Alone time with grandparents.

OP, congrats on your little family and it’s soon to grow by one!

I noticed a couple of things in your posts:

You have a “grandparents expectations” problem. You siblings have set an expectation regarding their children and their parents, and you parents want to apply that to you. It’s understandable, but it doesn’t mean you have to change anything. They are wrong.

Be very very careful about setting any kind of formal or regular alone time with them. Based on your posts they will come to feel it is “their time” with you son and you will be on a custody arrangement with them. Any changes to the “schedule” will have them crying, demanding their time. It will get ugly. Your parents have a hard time separating different people and their relationships with those different people. Be kind to your parents by not letting hem set an expectation of alone time with your child on a schedule.

Keep the “alone time” with any of your children at the convenience of your family. Healthy grandparents with evolved lives don’t bees to demand alone time with someone else’s child. It’s highly inappropriate. They do not need your child to make them happy. They need to find happiness in their own lives and at the stage they are currently living.

Don’t listen to anyone who tells you that your child “needs” grandparents. It’s a self serving manipulation tactic. Your child needs a loving family. That family is made up of well balanced people with your child’s best interest at heart. It if you and your partner, siblings. If it includes grandparents that you, as the mom, enjoy being around great. If not, no big deal. Your child’s family is also made up of others who truly care about your child. Teachers, friends, parents of their friends, mentors. Just because your parents share DNA with your child does not make them qualified for alone time to qualified to influence your child.

Please, do not make any changes between now and when the new baby comes. This will be a critical time for your child. Soak up as much family time you can as a family of 3. Once the new baby comes hunker down as a new family of 4. The absolute worst thing your can do to your 3 year old is change their routine while your family changes so drastically. Do not send your child away. That would be awful for your child. It’s a hard transition, welcoming a sibling, don’t make it harder by taking tour son away from his mom and dad.

Above all, don’t ever do anything you are not comfortable with regarding your children. Listen to that feeling that told your your parents request isn’t right. Their demand, their expectations, their wording is all very wrong and a warning sign.

You are a great mom. Don’t let anyone in your life or on this forum make you believe any different.

Keep doing what you’re doing. Hugs!

Great reply Mcem !!

Talk to your parents OP … it REALLY is that simple.

People keep citing preparing for an emergency for a reasob why these children should "practice" sleeping over but those posters are missing the fundamental link: these GPs are not behaving as part of the OPs support system anyway, so may not be the ones she would turn to in a crisis, particularly if they are the kind if people who would just make her feel worse at an already stressful time.

GPs who are close to their ACs will naturally see a lot of their GCs and form the support system in emergencies etc.

GPs who dont have a good relationship with the ACs cant expect to form part of the inner circle, especially in a crisis like another child or partner in hospital. In those situations the OP would want people who make her feel better not worse around.

mcem

I agree, our grandchildren aren’t visitors, as you say they’re just a part of the family, even my more distant grandchildren treat it as home

My little grandson, without thinking, called me mummy the other day, I told him I wasn’t mummy, and he said , you are, you’re my spare mummy!

I don't think it is unusual for kids go spend time at their grandparents without the larents but it's the way these grandparents are demanding it that seems so strange and a little bit "off" to me. I'd be wonder I g what they'd want next.

Has anyone asked the child what he wants?

It's all very well for grandparents to want "alone time" (totally unnecessary, IMHO, as that is). But what does the child want? If he wants to be alone with his grandparents, fine. If his mum is happy with that, all is well. But what if he doesn't? What if he doesn't want to be away from his mum unnecessarily? Children don't need to be sacrificed to grandparental whims and wishes.

OP, before you make arrangements for your 3 year old to stay with grandparents, ask him if he wants to go. A 3 year old is old enough to say yes or no.

When my nephews were little, one would happily stay overnight, and the other never. Some children can handle it and some can't. My DS wouldn't have handled even a few hours at 3. He would now that he's 6, but his grandparents are too old and frail now to be left alone with him for long.

I think the important thing here is not that some of us are privileged to enjoy jolly jelly-making time with our GC, but that the OP is being placed in the position where critical parents are wanting to dictate how and when they spend time with the OP's own child. That is fundamentally wrong.

Less theory, more practice. Less navel-gazing, more fun

So true mcem - do we blame “the other place” or the proliferation of “parenting” books and theories? !

Yes sarah. When did spending the night at Gran's morph into "unsupervised time alone"??

My GCs aren't visitors, they're just part of my family who spend time here.
Op's family seem mutually suspicious and more concerned with criticizing, reacting to that criticism, access, bonding etc. 21st century dilemma?

Solution? Take the initiative.

