RIP Baby Star Hobson

Excellent post, Terribull

The child's needs and safety should be of paramount importance. If that young mother was living in a supported hostel, where was the support? Certainly none for the baby she left to die.

I agree about step-parents, there are many wonderful step-parents. Many years ago a friend died suddenly leaving his wife with two much loved step-children whom she'd brought up from tiny but their inadequate biological mother then claimed them and they were taken from the step-mother.

mumof4boys, I did read that Star's dad, had voiced his concerns to Social Services along with Star's extended family. Frankie Smith conceived when she wasn't much more than a child herself certainly not mentally. I believe she left the father to pursue the relationship with Savannah Brockhill and the father went off to university, so he was pretty young himself.

Absolutely no excuses

To all intents and purposes, it seems that the mother received a lenient sentence. Before she was sentenced her barrister made her low IQ of 70 a mitigating factor. I was reading through a MN thread on this case, and it seems, the suggestion there from some posters was that with such a low IQ it is possible that her judgement would be impaired, whether or not that is true, I have no idea, not knowing what the implications of a low IQ are. Her barrister did point out that she was an awful mother, but she didn't actually kill Star, her partner did. As with Arthur's father she stood by and let it happen, almost with relish, so one can only ponder as to whether either of them had that innate sense of love and protectiveness that most parents have.

A while ago there was a case in Brighton where the 18 year old mother left her child, similar age to Star, in a supported hostel and went off for days on end partying leaving the poor little girl unattended and without fluids and food and that baby was another heart breaking statistic along with all the other poor little souls. This little girl could have been saved, it seems as the hostel where she was living was staffed and the cameras showed the mother coming and going. Reading about that made me honestly wonder how anyone could reach the age of 18 and not realise any dependent living creature, let alone a human baby, could not be left for days at a time without suffering painfully. She also received a fairly light sentence and again there were grandparents who were appalled and would have stepped in if only they had an idea what she was up to.

With both cases in mind, I read an article by the excellent Julie Bindel who is of the opinion that Star suffered her fate because Social Services put the perceived sensibilities of the fact that these women were lesbians, Julie Bindel is one herself, before the needs of the child and the partner had used that to good effect in deterring both of them being investigated further. I can't believe anyone in their right mind seeing that awful facial bruise wouldn't have removed Star to the safety of the extended family, even just to make sure. As with the mother in Brighton who went out partying, I wondered whether it was felt that it would be unacceptable in that case for someone to hold a master key to enter her accommodation because that would have been deemed to be an infringement of the mother's privacy, if they had, they would have found a little girl slowly dying a painful death who could have been saved.

Both mothers of course were very young when they had their children, and it seems in one case with learning difficulties and in both cases extreme immaturity, too immature to parent independently, or seemingly to have any feelings for their children other than dressing them up as an accessory to be used for photo opportunities. I'm sure many teenage mothers rise to the challenge and do an excellent job, but I wonder why with such question marks and concerns were these two were allowed to go it alone as parents without the much needed and vital support of the extended families.

Once again, as with Arthur, the murderer was named as a step parent, how infuriating that must be to all those step parents who provide love and ongoing support to their step children to be lumped along side those who are merely shacked up with the parent.

I am in no way defending the actions of these two females. I read today that mum has an IQ of 70, that is the lowest 2% of people. I wonder if GPs/ health visitors knew this girl was so challenged and whether more monitoring should have been in place. Clearly it should have been. Where were Holly's parents in all this? Do they have learning difficulties? Savannah hasn't been in school since age 1 0 and grew up in a travelling community.
We don't want a nanny state but must have a system which stops poor children like this being failed by their parents and society. Where was Star's dad and did he and his parents have access to Star?

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2370866/Revealed-Myra-Hindleys-year-lesbian-affair-nun.html

these highly manipulative people are able to kind of mesmerise people; hindley did it repeatedly, look at how she used fooled lord longford.
i guess that is extreme narcissism; everything is about their wishes and advantage, nothing else matters.
the one sentenced today was smirking in court and making signs to ?supporters ? !

It makes you wonder what's going on that we don't know about.

Hindley out for pleasant walks, Pitchfork wandering around Bristol shopping, others given new identities etc.

We may complain about the press sometimes, but thank goodness for investigative journalists!

We need dungeons for these child killers…

Another officer tried to help her escape.
She also had a relationship with Rose West.

yes, one of the governors at holloway allowed her to be taken for walks on hampstead heath !
when a sunday newspaper found out and splashed it, the governor retired.

Shinamae

Calistemon

tickingbird

Callistemon. I doubt Brockhill will need to worry too much in prison. Judging from the video of her hitting that punchbag in the gym, she’d be more than capable of defending herself. I just hope they treat her with the contempt she deserves.

The thought crossed my mind that she might become Queen Bee and rule the roost in prison, tickingbird but I sincerely hope that other prisoners will be appalled by her crimes.

A child killer in a woman’s prison would NEVER become the Queen bee

Hindley was known as the Queen Bee in prison. She was a clever manipulator.

Calistemon

Unusual friendships can be formed in prison.

Tustin is at HMP Peterborough, where cells can be 'personalised', TVs are provided along with a variety of healthy food options (HM Inspectorate).

