Nursing Home Fees

There is no obligation on the daughter, other than, perhaps, a moral one. If the mother requires nursing care, this is provided free of charge by the NHS. It is nobody's business but her own that the daughter lives in a large and valuable house by herself. It may be that this property is her investment for her own old age.

couldn't have put it better Annobel

The daughter is in her late 60's so I do not think the daughter is using the property as an investment for her own old age.

I wonder Bootle if you would like your children (if you have them) to have to sell their homes to pay for your care? I certainly wouldn't take too kindly to having to sell my house to pay for my Mum's care. As Annobel says, nursing care is provided free by the NHS. Should she be forced to sell her house if her Mum had cancer?

I'm puzzled by your assumption that the daughter is not using her property as an investment for her own old age, Bootle. Late sixties is not young, after all...

I would certainly not allow my daughters to sell their homes to pay for my care.

Nor me!

The daughter is widowed and all of her children have left home and are now married.
What I am saying is the daughter has no need for a 6 bedroom detached house any more so she should downsize and pay her mother's nursing home fees rather than having the bill paid by the taxpayer.
If say the daughter has a 2 bedroom flat then that should not have to be sold but I do think if a parent require's care their offspring's wealth should be assessed and they should be made to contribute if they have a lot more money than they need for their present circumstances.

The mother has an illness Bootle!! She will also probably have paid contributions via taxes and NIC over her life. If she hasn't then her husband will have done. I repeat - if you get a terminal illness, should your children have to sell their homes to pay for your care?

I'm not selling my home to fund my mother's care even though it is too big for just the two of us. We need a big house for when the children come home - though on second thoughts......but I still wouldn't use it to pay my Mum's fees!

That is all irrelevant ,*Bootle*. If the mother had an obvious physical illness would you be insisting that the daughter should pay for her care? The FACT is that if a condition requires NURSING CARE, the patient is entitled to free treatment and care by the NHS. No matter how well-heeled her family is reputed to be.

Annobel is right. You have to ask for a nursing needs assessment. The NHS should pay if nursing care is required (as distinct from such things as help with dressing and bathing there would need to be actual nursing procedures required). It slightly begs the question as to how the NHS can afford all this without cutting front line services!

Our local hospital has virtually gone bankrupt as such a high proportion of its income goes to pay off the loan under the PFI initiative that got it built in the first place. We are all waiting to see what happens - it will have to be bailed out as it is the district hospital for the whole county! But who does the bailing we do not know.

Not every mother-child relationship is loving and supportive, Bootle. Here in France, it is virtually impossible to disinherit your children even if they have treated you very badly, but British law recognises the reality of family breakdown. We have no way of knowing the full facts about the situation you describe, but even if the mother and daughter have a wonderful relationship, I still would not expect the daughter to have to sell her family home.

Bootle, you shoudnt confuse NHS payments with Social Services payment. People who need to be in care but do not need nursing care and do not have the means to pay for their own care approach Social Services to have their care fees paid partially or fully paid. If they own a house it may need to be sold to pay the fees.

People who need continous nursing care but are not receiving acute treatment (operations, dialysis etc etc) would previously have stayed in hospital in long-stay wards. Do you remember the depressing longstay geriatric wards of previous generations? The NHS has decided, rightly, that hospitals are not the right place for these patients and as they do not operate nursing homes they pay for these patients to stay in specialised nursing homes. This lady would not be expected to pay for her care if she were in a long stay ward in a hospital, even if she were the owner of the £900,000 house, because she needs continous nursing care. If the NHS choose to outsource some of their treatments that is their financial responsibility not the patients regardless of the patients financial situation.

More paractically, what if the mother were in an ordinary care homeand the daughter decided to sell her house to pay the fees. She puts her house on the market, gets a quick sale and quick exchange of contracts. The day after exchange her mother dies, having been in care for only a month or two. What happens to the daughter then? She has turned her life upside down, can only back out of the sale of her house at a substantial cost which she may not be able to meet, has incurred all sorts of other costs to no purpose as there areno more fees to pay.

Hi Greatnan

Even with wills things are not completely fair in England.
I know of a situation where there were 2 brothers and the mother was in a nursing home for about 2 years and the will said the estate would be divided evenly.
With dementia items get ruined etc.
The one son lived nearby and he was early retired and the other lived nearly 200 miles away and never visited.
When the mother passed away the other son tried to complain an excessive amount of the mother's money had been spent on replacement glasses, food,wine etc.
He also wanted proof that his brother had not drank some of the wine and eat some of the food.
What annoyed the brother he did not even like the type of wine he purchased for his mother nor some of the food so he would not have consumed these items.
He certainly had no use for his mother's glasses.

FlicketyB

I understand the £900,000 house belonged to the daughter and not the patient anyway.

Yes, I realised that but I was doing an 'even if the mother owned it and not the daughter'. Sorry I did not make this clear.