Relax. Have a walk to the play park together. Leave DS with GPs at play park while you pop to the shops, meeting up at their home half an hour later. Chat about what a lovely time he had and ''now that he's a big boy'' wouldn't he like to take granny and grandpa to the park again next week!

Less theory, more practice. Less navel-gazing, more fun!

mcem

I totally agree, I’ve had two of them staying quite a lot lately, over a week when baby was born, another week when she had to go back into hospital, then daughter was ill,

It’s home from home, they always enjoy it, I won’t say I’m not happy to hand them back! But it’s no big deal, there’s always spare pyjamas and toothbrushes, they have their own rooms, it’s very casual.

I have six grandchildren. I have never asked such a thing of my children. I see my grandchildren every couple of weeks and feel close to them. It is up to your daughter to decide such a thing anyway...I really don't think you should have asked. Just my opinion of course

When DGC 4 was born she had to be in NICU for 10 days. If the other 3 hadn't been happy and confident to spend time (alone) with me, then it would have been extremely difficult all round.
They 've always spent time including overnight with me from the time they stopped breastfeeding and are relaxed and very much at home here.
It simply wasn't a big deal.
Is that organic enough?

Classic

I don't know if you saw all of the OP's posts, but it sounds as if her parents are frequently criticizing her parenting and are effectively demanding that she set aside alone time for her son to see them once a week.

That's not okay. If someone was constantly criticizing me, I would never allow my child alone with them.

OP if they prefer to critcise you rather than support you what makes you think they'll treat their grandchildren better than their own child once they are "unsupervised"?

When my grandchildren are with me alone, we make jelly, paint pictures make puppets, go play on the swings and have a good laugh together, chat and build a relationship, when their mum is there too, we sit and have a cup of tea, children play or watch TV, its completely different, and I must admit I kind of like my alone with them time more. You do sound a bit more than just anxious, perhaps your parents don't feel able to build a relationship with their grandchildren while you are being overly 'protective'

I have never been asked that question by either set of parents in the past but I would find it strange. If they babysit then isnt that time when they spend with him without you? Not sure. x

I've read through recent posts and support Callistemon's view that if your parents are critical, no wonder you're anxious.
Relationships, family relationships can be so exhausting. Look after yourself OP. You have a new baby coming and it sounds as though unfinished emotional stuff with your parents. You're the most important person here, you are your 3 year olds life and that will be even more significant when the babe arrives. If you don't trust your parents to have 'specific individual time' with your children, don't be bullied into it. If you do trust them, grab the opportunity for some support x

If your parents are critical then I am not surprised you feel anxiety.

I think the consensus of opinion across Gransnet is to ferme la bouche, good advice for grandparents.

Solonge. You sound like a magical Granny! I think, as always happens on a thread such as this, people like you who have such a wonderful relationship with your grandchildren and who also enjoyed a lovely relationship with your own GPs, tend to imagine that, if we just allow the two generations some time together, all will be as lovely as it was for us. There was a thread about mothers not long ago that brought out this similar division of people's experiences. Those who had enjoyed a loving and close relationship with their mother could not understand the problems of the person who was in turmoil trying to deal with her very elderly mother.

Not all parents are the same. This OP does not have parents like your grandparents for example. I would imagine that were she to listen to you describing a typical day with your GPs it would be totally different to what she might imagine her son having with his GPs - her parents, because she did not have such a happy relationship with them.

I was concerned from the first because of the way the GPs wanted this time on a regular basis and were demanding it and there was no kind of natural dialogue such as their offering to look after him or asking if there would be a good day when they could come and pick him up to help their daughter. They were merely giving orders expecting her compliance. That is how it came across and how it comes across is all-important because that it how it felt for the OP.

I would imagine you would never speak to your son or daughter about looking after the grandchildren in the way these GPs did! From the way you have described your relationship the whole warmth and joy of it comes across. You are not severe and critical, unsupportive and looking for something to be rude about, which is what comes across here. This poor girl did not stand a chance and it is hardly surprising that she suffered from anxiety!
It is noticeable how gentle, kind and polite she is. Do you see how often she thanks us? How she hopes she has not upset any of us? People do not develop a style and awareness like that by chance. There are different ways of observing people and one is through the dialogue, the words they use. I did a little training in this. I saw that this was a person who went beyond caring about people, she needed to please people, she would feel terrible if she upset anyone and would apologise to you if you bumped into her. I was the same. I recognise this. We usually have similar mothers or fathers or both. They are not like your grandparents.

frenchfrogz. Thank you - your message crossed with mine above! I think I understand. Bless you. Don't lose your confidence. If people are in the habit of being critical towards you or constantly putting you down - even as a joke - it is so easy to take it in and start thinking of yourself as not as good as you really are. So if you need to, then limit your contact. Also bolster yourself up with anything that helps (not from a bottle -it stops helping very fast!) I found a lot of useful YouTube videos but not knowing exactly the situation I won't name them. If you just put in the search bar what you need such as "how to set boundaries with controlling people" loads will come up. I liked Stephanie Lyn and many others. Just keep your spirits up and trust yourself. I do hope your DH is understanding. Unfortunately I had a mother a bit like yours and married far too young to an older man who was like my mother! Maybe that was why eventually I became a Psychologist!! But I sincerely wish you a very happy life, one over which you have control and with loving people around you, who respect you and want the best for you.
Lots of love Elle ???