Good God Almighty, you couldn’t make it up ?‍♀️

Unusual friendships can be formed in prison.

Tustin is at HMP Peterborough, where cells can be 'personalised', TVs are provided along with a variety of healthy food options (HM Inspectorate).

Calistemon

tickingbird

Callistemon. I doubt Brockhill will need to worry too much in prison. Judging from the video of her hitting that punchbag in the gym, she’d be more than capable of defending herself. I just hope they treat her with the contempt she deserves.

The thought crossed my mind that she might become Queen Bee and rule the roost in prison, tickingbird but I sincerely hope that other prisoners will be appalled by her crimes.

A child killer in a woman’s prison would NEVER become the Queen bee

trisher

Forsythia

How long do you allow them to work towards necessary change and is it monitored? This little girl should have been removed swiftly in my opinion. Why weren’t the relatives listened to ?

Because none of the support Iam64 talks about remains. What is left are social workers trying to manage unmanageable workloads, nurseries and schools where staff has been cut to the minimum, GPs with huge lists and some areas where they won't work. Everything else has gone. None of what was aimed for after the death of Victoria Climbie was ever acheived and the aims and provision were abandoned.
Isn't it better to have some chance of changing things, even if there will always be a few who will slip through the net, rather than just cutting things and leaving everyone to struggle?

Thank you. Iam64 has explained well enough for me.

In the news just now, Shortly before the sentencing, the Prime Minister told MPs that the Government is investigating Bradford Council’s child protection department following the tragic murder and will consider closing it if necessary.

"I would just like to say that I think the whole House will once again be filled with incredulity at the cruelty of people who can perpetrate a child killing like this, but also sadness and bewilderment that it could not have been prevented,” Mr Johnson said.

"We will appoint... a commissioner to assess the relevant council - Bradford's - capability and capacity to improve on their findings and they will report in January.

*

I for one don’t think Bradford’s child protection services are fit for purpose and I think it’s shocking and highly damning that the Director resigned 5 weeks before this case came to Court.

Kali2

To my mind, the mother should get as long a sentence as her partner.

Yes, I'm appalled at the eight year sentence (four years if she "behaves"l.

The mother of this beautiful child stood by and allowed this to happen and joined in in the torture even if she didn't actually murder her baby.

tickingbird

*Callistemon*. I doubt Brockhill will need to worry too much in prison. Judging from the video of her hitting that punchbag in the gym, she’d be more than capable of defending herself. I just hope they treat her with the contempt she deserves.

The thought crossed my mind that she might become Queen Bee and rule the roost in prison, tickingbird but I sincerely hope that other prisoners will be appalled by her crimes.

Forsythia

How long do you allow them to work towards necessary change and is it monitored? This little girl should have been removed swiftly in my opinion. Why weren’t the relatives listened to ?

Because none of the support Iam64 talks about remains. What is left are social workers trying to manage unmanageable workloads, nurseries and schools where staff has been cut to the minimum, GPs with huge lists and some areas where they won't work. Everything else has gone. None of what was aimed for after the death of Victoria Climbie was ever acheived and the aims and provision were abandoned.
Isn't it better to have some chance of changing things, even if there will always be a few who will slip through the net, rather than just cutting things and leaving everyone to struggle?

The focus should always be in the child’s timescale.
I don’t know why the relatives weren’t listened to. I don’t understand how a medical exam failed to identify non accidental injuries. I don’t understand how a child so dazed she walks into a sofa and is limping and with this background of concerns isn’t taken for another medical.
The inquiry will investigate

How long do you allow them to work towards necessary change and is it monitored? This little girl should have been removed swiftly in my opinion. Why weren’t the relatives listened to ?

There’s no one answer to the co-operation/working together question. Where an effective initial assessment takes place, a support package often provides much needed help. Most parents love their children and want to improve things.

With so called resistant, dishonest, manipulative and possibly dangerous carers, the package is to work towards necessary change.
Immediate risk of, or identified significant abuse can result in care proceedings, sometimes with a view to the child being placed with alternative carers. Family members would be the first to be considered.
It’s possible for people to ‘disappear’. It’s not unheard of, tho it’s rare, to discover a child has been known, or even in care to another authority but parents have taken off.

Rest in peace little Star.

I don’t doubt what you say and thank you for explaining it so well. However, would these individuals go to the centre? Would they agree to go? Or stay off the radar.

Forsythia

Do you think families such as these would attend Sure Start Centres, which are mentioned on here? Or would they just refuse any engagement with professionals? To cover up their crimes.

Forsythia, thanks for the question which i’ll answer and expect others to have views to share, which may be very different than mine.

In many Sure Start areas, every new parent was invited by the health visitor to eg baby massage classes. Additionally, there would be cooking, parenting skill, dad’s groups etc, a universal service. Health visitors were well placed to identify parents who were struggling, maybe post natal depression, social isolation, relationship breakdown, learning difficulties or many other factors. The surestart family centres provided much needed support to families.
Social workers could refer families. Often, a nursery place could be made available that gave respite to parents as well as providing stimulation and the opportunity to observe an infant/
As part of a support package where safeguarding was a concern, a written agreement may be made. The sw team will provide x to support the parenting, the parents agree to Xy.

So cuts to services matter