not necessarily conscious, to keep her happy. She will know you will stick with her no matter what, she doesn't know the same about the nanny.

Lewlew even so, if her employer told her that it was important and a condition of her employment / key task in her role, she'ld probably do it.

If the daughter is happy with how the nanny is prioritising things / running things, which she is from the sounds of it, then the OP is falling pretty far down her list of priorities and it's between mother and daughter, not between the OP and the nanny if you see what I mean?

ETA
Not that the nanny could or should not be in charge whilst parents are also there, it's the overbearing verbal attitude that is strange....

notanan OP says in her second post...

This nanny seems to need to be 'top dog', even to the extent of denigrating my daughter's & son-in-law's parenting skills - never mind my competence: she says things to the children like "You only mess around with your food when Granny's here" or "I'm in charge even when Mummy & Daddy are here; you behave for me".

Sounds like the nanny is the source and not the messenger. She seems to be controlling this family. If the daughter allows this, how very strange.... JMHO

Why is it more important for your GCs to have a nanny-structured social life than a warm loving relationship with their grandparents?

is a question for the OPs daughter not for the nanny

I'm betting that if the nanny's employers told her that faciliating the kids relationship with the grandparents was a condition of her job, she'ld do it regardless of her personal opinions.

But we don't know how much really is the nannies opinions here or if she's being the mouthpiece of the parents personal priorities here and it's sort of "shoot the messenger" and she's taking the fall - after all she did suggest that the OP take it up with her daughter if she wasn't happy with it

Why is it more important for your GCs to have a nanny-structured social life than a warm loving relationship with their grandparents?

I wonder what kind of upbringing the nanny had... I wonder what the nanny tells her charges about their grandparents?

to you!

Is it possible that you don't have a Nanny problem so much as a daughter problem

^ before I read that quote that was exactly what I was wondering.

If your daughter felt that your weekday time with your grandchildren was a priority she would instruct the nanny to prioritise it. This is your issue.

I think there are many circumstances where a nanny could rightfully say "just because mum and dad are here doesn't mean I'm in charge" e.g. if the arrangement is that the nanny is still on duty for home work or childcare while the parents cooked dinner or did some paper work or finished up a bit of work from home.

I just feel so sorry for you, and also the other Grandma. The extra detail you have given provides a lot more information. I can understand how you must feel. Perhaps you might be better with a conversation with your daughter saying you feel very left out. It's not as if you have done anything wrong in all this, you come across as so caring and loving - very sad. It does sound to me as if the Nanny is making up all the rules as she goes along. Goodness me, she is the one being paid for her services, and if you for instance want to take the children out or play with them or whatever you and they might want to do, you are still family and she is not.

Zorro, the children are 3 & 6 years old ( three and a half and just turned six, to be eaxact); one is in her second year of primary school, the other will start school - rather young cos she's summer born - next September.
I think I've inadvertently given an inaccurate picture of what my DD & SIL do at the weekends: they are not busy with their own social lives to the exclusion of their children - they are getting together with friends, some old some new, who also have children and thus maintaining a lovely friendship group for themselves & all children. DH and I did the same as young parents. Obviously, though, this does not often include grandparents. Indeed, when DD & SIL want to go out without the children, that's great because we or the other grandma get to babysit, which both we & the children enjoy. The other thing which takes up their weekends is the endless round of birthday parties which all children seem to go to these day. (Now I sound like an old fogey!).
Because my daughter works full-time, it has suited her for grandparents to see something of the children during the working week, as she then knows that good contact is being maintained. This current nanny, however, never wanted this arrangement and is becoming more & more resistant. She has told me that it is more appropriate for children to see their grandparents & other family members at weekends and that I should take it up with my daughter if I feel that 30 minutes per fortnight with the little one means DH & I are not seeing enough of her. On the fortnightly visits the nanny allows 30-40 minutes with the youngest child before whisking her off out ('for her social life'), and DH & I then have the older child for another two and a half hours.
The reason for the particular falling out on Tuesday was because I was told by the nanny that the usual 30 minutes with the youngest child would not happen this week .. and when I asked the reason, I was given two different and equally spurious reasons for it. Unfortunately (and unwisely) I showed that I was unhappy about this and it led to her accusing me of being rude to her (in challenging her? Okay a bit crossly, I admit). And thus we have the present situation.

Do we know how old the grandchildren are ?

I think the grandmother should just continue to turn up unannounced, and ignore the Nanny complaining, just enjoy the sort of interaction she wants with her grandchildren. I suggest she takes them out of the house for an educational trip out. She has to make some sort of stand otherwise she risks not seeing them at all. This is such a ridiculous situation.

Oh what a difficult situation and I sincerely hope you manage to all come to some sort of an agreement that works for everyone, but most importantly you maintain regular contact with your grandchildren. The role of a grandparent is to be a link between children and parents, telling them stories about their mummy and daddy when they were young, being able to play and enjoy the grandchildren without the pressure that they had when they were parents themselves, trying to juggle lots of balls in the air, ( and in my case usually failing miserably) In other words, be part of their lives, their history ! All too soon they grow up and are busy at Uni or whatever but its good if there has been a special bond created when they were younger.

