I’m quite disturbed about this, is it acceptable?

I agree with Shandy. Put a secret camera in her room. You might get a shock.

An old school friend opened a care home many years ago. Her daughter took over when she retired. I chatted to both about this and as normal in this establishment, residents joined in the conversation. ( our conversation took place in a lounge where residents can sit and chat comfortably )
The two residents who joined us were both former professionals, both who can no longer walk unaided but have great fun scooting about on small mobility scooters. The general opinion of all 4 ladies was that the patients daughter should ask whoever runs the care home for a private chat. And instead of attempting to explain the matter, should show him or her what has been published in Gransnet.

I would say it is a fixation period your mother is going through. It is the only thing she has left in her life to control, so she is using her power to hold on to it. As long as you keep agreeing to run around for these things the longer and the worse it will get. The word here is distraction. when she asks for thing tell her it is available at the home then change the subject, keep repeating that if she keep asking. When she asks for money, say the home is holding it for her when she needs it, which will be rare perhaps for the hairdresser and things like that. She should not have money, the care home should be holding any monies for her. Speak with the Manager and get to know their regulations so you can quote them to your mother once and twice then keep saying no it is against the rules of the homes. The carers is totally out of order they cannot accept gifts in any shape or form from residents, only from you which is a gift for the home and therefore for all the staff, not one individual carer. Stick to it and it will soon be something else on your mothers agenda, sadly that is how it is whether the loved one is in care or at home.

Being a carer isn't an,appropriate job to take tips, because of the vulnerability of the customers.
It would be far too easy to coerce somebody - hence the tight rules.

I can imagine you mum probably kept asking the poor cared what her favourite tipple was and now the carer should be disciplined?! Having some money to tip people who were kind to her is surely ok - I can imagine wanting to do that myself. Unless she has dementia I think you’re being unreasonable. It’s her money!

This is not acceptable. You need to speak to whoever is in charge at the home about this.
Regarding asking you to buy things. This could be controlling behaviour or possibly a little bit of confusion. You need to make her aware that she doesn't need these things and you aren't going to do it.

Residents in care homes loose so much autonomy over their lives and their day to day choices and decisions, that it’s not uncommon for them to frequently ask for random items to be acquired for them. Not only do they get to decide on some minor purchases but it often means another visit by a loved one to bring it in.
My late mil did this all the time but we just humoured her and got what she’d asked for as soon as we could.
As for the bottle of drink, I’d maybe say you were only able to get miniatures. Take her in a couple of the mini ones and if she likes it you could bring a couple in a week.
Elderly people have the right to a few pleasures just like the rest of us and I can’t see the harm in the odd tipple. You’re a long time dead my mum used to say ! X

I would really speak to the manager as I really don't think your mum should be buying alcohol for the carer and I would hate to think that they have hinted and put it in her head....
As for the shopping I would just say to your mum, when she asks for groceries, that you have already paid for her 3 meals when you arrived that day and you have no more cash to get her any more food and you would bring toiletries with you the next time. Take time out for yourself and your husband now, you deserve it.

My late Mum's home kept a maximum of £70 as spending money and gave an itemised receipt for every penny. She should not have cash in her room.

I don't know if you are asking the right question, to be honest!
The main thing I would have thought is why is she asking you to buy things for her at all ?
I don't see it as her trying to control you at all - she may not realise why she needs you to get things for her - may possibly be that if she has dementia, and the reason that she asks may be out of habit , that she is stuck in some kind of time warp from when you were younger .
As long as the home is aware that she is asking you to shop for her , that is the main thing. She needs to be seen by her doctor and next time she asks you to buy something, maybe you should either say they no longer stock it, or it is out of stock and you will get one with your groceries.
You should have support from the people at the home while you deal with this as they are really the best people to advise and help.

Maddyone, I apologise if I have written anything that makes your decision harder. My own mother was in a 'home' and I still worry about her expreiences there.

I have a problem knowing what a controlling relationship is. On the one hand parents have to control their children for the children's sake and on the other hand children need to be able to take reasonable risks so they can learn.

My MIL (of sound mind, could debate politics with anyone!) started hoarding in the last year or two of her life. She got quite anxious if we tried to throw anything out.

My mum always said there was no need to go hungry if there was a tin of soup in the house.
Perhaps it gives Maddys mum a sense of security (which we all need) to know she has one in stock.

Not everything has to have sinister undertones.

