Heating Allowance in Europe

Yes I think that is true Dickens and I also think the people criticising are sometimes a bit unclear about what their critcism is actually about.
We certainly aren't totally out of touch with everyday life in the UK, as we are pretty permanently connected these days through print, televisual and social media. I would say we see more of family and friends across the UK than when we lived there, because of regular online catch-ups over a glass of wine!
I also think the whole "expat" thing has been unhelpful and has certainly been stirred up by the media. Fair to say Brexit didn't help either.

Mamie

escaped

It seems to be a topic on which people choosing to live in Spain or similar are over-sensitive to criticism. Like the proverbial hitting a raw nerve.

Travel to different destinations broadens the mind hugely. Your trip to the Galapagos sounds amazing for new experiences Maddyone. It would be interesting to hear about it on your return.

Just out of interest escaped, why should we be criticised in the first place? I still haven't seen any explanation on here of the reasons why some people think UK pensioners who live abroad should be treated differently.

Just out of interest escaped, why should we be criticised in the first place?

Good question Mamie.

I've seen comments on GN and other SM sites when this topic is raised where the criticism is inferred but not directly stated - a subtle insinuation that the person who's chosen to live in another country is somehow unpatriotic and therefore should have no further rights.

That's probably why it appears they have raw-nerves. They know they are being 'got at' - goaded - but can't respond to veiled criticism without appearing over-sensitive.

escaped

@ mamie
I think the criticism probably stems from the fact some ex-pats dish out criticism of their own country and countrymen. They make out that we all lead terrible lives here in the UK. That we are narrow-minded.
I don't think life is better in new pastures. Just different. I guess it's the sometimes superior and defensive attitude which draws criticism. That sort of self-congratulatory frame of mind. Not in my new backyard stuff.
From your post on here though you do not appear to have chosen to do that @ mamie.

I would describe myself as a migrant rather than an expat. We live in Normandy, very similar to the south of the UK in terms of countryside and climate. We have close family and friends in the UK.
I would certainly criticise some of the decisions of some UK governments of the past years, but I would never make blanket criticisms of the country.
I teach English on a voluntary basis and try to pass on my love of the English language and British culture to my students. I will always be British in France, but I also hope that I can be counted as Normande.
I do agree that some people arrived in the early part of the century (possibly tempted by A Place in the Sun) and were a bit prone to criticising the country they had left. I don't think many of them stayed very long.
I think there are a lot of stories around the attitudes "expats", but it certainly isn't true of the people I know here.

@ mamie
I think the criticism probably stems from the fact some ex-pats dish out criticism of their own country and countrymen. They make out that we all lead terrible lives here in the UK. That we are narrow-minded.
I don't think life is better in new pastures. Just different. I guess it's the sometimes superior and defensive attitude which draws criticism. That sort of self-congratulatory frame of mind. Not in my new backyard stuff.
From your post on here though you do not appear to have chosen to do that @ mamie.

Certainly anyone who goes to live in Australia has their pension fixed at the amount it was when they left the UK.
I'm not sure if they get the WFA or not.

I still haven't seen any explanation on here of the reasons why some people think UK pensioners who live abroad should be treated differently

Having googled, I don't think there is an explanation as such, it's just been like that since the inception of Pension Credit.

escaped

It seems to be a topic on which people choosing to live in Spain or similar are over-sensitive to criticism. Like the proverbial hitting a raw nerve.

Travel to different destinations broadens the mind hugely. Your trip to the Galapagos sounds amazing for new experiences Maddyone. It would be interesting to hear about it on your return.

Just out of interest escaped, why should we be criticised in the first place? I still haven't seen any explanation on here of the reasons why some people think UK pensioners who live abroad should be treated differently.

It seems to be a topic on which people choosing to live in Spain or similar are over-sensitive to criticism. Like the proverbial hitting a raw nerve.

Travel to different destinations broadens the mind hugely. Your trip to the Galapagos sounds amazing for new experiences Maddyone. It would be interesting to hear about it on your return.

Hi escaped, I’m sitting in the airport in Miami at the moment, on route to the Galapagos for a week. You’re right, travel does broaden the mind. I’m lucky enough to have travelled widely and have never felt the need to actually live anywhere else other than Britain. Some people choose to live abroad and this sometimes comes with financial penalties, but obviously anyone who lives abroad as a pensioner considers this before they move. It’s their choice, just as it is mine to continue to live in the UK. Wherever we choose to live we must accept the limitations and the rewards of that choice.

escaped

So if I decide to retire to Europe in a few years. Best to choose a hot part of Italy and not Iceland incase the UK winter fuel allowance is stopped.
Also I don't think the poster Maddyone talks small minded drivel. Minds can be opened by travel to dozens of destinations around the world without the need to live in say France or Spain.

and not Iceland
They use geothermal water for heating their homes etc, which I think is quite cheap.

Labradora

PS I don't object to paying my due taxes and funding benefits just I am sick of pensioners being represented as burdens, takers and freeloaders.
Between us my husband and I have worked for nearly 100 Years!!!!!

just I am sick of pensioners being represented as burdens, takers and freeloaders

It's par for the course when the economy is allegedly sporting black holes and governments are looking around for scapegoats in order to avoid scrutiny or accountability for their ideologically imposed economic policies.

Intergenerational 'unfairness' sits well with the working population - especially those on low incomes who have to fork out exorbitant rents and / or costly child-care fees.

They know that each generation supports the pensions of the one above it, but nevertheless there is talk - "well, you didn't pay enough then to support your lifestyle now", sort of thing. Which, if that is true, would not be the fault of the current pensioners anymore than it will be true when the complainants become pensioners themselves and are accused similarly.

