What arrangements should we put in place for old age

Our Health and Welfare Powers of Attorney state our wishes very clearly. The added section stipulates that given certain conditions, we emphatically do not want any ‘striving to keep alive’. And that we do not want or expect our daughters to look after us.
IMO that needs to be put firmly in writing, because what someone says when they have all their marbles, can differ very widely from what they say they want once they have dementia - particularly if they can’t understand that there’s anything wrong with them!

Hardly anybody ever actually wants to go into a home, but there are circs. when it may be the only practical option, especially where dementia beyond the early stages is involved. Having seen, and lived with, far too much of that horrible disease, there is no way I want our dds to have to cope with it.

Re decluttering, I don’t think we have too much stuff, but I have told dds (and will put it in writing) that I will leave a list of anything at all valuable, and they should then just get the house clearance people in.
Having done it myself, I don’t want them to have to do that, either.

Our house is not too big for us, we have only a very small garden, and it’s in a very convenient location for excellent public transport, shops, doctor, etc., so I don’t see us downsizing any time soon.
If I am ever left on my own, I would probably do it, though.

Having looked after selfish mother, stepfather and MiL, i feel quite strongly about this subject.

We are early 70s and are clearing out lots of things that we will never use. Clearing three homes after a death was utterly draining and very expensive.

We have POA as well as ‘End of Life’ letters, which have been discussed with our children.

We both have lots of different saving accounts and full details of these are in a box and updated regularly. Also in the box are utility bills, insurance documents, anything that they will need to help them deal with out affairs. Also the Will and copies of POA.

if you are lucky,or is it unlucky to reach old age, then the advice off a friend sticks to my thoughts like glue ' it is best to move sooner than later' how many people are stuck in old houses falling down around them,too scared to move ,too scared to stay? declutter etc while you can, big houses are for families or people with too much money!

Thinking how very many people I've known who died in their 40s, 50s or 60s, nobody is assured of reaching the state of 'old age' anyway. Make a will. Make a list, on a computer, handwritten or whatever, of all your account numbers, passwords, memorable information and whatever login details are needed, for banking and borrowing, pensions, utilities, even social media sites, everything that would need closing, and ensure your children, siblings (or whoever will have to sort it all out) know where to locate it. Mine are on a Word document, copied onto three portable USB drives, and my daughters know the PIN/passcodes to start up my computers and my mobile phone. Also listed are contact phone numbers and email addresses of my siblings, ages and vaccination status of my pets, dates when all the house and car insurances etc are due, again with login details.

I have lost far too many friends and relatives in 'middle age', some to cancer, with a few years of knowing their time was limited, to those who were apparently perfectly well until the morning they went out for a run or bike ride, and had a fatal heart attack, or sat down in the evening and had a stroke from which they died the next day.

I fear loss of independence far more than I fear death, and I only hope I'm spared a long decline, but be it tomorrow or in 30 years' time, I hope my family are well equipped to deal with it.

Alioop, my lovely elderly neighbour has a large garden and was finding it difficult to cope with and upsetting to look at. She now has two young neighbours, who live in an upstairs converted flat, taking good care of it for her. They grow many vegetables, look after her hens, cut the lawn and hedge etc. - and check on her too. It's a brilliant arrangement.

My DH and I are both still fit and well and don't intend to go anywhere anytime soon, but I would love to declutter. My problem is my DH , who isn't really interested. I do go through my things periodically and chuck stuff out. But my DH never does. Added to which we have lived here since our AC were babies . They didn't move out until they were in their late 20s so the house still contains masses of their belongings. I have just acquired the book " The gentle art of Swedish Death Cleaning" and really hope that I can persuade my DH to sort through his belongings.

My parents moved to the coast when they retired and all was good for many years. The lived into their 90’s but the last few years showed that they needed help. I lived almost 4 hours drive away but I did go and stay with them and helped them as much as I possibly could, unlike my sibling! They said that it was their problem as they decided to move there. Hospitals were quite a drive away. For me looking after them was a no brainier, I wouldn’t have done anything different. They were always there for me and my siblings, I was there for them. They are no longer with us and although it was a difficult few years I am glad I was there for them. I am trying to plan for old age, no plans to move house but new air source heating installed, bathrooms will be refitted and I will need a gardener at some point. LPA’s are in place. Now to enjoy life.

I was widowed at 57, DH had just had his 72nd Birthday. 2 years after he died I moved to a Mobile Home about 10 miles from DD & her family. I live in a small Town . However at the moment my mobility is almost non-exisant. I had a very severe infection in January (Cellulitis) & am still receiving treatment, I'm only 66, so anything can happen, luckily I'm still driving.

Our lovely shop & Post Office closed 3 years ago, it was within walking distance. There are buses into Town every half hour & into our nearest larger Town, every hour into a very large Town. Doctor's Surgery is in Town & 2 Hospitals in nearby Towns.