What on earth is happening to the tins of soup etc.? Do the care home staff for instance heat them up for your Mother?why don't you just tell your Mother she has no need for a the stuff she is having brought in to her. Where on earth does she keep the stuff. My knowledge of care homes is quite extensive prior to retiring and space is usually needed for safe mobility and care needs so limited amounts of cupboards etc. in rooms. Check with management what the "gift" policy is, would be surprised if the particular care worker isn't reprimanded for her part.

I asked my friend who as worked as a manager in a care home for 15yrs and she said on no account are staff allowed to take gifts. And even if it’s a birthday gift for any member of staff it has to go through her first and also a family member. Have you ever thought of putting a spy camera in her room.

Staff are not allowed to accept gifts as it is classed as favouritism. The carer maybe doing this to gain things she wants. I worked as a Deputy Manager of a nursing home for over 10 years and my staff were not allowed to accept any gifts and it was a stackable offence if they did.

I work in a care home and a few things.
Regarding the food... Is she confident and able to ask for the products from her carers? It could be she isn't confident enough to ask for things she would like. Or she has asked and the carers have said they don't have that and your mother doesn't know they can get it for her.

As for the money, we have a few who like to have money on them in their purses, mainly due to being in the habit. We have to explain daily that they don't have to pay for anything.
Ask your family if she has given money to any of them? If not then maybe have a word with the manager, they may have put it in a safe for safe keeping, or can keep an eye out for it (we've found all sorts that has been "lost" and turned up hidden inside a pair of socks, inside a bag, in a suitcase on top of a wardrobe we didn't think they could reach.

And the bottle of alcohol for the staff member.... We aren't allowed to accept gifts like that. Speak to a manager about it.

I can see how alarm bells are ringing (asking for alcohol and possible missing money) so definitely speak to a manager and not the carer in question.

You need to speak to whoever in in charge at your mother's care home.

Start by mentioning that you are becoming increasingly concerned because while some of the things your mother asks you or your DIL to buy her are reasonable enough, others are clearly not.

Birthday cards all right, but how often are you buying her toothpaste and face cream? Both last a long time.

Point out that you are beginning to suspect dementia is setting in, as it is far too frequently your mother is asking for the same things. This suggests strongly to my mind that she is forgetting that she actually has them, or cannot remember where she put them.

Mention too that she is asking for things like tins of soup and oxo cubes - obviously she does not need them in a home where three good meals are prepared and served daily.

This kind of thing is common among the elderly and old who are becoming forgetful, so the home is used to dealing with it, but it is pleasanter for them if they know that you know there is no rhyme or reason in this.

Then mention that she asked you to buy a present for a carer and that this too concerns you, as you are quite sure carers are not allowed to accept "wee presents". Make it clear that you are not accusing the carer of doing anything wrong, you are concerned that your mother may be insisting she takes something she knows she has to refuse,

Years ago, I worked as a housekeeper for a wealthy family. My boss had his elderly mother living in a granny flat and I did her cleaning and shopping and laundry as well as his and his 18 year old son's. I had to tell him that his mother had started asking me every Friday to buy a bottle of brandy "As it was her doctor's birthday soon."

Obviously, he didn't have a birthday every week, so I felt we had to consider that the old lady was drinking a bottle of expensive cognac a week, although as I never saw the empty bottles, I could not prove she was doing so.

He was convinced his mother never drank, so I asked him what he wanted me to do about the doctor's birthday bottle every week. I mean I could hardly come back from the shops and say they had sold out!

He agreed to talk to the family G.P. and it transpired that the old lady was drinking, not only the bottle I had been buying "for the doctor" but the one her grandson had been fetching "so she had something to offer her friend Mrs X when she popped in on". There was no Mrs X.

I don't know if something similar is going on with your mother, but please do discuss your concern with the management of the home.

Try too to answer some of the requests with a polite denial, "But mother you sent cousin Jean a birthday card last week, so you don't need cards now. There are no birthdays coming up." or "But I bought you toothpaste last time I was here. You can't have used a whole tube already." Then don't go for more. Go into her bathroom and check how many tubes of toothpaste, lip salves and pots of face cream are already there.

You could just ask the Manager if your Mother’s strange shopping requests are “normal” behaviour, you would not be complaining, just puzzled. He/she might be able to offer some advice.

As regards the alcohol - if your Mother is a manipulative narcissist it may not be just you she likes to work on and the Carer could be being drawn in.

I’m not sure you have enough information to come to any conclusions. If not the Manager is there a senior Carer you could talk to? As your Mother’s next of kin there must be someone in the home for you to discuss your concerns with.