First let's just get BlueBelle "I m sure they just feel that the daughter is being unnecessarily clingy" dealt with: This could not be true unless they are stupid as he goes to Nursery.
I think the OP's explanation, "I am reluctant because it comes across as more of a demand/“this is my right”
because the idea that they didn’t want me around was strange to me." made a big impression on many of us. No Grandparents have the right to dictate to their child when and how they may see their grandchild.
Again, had BlueBelle been looking she would have seen:

"(he)had his first overnight stay at 18 months. I made sure I wouldn’t need to rely on help from others, and just never got out of that habit.
I would like them to ask me when they’d like to have him, without making a formal weekly agreement."

The OP also says " I’ve only ever done the same as my siblings, which is ask for Parents to look after him when I need them too. It’s just much less than the other siblings ask for". (because she goes out less often.)

For me, the situation is summed up by MawBroonsback saying: "The bottom line for me, is, who are these regular visits for?" and says that it is not ok if the GPs are doing it to assert their right.
The problem was the attitude of the GPs, who stipulated this regular arrangement and di not communicate that they would like to see more of their GS until they announced this.
I would like frenchfrogz to tell her parents what she told us (above) about asking her when they would like to have him and not making a formal arrangement.

However, if picking him up from Nursery and giving him tea is a solution then that's great!! Good! ????

(I don't want to spoil it but... if they are picking him up? is that right? Grandparents pick him up from Nursery? - If so... why couldn't they offer to pick him up from you other times? - just wondering... They seem to want everything to suit them and don't think about how it fits your week - and you are, a mum of a toddler, pregnant, and you go out to work as well as the housework.... ). Please make people do what suits you and not what suits them!! You deserve it! I hate to say this but I am retired, and I was a Psychologist and I did do Counselling and most Clients were depressed women who took on too much and were bullied all round, by parents, husbands, bosses even adult children... So please don't let it happen to you my dear!

And please frenchfrogz, don't let your parents or any of your family boss you around!

Good luck with the baby! Second births are usually so much easier!! Please tell us how it goes. Wishing you, your little man aged 3, new baby to come, and dear Husband every happiness, Elle. ???☺️?????????? (some things for the little man!)

If they're criticizing your parenting, that needs to stop. I'd suggest just telling them straight, "Mum, Dad, this is not acceptable. I will parent my son as I see fit. If you continue to discuss this, this visit will be ending." Then, if they continue, you leave.

If your son sees them continually criticizing you, that will teach him that it's okay to criticize Mum. Grandma and Grandpa do it, and Mum brings him around to see them, which means they're safe people.

If after a couple of ended visits they still continue to criticize you, you may just need to tell them, "Look. I feel disrespected when you criticize my parenting. I have told you this before and you have continued to do so. Therefore, you will not be seeing me or my son until you are able to stop doing that."

That's not withholding your son from them. That's protecting him from toxic influences. Being "family" doesn't give them a right to criticize and complain. If they're mad because you won't see them because they can't control themselves, they have no one to blame except themselves.

Tillybelle thank you, i wish I could share more about how they went about bringing this subject up. It would be too “outing” but yes this isn’t there only problem with me or my parenting, and I think after this discussion it did make me want to withdraw from them for a while.
However, I didn’t. I want to resolve our relationship, I would never want to be accused of withholding my children from them on top of all the other complaints about me.
I posted to this site because I wanted opinions and advice from people more my parents age, to understand them better. And because yes at the moment I don’t really have a parental figure to go to.
I do appreciate everyone who’s taken time to post. I hope o haven’t offended anyone.

I think I see where you are coming from, I used to religiously take my two oldest children to my mothers every week, as soon as we got there she’d give me a magazine to read, and take them out, never once asking if I would like to go.

I now spend quite a lot of one to one time with my grandchildren, but always enjoy it more if my daughters are with us. I like being with my girls, and would prefer all of us be together

Solonge

The GPs already see this child weekly and do periodic childcare for him as needed.

They are asking for OP to commit to sending him to their home on a weekly basis for 1:1 time.

That's bizarre, to me.

At this age he does not need to practice being separated from Mummy, especially when there is a new baby on the way.