I have done my POAs & am going to do my Living Will or whatever it's called now. I need to have my Will checked over but there is only my DD to inherit (DGSs will inherit if she pre-deceases me). We discuss my wishes regarding Funeral & she knows where all my papers are.

I keep having a bit of a de-clutter but I'm only in a one bedroom home so room is limited, most of my de-cluttering was done in our previous moves

I am 73 and my dh is 68. We are both active and alert and live in a 3 bed semi. I have decluttered to an extent. We have 4 sons between us. I have one son who lives abroad and 3 wonderful stepsons local. Our Wills and POA are sorted. Funerals are paid for. The eldest and very capable stepson is my will executor for convenience with agreement of my son who is 1000s of miles distant.

We are now thinking of moving to a bungalow. We don’t want to move far as Drs, supermarket, corner shop, and family are all convenient.
We considered building out back with a sun room/later a bedroom and downstairs shower room but it might be easier to move if a suitable bungalow came on the market.
Yesterday when eldest s/son and family I brought up the suggestion that we may move. They were all for it.

Dil is a senior nurse involved in the care of palative care patients and says the hardest conversations she has is asking a patient in an unsuitable house if they wish to live upstairs or downstairs. Upstairs with access to the bathroom or downstairs with a bed in the dining room, a commode, and access to the garden.

My dil is a gem. They are both so good to us. Trimmed our apple trees in springtime and cleared out our overstuffed garage during the summer.
We have always helped them with childcare and the dgc still come to us a couple of days each week after school.
Last year well gave all 4 boys a lump sum each out of their inheritance. Eldest s/son didn’t want to take it. Told us to take a 3 month cruise.
To move to a bungalow I’d still want 3 bedrooms to allow for dgc sleepovers and family coming home from abroad. I’d still want a garage for ‘stuff’. Also dh smokes and watches football and rugby in the garage ….. with tv and heater ?

To move to a bungalow will cost a good deal more than what we will get for our present modest home. About half of what we have as our nest egg. I always like to have enough behind us so that we could help any of them if they had a crisis. Only the youngest ever needed help when he separated and he is currently regularly paying that back and has been for 3 years, never missing a payment.

If we move and use a lot of our nest egg we will not have the security of the nest egg we’re used to. We live comfortably, we have a car each, but otherwise very modestly.

I do know this is a first world problem.
Many people are not as fortunate as us to be able to have the option of moving. I love my little house and it is suitable at present but I’m thinking of the future and the stairs. We’ve both had a few falls on the stairs. We both have serious underlying conditions but thankfully currently are mobile.

So sorry , I have rambled, and understand that for many GNers I’ve probably gone on too much. xx

I moved back to the UK after 21 years of living in rural France (and before that, Menorca)....we bought a large house which my husband did up ......then moved to a shell of a new bungalow which again, he finished ....he loved working '1 then he got Parkinson's disease and hated that he could no longer drive and I did all the driving (no transport whatever where we lived !) so, when he died in 2019 I decided reluctantly to move back to the UK ....next question ...to where ?! I would have LOVED A retirement village but all of those in the UK were totally beyond my means .....(in France there are retirement villages with little bungalows that are AFFORDABLE !) but with BREXIT and having to apply for permanent residence etc and having to have an acceptable level of income to live there, I decided it was less hassle to move back. I bought quite an old ex mcCarthy & Stone retirement flat (hate the flat but LOVE the position ...ne minute from the beach, busses, taxis, tram system and even an airport and a ferry ! But now I am getting old I have spent as much time as I can (before covid AND as soon as I was 'let out' !) travelling which is the purpose for buying the flat ...not having to get someone to look after my house only snag is I cannot have a cat which I would love. I have a POA and a Will in place, and am a member of Dignity in Dying and also contemplating Dignitas (only thing there is you have to pay in excess of £12,000 up front, go for psychiatric reviews and doctors appt in Switzerland, AND THE BIGGEST snag is your usual doctor has to agree ..........my doctor (not that I have a named one here in the UK, unlike in France !) does noteven agree to me having a DNAR notice on my medical records.........big snag ! there is currently a Bill before parliament to adopt assisted dying (well, let's face it, the UK government has been practiscing it quietly for years...and even more so throughout the COVID pandemic ....ok, they are old, let's get rid of them and save money ...we won't pay for care (the new suggestion, STILL two years away, is supposed to look good in allowing one to keep £86,000 BUT this does NOT include accommodation charges in a care home which as we all know, can be around £4,000 a month and not many of us can afford that ! SO my advice would be to decide firstly where you want to live and what will be affordable long term should you ever need care .....somewhere where if you get too ancient to drive, you have local access to services and medical treatment should you need it. and get a PoA (I have 2, one Financial and one for health in which I have specified no treatment if I become ill)...and meanwhile, I am spending as much as I can on travel .........think carefully ! good luck

You are right Foxy. It is not always necessary to Cheney the ownership on the house and the house has a lower rate of inheritance tax.
We have a big house we are loathe to leave and have decided we will have live in carers if necessary as we have the space.
We are near to public transport and not too far from 3 hospitals.
We are also in a town with all amenities.