I had Disaronno once - disgusting!

Would you consider seeking some therapeutic help to release yourself from your Mother’s claws? It wouldn’t mean you would never visit her again but would help you to realise that she can no longer dominate you. All the best.

My mothers carers would never ever drink on duty. Any alcohol taken for a small drink in the evening is monitored. Plus carers in the main drive home post their shifts. My mother is so happy with her carers she is always saying we must get them something but they are fully aware that the residents do say things like this and in the main ignore it.

Paddington1914

I totally agree with Nannee49. If your Mom wants to buy a few things and she has enough money to do so - then why shouldn't she? If she is a little lame and can't get out and about alone, then sadly she is pretty much a prisoner? However, even prisoners if they have the funds, can order food and toiletries online. I am guessing your Mom isn't internet savvy, meaning you and to a lesser extent your daughter in law are her only means of obtaining anything.
Put the shoe on the other foot and imagine how you would be, stuck there with everyone ignoring your requests, because you " have everything you need". We all have needs and wants and just because we are "old and being cared for" doesn't mean that they go away.

I agree with this. I can't imagine how frustrated and annoyed I would be with anyone who told me that I didn't need anything else. (DH half heartedly tries it on occasionally....such as,' how many handbags do you need?' but he gets very short shrift!)

GrammyGrammy

Nannee49

maddyone I apologise for thinking you asked if it was unreasonable rather than unethical behaviour but I would still have posted it was unfair of you to assume dodgy carer motives knowing your mum as you do.

And I would ask you not to apply the same logic of assumption to me. I am neither an unsympathetic person just because my view doesn't fit your narrative nor am I ignorant of the cruelty and hurt that can exist in mother/daughter relationships and, again, would ask you not to make assumptions because I disagree with your POV.

It's a puzzle to me why you would invite opinions on your dilemma if all you want is approbation.

Stop gaslighting the OP!

How is Nannee gaslighting? I think she's just disagreeing, which is ok, isn't it?

I am uncomfortable with hearing so much about what older people in homes should be 'allowed' to do with their own money, or just 'allowed' to do. If course we don't want them to be scammed, and of course they are vulnerable to that, but equally, I would really hate my daughter or a carer deciding what treats I should have and when I could have them. *I agree with Paddington1914's post as far as that is concerned.

I do feel that as maddyone is being run ragged by requests to run errands there is no reason to agree to doing it all, though. As has been suggested, a list once a week would be much more reasonable, particularly if the items (including treats) could then be ordered online and delivered direct to the home. That way, the control would be lessened, and the old lady would have control over what she did with her own money.

If the money started to run out, however (I know that homes can be ruinously expensive) and she would be running a risk of overspending to the point when she might run out of funds, there is a whole new problem to be faced. If she is compos mentis enough to understand, then IMO she should be consulted about it, and it should be made very clear that maddyone won't be manipulated into paying the rent. If she's not capable of understanding, however, it becomes much more difficult, and I really don't know what the answer is.

Nannan2

Could it be the covid has changed her taste buds too, if she's saying she likes things, then when she eats them saying she doesn't like them? Thats something you could consider as well rather than she's just doing that to be difficult.A lot of folk who've contracted covid19 have noticed a change in their taste/smell and dislike things now.?

I noticed this after I posted something similar Nannan2, sorry.
But yes, I agree that could be a possibility.

maddyone Perhaps your Mum sometimes just thinks she'd love a tin of Heinz soup and doesn't realise she can't prepare it and eat it any more.

Telling the absolute truth to someone with dementia can be considered abuse these days.
Each time you tell them that their husband is dead and they now live in a home is like the the first time, genuinely.

maddyone

Iam64

Eazybee. That’s the approach currently recommended for dementia. The classic am I going home today, no longer responded to by attempts to explain , no you live here now. The response is yes, later

Very wise words Iam and eazybee. We can ‘forget’ things that mum clearly doesn’t need and remember those she does.

She is definitely losing her memory. It was slow at first, but over the last couple of years since her first fall and two small bleeds to her brain (plus at this time she contracted Covid in the hospital) it has accelerated. This last six months I have seen quite a big difference.

When I visited my mother in her care home another resident would issue a long shopping list to her daughters, which they would carefully write down and discuss, then never buy. Their mother was still thinking she was running her own home and it reassured her if they listened seriously to her requests, which were forgotten immediately the visits were over.

Yes, do try this. She may forget about the items she asked for last time and her taste may have altered too, especially after Covid.