An ageing population is not a sudden surprise event, but governments do like to present the issue as one that is unaffordable. But then, long-term planning doesn't win favour with an electorate already suffering years of grim austerity. As Starmer is about to find out. Those who are already impoverished are fearful, and those with modest savings who have in fact worked hard, scrimped and gone without, wonder if it was worth the effort as, by comparison, they are considered to be rich and on their shoulders, as the "better off", they will bear a huge brunt of the burden. The only individuals who will not be affected are the very very wealthy who will, apparently, up sticks and leave the country if they are expected to fork out more in taxes.

It's the same old, same old. Prior to the economic crisis 2008 the narrative was all about our "poor pensioners", and since then, we have morphed into greedy retirees who have at least one new car in the driveway and take a minimum of two luxury holidays per year.

DIVIDE ET IMPERA.

So if I decide to retire to Europe in a few years. Best to choose a hot part of Italy and not Iceland incase the UK winter fuel allowance is stopped.
Also I don't think the poster Maddyone talks small minded drivel. Minds can be opened by travel to dozens of destinations around the world without the need to live in say France or Spain.

PS I don't object to paying my due taxes and funding benefits just I am sick of pensioners being represented as burdens, takers and freeloaders.
Between us my husband and I have worked for nearly 100 Years!!!!!

Goldencity

I live in France (moved just before Brexit) and we do not get the WFA as France is deemed “too warm” (when the overseas departments are taken into consideration.
We do not get any benefits from the UK apart from our state pension, which we have paid NI for once we were in our teens.

Don’t believe everything you read in the papers!

I second this, it is correct. We're in France and we DONT get the Winter Fuel Payment because France is considered too warm.
I object to my UK state pension being described as a "benefit" at all because I paid for it with NI earning every penny of it through working my arras off for the best part of 45 years , full time , in a stressful job.
We pay tax in England and in France on all our income so we are still , as are many people on this platform, funding everyone's "benefits".
We are not wealthy people. We have only ever been middle income people.

moorlikeit I do wonder at the many people who choose to blame the education system and teachers for all the problems we face - such a cheap and uninformed blame game

I wasn’t seeking to blame teachers for society’s ills at all. That would be like blaming doctors and nurses for the failings of the NHS. But I do think that there is too much emphasis in the school system on examinations & results & this isn’t healthy for children or what real education should be about.
I agree with Allira that teaching standards and moral values has to come from both home and school.

Children can be taught all kinds of lessons in schools but if they have parents who lack any morals or standards then they are more likely (but not always) to follow their example.

Well analysed and expressed in your original post, Dickens. Also thanks are due to Mamie who correctly pointed out that critical thinking is taught in schools but, as is quite evident, all that is taught does not stick or our society would be a whole lot healthier.
I believe profoundly that the UK education system has lost its way with so many changing demands made on it by successive ideologically motivated governments BUT it should not be the scapegoat for all societal ills. I do wonder at the many people who choose to blame the education system and teachers for all the problems we face - such a cheap and uninformed blame game.

maddyone

In my opinion, WFA should never have been paid to anyone living outside the UK.

As has already been said those of us living in France Spain do not get the WFA because of the average temperature in those two countries.

We have paid our taxes and NIC just the same as you have. I'm still working (aged 77) and paying CT in the UK so I'm contributing towards your WFA.

If you follow the UK's premise that our average temperature is too high to pay us the WFA then perhaps the same logic should be applied to those in the UK - a lower payment for those living in the south and an higher amount to those living in the north of England and Scotland.

It is just your opinion that those not living in the UK should not receive the WFA but you do not give a reason.

janeainsworth

Dickens I agree there are many disaffected people out there and that has contributed to the rise of populism both in Britain and America. I doubt though, that Keir Starmer & Rachel Reeves’ New Austerity policies are going to do anything to change this. People need hope, not the doom & gloom that’s currently being promulgated.

I entirely agree.

Starmer warning that "things will get worse before they get better" is - as you've aptly called it - New Austerity.

Of course, we have to wait for the Budget for the precise details, but those 'warning shots' are meant to prepare us for yet more hard times.

What we really needed was a government with 'revolutionary' ideas elected for that reason. But Starmer chose, inevitably I suppose, to appease those who are diametrically opposed economically with the result that we are, basically, going to continue with more of the same. In other words, Jam - Tomorrow.

Thanks GrsndmaFrench

Cossy I do agree, but it’s not children voting for Reform, rioting and spreading misinformation!!

No, they’re not voting for Reform, but children as young as 13 are being prosecuted for participating in the riots. Their parents are either ignorant of what their children are doing at night, or complicit in their behaviour.
And underage children are certainly competent users of the internet and although they are now taught about online safety in schools, it doesn’t seem to be enough. Perhaps it needs to be framed within a wider moral compass.

janeainsworth

^The deep divisions in society are as much the fault of the media as any obnoxious individual spreading fake news on social media^

Perhaps if children were taught to think critically they would be more cynical & less influenced by & accepting of what they read, hear & see in both mainstream media and on the internet.
Placing all the blame for division & disruption in society today on the media & obnoxious people is denying that individuals have any personal responsibility for their opinions & actions.

I do agree, but it’s not children voting for Reform, rioting and spreading misinformation!!

GrannyGravy13

#Labourlies

Well it isn't is it. The deal was written into the Brexit agreement by the Conservative government and there is absolutely nothing this government can do about it. It will end in April of next year anyway.

Exactly as I posted in my OP

Well said, janeainsworth and Dickens

Unfortunately, I doubt that critical thinking can be taught, even thinking rationally is beyond some as was witnessed in the recent riots. It appears that they think with their fists first.

I do think withdrawal of the WFA should have been done in stages rather than a sudden withdrawal for all who did not meet the criteria.
There is over £2 billion pa in unclaimed Pension Credit as about one third of those eligible do not claim it.