My mum was tricked to sell her house way to early even though she needed a couple of repairs by my bullying brother and an estate agent who sold her house way to cheaply .I had owed of attorney as she did not want my brother and his wife to have it .She lived with us for a few years but developed dementia and started hitting the children so she went into a care home which ate up all her money The house was to be shared between us Even the stuff mum had written on the back of stuff got contested by my niece whose a solicitor .Her letter was appalling and bullying and Citizens Advice said she had no legal claim ,I do not want to go into a home my mother deteriorated badly once in there mentally

maddyone

Having watched three elderly relatives (my mother, and my parents in law) grow older and older, and become more and more disabled, I have no desire to make my children do what we, and my husband’s brothers , have had to do. We are 68 and 69, and facing going into our 70s, still looking after three currently 94 year olds. My husband’s parents refuse to go into a home, and only have one carer visit a day, relying instead on their sons who shop, cook, wash laundry, take them to medical appointments, in fact do everything for them. My own mother is currently in a nursing home following her third fall and hospitalisation in six months. She had decided to stay there, but is now thinking she’ll go back to her flat. When I heard that I started to panic as she is very disabled in that she can’t care for herself in any meaningful way. She thinks because she can walk two metres to the toilet with her walker that she is now ready to go home. She refused to pay for more than one care visit a day when she lived at home. She is totally dependent for everything, shopping, cooking, laundry, personal care, care of her weeping leg, care for her bedsore on her back. Everything! I’m really, really spacking out at the thought of her going back to the flat and everything we’ll have to do again. I simply don’t want it. She wasn’t the best mother as we grew up and I’m fed up of being the best daughter to her now. I want it all to end, and apologies if that offends anyone. I’m looking at us both being in our 70s and still looking after the old.

You shouldn't feel guilty, you have your later years to enjoy as well. Why shouldn't you be planning for a happy relaxing retirement.
You didn't get the best upbringing so why should you martyr yourself now. Stick to what you feel and make it known that you are not willing to be a carer.

I just want to say how helpful this thread is for those of us contemplating the future. I am learning that many of us have the same ideas and problems.

I think as well as all the very sensible ‘practical’ arrangements, it is a good idea to have a good, honest chat with those who may feel they will have to take on the responsibility for your future care to clarify exactly what you expect/don’t expect them to do. I am in my seventies, my parents in their mid-nineties. They always said they never wanted to be a burden on us ‘children’ and pride themselves on the fact they have never asked us for support. How come, then, that we feel totally worn down and our retirement is not our own - although theirs was. They live at home with support they don’t ask for but are a full-time responsibility for us. When the phone rings and someone says ‘Mum’s fallen over again and broken her arm’ or ‘Dad has to go to hospital, shall we ring a taxi?’ how can you not respond? Ok, sure, they don’t actually ‘ask’ but we are helpless to refuse. I totally feel we have no life if our own and I want my children to be able to say ‘we’ve done enough’ when the time comes. I love my parents dearly but I am worn out, my retirement is passing by, we are no longer as healthy as we were. My parents never did this for their parents but, as they say, they have never asked for anything from us. Bitter? Moi?

Lots of good advice on this thread. Yes we have a keysafe for my mother and it is linked to emergency services in that the Alert bracelet people will pass on the code. It is also there for regular carers and district nurse if needed. We have one of our own now and good for the times the door slams and we get locked out. Another nice thing to have done is a 'letter of wishes' to be left with your will. This is informal and can be added to /changed whenever with no need for witnesses. It can be a useful guide for your executor as to how to distribute favourite possessions or even may include how you wish your funeral to be carried out and what to be done with ashes.

Declutter downsize move to somewhere where facilities like GP shops library etc are a short distance away for when you no longer drive Arrange power of attorney discuss your wishes for the future especially end of life and funeral Then go and spend your money and live life to the full while you can !

We had six of them to care for , the last is still alive at 96 living on 18/acres, alone in a house that is rotting, None of them made any provision for their old age, downsized or de cluttered.
The stress of their behaviour nearly killed us.
So what did we learn? We downsized, de cluttered and have made our present small house, old age proof, with wet room and grips.
We moved to live near 2 of the children, we discuss finances with them and they have POA. We have to trust them.
When the other old folks died, my children would not take a thing belonging to them. We spent months clearing up.
I don’t want to put my children what we went through, with the 6 people who just didn’t believe they would ever get old and helpless.
I did love them, but it wore thin.