I have two grandchildren, whom I see every other week, because I look after them one day a week. On the weeks the other grandparents step in, I arrange a day to suit my daughter when we can come and simply be grandparents/parents rather than childminders.

I genuinely hope this all works out for you, I have a sneaking suspicion and I hope I'm wrong but your daughter and son in law is between a rock and a hard place, and if this nanny is otherwise perfect and allows her and her husband to work with peace of mind and come home to a well organised household, then be prepared for conflict of interest and the need for compromise, However, it has to be discussed and its imperative for you all to be able to move forward in a way that suits everyone. Mention some of the excellent suggestions from other posters here would be a good starting point .

On a lighter note, I wonder does Carol Middleton have this kind of problem ?

This situation doesn't just reflect your loss - your grandchildren are also losing out too!
Grandparents who are loving and caring play a very crucial role in children's lives.

I cannot resist saying that if anyone, no matter who they were, spoke to my mother like that, they would regret it. Given her capacity for rudeness, I don't believe that this nanny is fit for purpose. I also think there is definitely a "behind closed doors" agenda with her.

I really hope that you will resolve this and your daughter takes everything into account.

I respect what you say merlotgran .This is why Gransnet is so great. Everyone is allowed a voice to express their opinion. Nowhere in real life would we be able to contact such a diverse range of people to help us with our problems. I find, in real life, people sometimes say what they think you want to hear, rather than give a true opinion.

Can't agree with your last sentence, Flossieturner. The SIL's mother has already been scared off by the nanny. Does he not care about that and won't the children be missing out on the lack of contact with her?

No way would either of my daughters allow an employee to drive a wedge between us and our DGCs.

You sound far too sensible to "show your daughter this thread". Most likely, the things that would stick in her mind would be some of the extreme opinions expressed and the very judgemental opinions about the Nanny, your Dd and SiL based on just a few lines from a GM with genuine concerns. I think she would be quite insulted.

Your DD and SIL obviously see their children thriving under this Nanny, they would not employ her otherwise.

First and foremost like many others have said this nanny sounds like a control freak and I d be VERY VERY concerned. If she is saying very decisive things to the children in front of you it beggars belief what she is saying or doing when no ones around and she surely doesn't want anyone around for some reason

Secondly and this is going to sound critical of your daughter and son in law but if they have highly stressful, full on working lives and they like to socialise at weekends where do the children fit into this equation I guess it's me but I can never understand how some people have such important lives that they've allow someone else, a complete stranger, to bring up their children.

joannewton46 i dont think many parents would be brave enough to ask their child what they thought of childcare staff, the truth hurts !

I'm sorry but I would have it straight out with your daughter. We no longer live in Victorian days where Nanny ruled the roost. Her behaviour is absolutely inexcusable and as for the idea of you having to arrange a day and time to see the children, that is unbelievable.

As has been suggested, it may be that your daughter would prefer you not to spend too much time with them, in which case you will sadly have to accept it. If, on the other hand, she has not realised the full extent of Nanny's dictatorial attitude, she may wake up to what has been happening. There are plenty of other nannies and I'm sure you and the other grandma would be happy to bridge the gap until a replacement is found.

I so agree that u have to tread carefully, you really don't want your daughter feeling defensive. However, I wonder if it would be possible to show your daughter this whole thread. Apart from a couple of posts which I feel are a bit strong (sorry!) maybe it would do her.good to see that the overwhelming feeling is that the nanny is completely out of order (& even possibly a bad influence, at best, on her children.
The only other point I would like to make is that I do feel it is irrelevant if other Grandparents don't see their gc as much, this has obviously been right for your family up until now & so perfectly reasonable to expect time with them still. Good luck x

Mutti, I do agree with what Crafting has said. Sadly, as we know only too well, grandparents don't have an automatic right to see their grandchildren and you do need to tread carefully.
Let your husband mediate but, under no circumstances would I criticise the Nanny. Your daughter and son in law are dependent upon her and it does sound like she has them over the proverbial barrel.
I would try and keep things simple, obviously asking how they are, how work is going etc. Then, perhaps you could say that you have seen some sort of activity advertised (swimming or something similar) that you would like to take the children to and would this be possible once a week/fortnight or whenever.
As much as I agree the Nanny is out of order I honestly feel any negative comments about her will go down like a lead balloon and your only hope is to be nice (should I say smarmy) to them

mutti Neither words of wisdom nor outrage from me, purely (((hugs))) to you both and the other grandmother. It sounds as though the parents and nanny of these little ones are either ignorant or unaware of the precious bond between children and grandparents. Some of us are lucky and see each other regularly, others can only afford to visit rarely or have to rely on letters and skype/phone calls. I wish you well in finding an acceptable way forward that suits children, parents and grandparents

Actually, you can't be too careful when you are leaving your precious children in the care of others.

the nanny has argued my daughter into only sending her three mornings a week even though she has to pay for five.

She is, though, planning to take the GCs to visit her own sister & family.

I presume she has been vetted.