FRIEND OF MINE RECENTLY BEEN TURNED INTO A CARER

I wonder if Health and Social Care have assessed their needs? This is going nowhere until that is done and it gives him the opportunity to express his position also.

Grannynannywanny

Sorry to contradict you ExDancer but carer allowance is paid directly to the carer. What you are describing sounds like attendance allowance and it does sound like the parents are eligible if they’re not already receiving it.

This is correct 👌

As Silver lining said he needs to move out. Give social services a date. In the mean time go back to work. Leave the house at 8 am. Ask for cSrers to come in 3 times in his absence 5 days a week. social services need to sort that out with his parents. He may whilst he is there decide to cover at weekends and this will give him the hours he needs to put in to cover his carers allowance for 35 hour work.

Thanks all for the helpful thoughts.

I know I'll be interested to start with to see if his startled reaction as to just how much a nearby house is up for rent for when I told him has turned into him investigating just how much he thinks their house could be rented for. It's up for a lot more than he thought it would be - it's hundreds of £s more a month than he thought it would be. So hopefully that's got him thinking down those lines to start with - to see if there are possibilities re paying for carehomes. I don't know what sort of state his parents house is in - though I'm not optimistic on that front from what he's said over time about it (and it may be like a lot I've noticed - ie needing a lot of work and functioning rather illogically) - but I may be wrong and it may be more "together" (ie modern and workable) than I've been assuming it is.

I do know his father is extremely stubborn from what he's said about him over time and we shall see - my friend isn't a "weak" sort of person and I think he should be capable of being "firmer" where necessary (whether with demanding parents or demanding Social Services). I've seen him be quite "firm" about investigating things and making up his own mind about things since first encountering him apres 2020....so we shall see....He's a teacher by training and inclination...but also got DIY type skills.....so maybes.....

So we'll see what happens about that possibility or otherwise. I do know decades ago one of my "cousins" (aka aunt in fact) made a noticeable amount renting out my "aunt" (grandmothers) house and that went a long way towards paying the cost of her carehome (which I saw - and it was a decent one/not cheapest possible for sure). So maybe there's some "room for manoeuvre" factoring these things together.

There is a world of difference between caring for a loved spouse and caring for a parent, and no child should be expected to sacrifice their own life. What you can do for a partner is quite different from what you could do for anyone else, and sometimes saying “no” is the right thing to do.

Bluntly, he will need to tell Social Services that he NEEDS to go back to work, he cannot afford not to, and so from X date he will not be available to act as carer for his parents, who will be ‘vulnerable’ and ‘at risk’ - these are apparently the buzzwords.

It is very common for SS to try to persuade or guilt relatives into providing necessary care - understandably, since it’s cheaper for them.

As for elderly people who refuse carers, since they only want relatives to perform such duties (TBH this is VERY common!) they will have to be told that it’s outside carers, or nothing.

Yes, I know this all sounds harsh, but this sort of situation is all too common.

Go to the Age UK website - www.ageuk.org.uk/

Loads of info about funding care and lots more.

Also Carers UK - www.carersuk.org/

I mixed carers and attendance allowances mixed up - thanks to all of you for the correction.

Rosie!! - no significance whatsoever to capital letters - that's just how I realised I'd typed it and, as we all know, Gransnet doesnt yet have an editing button.

silverlining48

He and his sister need to discuss what they are both prepared to do to help their parents. If he has his own home did he move into his parents home to help them? If he doesn’t want to help them now he should move out because if he remains there it would naturally be assumed that he was helping his parents.
It’s a while since I worked for SS and things may have changed but both parents would be assessed for their needs on the basis that they are vulnerable and live alone.

No one chooses to be a carer, it’s a hard road to travel, but is something which is sometimes needed when people often our parents, get older and frailer. No one has to do it, he can just walk away, it’s all rather sad.

He has been living in his parents home for the last few months whilst doing this.

I can follow the logic of "If he's staying there = he must be caring for them" - hence why I made it very plain to Devon social services that I couldnt possibly live with my parents - given that my home is now in Wales and that's where I live.