My husband and I moved this year to the North of Scotland for health reasons. We were already living in a bungalow before we moved and have the same type of home now. We have Funeral Plans in place, Wills and LPA's. I keep trying to de-clutter (it's against my natural inclinations) and have photographed the items left in our Wills, so that the Solicitor will be able to identify which items go to whom.

We have a wonderful sea view, which is something we always wanted, but because of our need to be so far north - sadly, many facilities such as shops etc. are some distance away.

Neither of us would want to go to a care home, and there is no-one with whom we could reasonably live. We will make our own arrangements, should circumstances dictate it. Other than that, we feel that we have put in place all that it seems reasonable to do.

My preparations for old age boil down to one important thing- the best health I can manage. I saw my parents’ sad decline through a lack of personally caring for their health over the years, whilst knowing certain conditions were common in their families. My father’s family had strokes/high blood pressure/ heart problems compounded by the fact his parents were first cousins. His father died of a stroke, so did his elder brother. His mother and elder sister suffered from vascular dementia. My father ate (never drank/smoked) to excess all his life. At 5’7” he weighed 20 stone most of the time. He had high blood pressure/high cholesterol/ heart disease. He began to suffer from vascular dementia in his late sixties and his slow decline was heartbreaking to watch, particularly as dementia was not readily diagnosed in those days and his treatment was poor to say the least. My mother also had similar heart problems/ high everything and suffered a TIA (wouldn’t do rehab offered after it) and also overate and always enjoyed her (frequent) tipples! She also had breast cancer. Her lack of interest in altering her lifestyle meant she had awful digestive problems, heart disease and became immobile and doubly incontinent, as well as very unhappy and depressed. I don’t want to be like that! However much money I do or don’t have, however well and sensibly I plan, all is nothing without my health and I cherish, look after and nurture it everyday in whatever way I can.

Maddyone
No need to apologise. I think you take on the situation is refreshingly honest.
I’m afraid I’ve come across too many old/ elderly people who use the old card as an excuse to be rude/ cantankerous/ bloody minded.
A while ago I was a Friend/ visitor for Age Uk I’ve met an awful lot of older people with this attitude.
It’s almost a subject that can’t be discussed.

Once a financial assessment is to be carried out and joint accounts exist,best to separate them. Pensions and any other personal income should be separated too. State retirement pension is taken into account for assessment, but only half of occupational/private pension the 50% being left for the partner. That 50% should be transferred to the partners account eg monthly. As for property, when jointly or owned by the person going into care as long as the person eg partner, long term carer is over 60 years of age the property is disregarded.physical disability may be easier to provide for, mental deterioration though is difficult, doesn't matter if you are in a bungalow or 3 storey house very different needs for care and likely to require a care home.

maddyone

Having watched three elderly relatives (my mother, and my parents in law) grow older and older, and become more and more disabled, I have no desire to make my children do what we, and my husband’s brothers , have had to do. We are 68 and 69, and facing going into our 70s, still looking after three currently 94 year olds. My husband’s parents refuse to go into a home, and only have one carer visit a day, relying instead on their sons who shop, cook, wash laundry, take them to medical appointments, in fact do everything for them. My own mother is currently in a nursing home following her third fall and hospitalisation in six months. She had decided to stay there, but is now thinking she’ll go back to her flat. When I heard that I started to panic as she is very disabled in that she can’t care for herself in any meaningful way. She thinks because she can walk two metres to the toilet with her walker that she is now ready to go home. She refused to pay for more than one care visit a day when she lived at home. She is totally dependent for everything, shopping, cooking, laundry, personal care, care of her weeping leg, care for her bedsore on her back. Everything! I’m really, really spacking out at the thought of her going back to the flat and everything we’ll have to do again. I simply don’t want it. She wasn’t the best mother as we grew up and I’m fed up of being the best daughter to her now. I want it all to end, and apologies if that offends anyone. I’m looking at us both being in our 70s and still looking after the old.

No need to apologise for wanting your life back darling. The olds of our parents' generation can be incredibly selfish, feeling somehow that we "owe" them? All very Victorian but I guess that's their parents' attitude and actual generation too, hopefully that sort of attitude will float away with them, I know I wouldn't want to burden my 2 DS although neither are speaking to me at the mo! Maybe when their dreadful partners have buggered off I may get them back!?

travelsafar you and others, may find this useful.
compassionindying.org.uk/making-decisions-and-planning-your-care/planning-ahead/dnar-forms/

KittyLester we have joint current accounts but not savings accounts. I think the issue of whether it is better to have joint ownership of the house or to be tenants in common depends on a number of things and isn't necessarily straightforward. I think it's important to point out that a lot of decisions will depend on the financial situation that someone is in and whether they are on their own or married and what is their potential exposure to inheritance tax should one of the spouses die.