I can well see that few/if any would choose to be a carer. It is all very sad. I'm not getting the impression that he's particularly close to them - particularly his father - but just feels someone has to do it so to say one way or another.

I'm noticing quite a bit of this going on in this area - ie people being carers (it's been one of the "This is very different to what I'm used to" things I've encountered here) and it's something I recall seeing very little of back in my home city in England and I can only think of one person who ended up in that position and a male work colleague who was in a "I was never quite sure who was caring for who" situation with his mother (who he'd lived with all along).

I don't know just how much is happening here - but I still follow the "house for sale Rightmove" pages and by now I count the number of houses with the disabled adaptations I'd barely noticed prior to moving here and the multi-household houses I'd also never noticed previously (ie there's a main house and some sort of granny annexe). It's startling to me to notice all this here - but there seems to be a lot...

What’s the significance of the shouty capitals?

Many people become carers for loved ones -not necessarily by choice but by circumstance.
A contemporary of my eldest D (50) came ‘home’ from the US giving up home and career to help his Mum care for his father who was diagnosed with prostate cancer, but his mother developed bowel cancer and has predeceaseed her DH. The father is still alive.
I am sure that SS, Age UK, Alzheimer’s Society or MacMillan will help and advise depending on the circumstances.

Wyllow3

You need to check this out? I felt that there may be legal expectations if you get Carer's allowance as to how much care you do and what it is

I asked: "Wales - if I take carer's allowance how much do I have to care for my parents"

The answer was

"To claim Carer's Allowance in Wales, you must care for your parent(s) for at least 35 hours per week.
This care includes help with daily tasks like washing, cooking, shopping, or managing bills. You cannot combine hours caring for both parents to meet this requirement; you must choose one parent for the claim"

as on here: www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=wales+if+I+take+carers+allowance+how+much+doi+I+have+to+care+fro+my+parents&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

so it may be.... please do check further before you are sure...SSD consider him in this contract?

(and I'm sure he is now doing well over those hours but it does add to a more complex situation with SSD?)

Thanks for looking that up.

I don't know if night-time care counts for this - but, even if it doesnt, I expect he's over that time limit.

He and his sister need to discuss what they are both prepared to do to help their parents. If he has his own home did he move into his parents home to help them? If he doesn’t want to help them now he should move out because if he remains there it would naturally be assumed that he was helping his parents.
It’s a while since I worked for SS and things may have changed but both parents would be assessed for their needs on the basis that they are vulnerable and live alone.

No one chooses to be a carer, it’s a hard road to travel, but is something which is sometimes needed when people often our parents, get older and frailer. No one has to do it, he can just walk away, it’s all rather sad.

You need to check this out? I felt that there may be legal expectations if you get Carer's allowance as to how much care you do and what it is

I asked: "Wales - if I take carer's allowance how much do I have to care for my parents"

The answer was

"To claim Carer's Allowance in Wales, you must care for your parent(s) for at least 35 hours per week.
This care includes help with daily tasks like washing, cooking, shopping, or managing bills. You cannot combine hours caring for both parents to meet this requirement; you must choose one parent for the claim"

as on here: www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=wales+if+I+take+carers+allowance+how+much+doi+I+have+to+care+fro+my+parents&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

so it may be.... please do check further before you are sure...SSD consider him in this contract?

(and I'm sure he is now doing well over those hours but it does add to a more complex situation with SSD?)

ExDancer

Oh - another thing, we found a lovely carer by asking at a local Home. They would send carers out to your house (at a cost) and one of them agreed to come privately and we paid her direct. She became a good friend to Mum, even though she didn't want a carer at first.
A good argument is to tell SServices that its not appropriate for a son to bathe and toilet his mother

That sounds a possibility.

He doesnt think it's that appropriate himself that he's having to deal with all their personal care needs - including his mother.

SueDonim

Do the parents still have capacity to make their own decisions? If there’s a POA in place for your friend or his sister, it might need to be invoked now. Social Services along with medical staff etc can assess the parents. If there’s no POA in place, and they have capacity, they should do one asap, otherwise the courts could take over if/when they lose capacity.

Your friend needs to learn that when it comes to Social Services, No is a complete sentence! If you give SS even a chink of light, they will pile responsibility onto the family and may try to arm twist him into paying for his parents care. Do the parents have savings or a property which could be sold to provide funding?

They have a house - from what comments he makes I don't imagine it's a "luxury living" one (ie worth loads). I'd already gathered what SS can be like from my ex-SS work colleague that gave me a fairly graphic description years back and told me never to get bullied by them - and they'd try. They did try latterly - and I was back checking out my parents in Devon and they were hassling me by phone (though I was telling them clearly I live in Wales/havent got a car and couldnt drive it if I did/etc).

I'd have my doubts his parents have much/if any savings - from what he's said they are typical local small farmers. Though it's a standing joke in Cardiganshire (formerly Ceredigion) that Cardis make against themselves even - to the effect of "Cardis have short arms, long pockets" - but I wouldnt think there's much there.

No idea about Wales but my Late MiL lived in Scotland. She had been in Hospital for various issues plus she had Dementia, at that stage it wasn't bad but she did need help. As soon as we could we drove up to Scotland from the South of England as both of us were still working.

The Hospital told us they would be discharging her into Family care.
So my DH and I, asked why were they discharging her into Hampshire's care.
They assumed we were local, and a forgone conclusion we would help.

Through my job I do have some knowledge about continued care, so told them it was impossible for us to keep driving almost daily for around 10 hours there and 10 hours back, she needed and was entitled to a Care Package, everybody is.
They had to put one into place, they had no other choice.
Speaking from experience with my Mum you can not do Care with out some support, especially 2 people, SS need to be involved. It might cost but it's worth it, for your own sanity.

When I lived in Wales I got Direct Payments so that I could employ a carer of my choosing and at times that suited me. He should ask social services about this.

Sorry that should say £83. weekly.

Carer allowance is paid to the carer , attendance allowance is paid to the
Person needing help.

There is no way a son can be forced to care for his parents, or to pay for their care. He just needs to be firm. His parents need a SS assessment, which will go into their finances, should be done individually. It all depends on thier savings and income. They will be told what SS think they can afford to pay and SS will pay for the rest. Though it has to be said that the SS assessment of what my DH could afford to pay turned out to be his entire pension, so I am doing all his care. We have had to take out money on the house to do the necessary alterations after his stroke.

Right to start with us is entitled to a carers needs assessment, he can ask Social services for this and they should be able to work out a plan with him to return to work but his carers payment will stop when his earnings / hours go over a certain amount, but it isn't that much anyway only £83.00 p.a. A His parents may fight the change in their routine for a short while BUT they will get used to it. Care homes fees can be supported via the local authority but again this is something that can be discussed, they are allowed a certain amount in savings above this threshold you pay but as soon as they hit that threshold the local Authority takes over. Care homes can also give him this information, the fact is he worrying about his inheritance it will always seem like a lot of money but a good care home home can be a lifesaver both for his parents and himself. Another option may be an Sheltered type accommodation so they have their own apartment with on site carers and perhaps a restaurant and activities. That way they remain independent but have someone to " look out" for them.

Oh - another thing, we found a lovely carer by asking at a local Home. They would send carers out to your house (at a cost) and one of them agreed to come privately and we paid her direct. She became a good friend to Mum, even though she didn't want a carer at first.
A good argument is to tell SServices that its not appropriate for a son to bathe and toilet his mother

Sorry to contradict you ExDancer but carer allowance is paid directly to the carer. What you are describing sounds like attendance allowance and it does sound like the parents are eligible if they’re not already receiving it.

Do the parents still have capacity to make their own decisions? If there’s a POA in place for your friend or his sister, it might need to be invoked now. Social Services along with medical staff etc can assess the parents. If there’s no POA in place, and they have capacity, they should do one asap, otherwise the courts could take over if/when they lose capacity.

Your friend needs to learn that when it comes to Social Services, No is a complete sentence! If you give SS even a chink of light, they will pile responsibility onto the family and may try to arm twist him into paying for his parents care. Do the parents have savings or a property which could be sold to provide funding?