Does anyone else think that there is far too much petty bickering on GN

Granny 23 I think you have put it very well indeed.

most people on here seem to be very spirited inidividuals and quite capable of working out things for themselves, and the danger comes when a "victim" enlists others to do their dirty work for them sorry to put it that way, this is what happened to me.

So far I have not seen any evidence of this on hear not that I am on here all the time!!!
it seems pretty good to me!!

I have never found any of your posts patronising, Mamie, and if someone accused you of being so you would probably apologise even though the intention was not there. Most Gransnetters are like that, but there are one or two who consistently refuse to take any responsibility for the effect their posts may have on others.

Cheellu have you actually read the post where gillybob 'was called bitter and told to get off Gransnet'? I have and my interpretation was that 'bitter' was certainly an apt description of parts of the foregoing posts from GB. I am not particularly royalist but felt she was being unnessarily harsh to these people who have had 'greatness thrust upon them' which was upsetting those who love the Royals. She was not ordered to get off Gransnet, it was merely suggested that if she found GN so distasteful, another forum might suit her better.

On this and other forums and in real life I have often seen the damage which is done when someone casts themselves in the role of victim, attracts kindly people to stick up for them and mayhem ensues because no one names names, people think THEY are being accused, quotes are taken out of context or subtly changed, etc.etc. I have been on GN since the start and (to my shame) have read all of the contentious threads from end to end (because I believe you should ALWAYS consider the whole thread before posting). I have NEVER seen anything that I would consider to be bullying. I have seen some rudness, some lack of tact or diplomacy, some inappropriate humour but nothing designed specially to cause upset or to drive someone from the forum. I love my/our Gransnet and am upset/bewildered to see it described in these terms giving in to some selfish/nasty/bullying behaviour which is surely a bad thing? In my experience it is better to stand up to such people or they will continue with their inconsiderate/arrogant/patronising behaviour and will have achieved their aim. Sorry Movedalot I have just plucked this bit from your post because it was nearest. If Gransnet WAS populated by people who behaved in that way, I would be first out the door

Would it help to say what we understand by bullying? My understanding (which was pretty much set out in the link I posted), is that it is targeted, persistent and aimed at a person directly, rather than at their views. I would probably call direct attacks such as the one Ceesnan describes as flaming (though I can't find the exact link so I can't be sure). I am in no doubt that personal attacks aimed at undermining or upsetting someone intentionally should be reported, as should flaming. I don't think reporting such behaviour is "telling tales", it is asking someone independent to arbitrate, which in my mind is the right thing to do.
Having people disagree with our cherished beliefs can be painful, but I do not think it is bullying. I get upset when I write something which people misinterpret and I feel I am being condemned for something I didn't say. I still don't think that is bullying.
I think, Ana, that patronising is different. I am sure we can all sound patronising, pompous, grumpy etc at different times. I apologise for the times that I have sounded like that.

Agreed, jings. You've said in a few words what I've been blethering about all day

Do you mean diplomacy and arbitration as the third option, jodi? If so, who is to do it – the 'victims' or the 'accused' or someone else? And how is the accused to know s/he is being accused if only vague complaints are aired, as is usually the case?

Actually, there are some members of gransnet who do a good job of mediation quite often. It doesn't seem to stop the complaints or the posts that cause the complaints though, unfortunately.

Wrong bags there is a third option, you have obviously not bothered to read my posts.
ana you are correct but these people are never going to see that there are posts that are downright offensive, rude, aimed at denying people the right to their own opinion, cumulating in, as cheelu pointed out, being told to get off the forum and professing to speak for the 'many'.
I don't honestly know if they really cannot see it or whether they are being wilfully blind. I would prefer to give them the benefit if the doubt.
Anyway I've said my piece, again, I'm off to see who's going out of strictly.

Why is it so unreasonable to expect others to change, or at least acknowledge that their posts may have been seen as bullying or patronising? The onus always seems to be on the one who has felt belittled or ignored to 'deal with it' by adopting one of the tactics suggested above. Grannylin I'm sure you're right that no one has had a post deleted for bullying. It would be like 'telling tales to the teacher', and in any case the charge would be categorically denied.

Well said jingle

Surely, the point is that GN is generally great fun. sensitive, informative supportive etc etc. If we have bickering, so what, we have to take the rough with the smooth. Fight back or ignore it. It's a bit like a family really (well ours any way!)

i have been on receiving end of bullying on another forum, but to be honest I think the posters on here are more outspoken just not found any evidence so far of the bullying I found elsewhere maybe been lucky so far??

some people are more confrontational than others and I would tend to avoid that there are a lot of posters on here and most of us are pretty amiable lot I would say??!!

What doesn't kill you makes you strong.

Definitely applies on GN. (and nothing on here's gonna kill you)

What has been denied, jodi? We (people on this thread) seem to be agreed that people get upset by others' comments sometimes. The question is how to deal with it. Seems to me there are two options: complain on the thread or ignore it by not commenting. Some of us have found the second option effective. Others seem to prefer complaining and expecting others to change rather than making a change (i.e. ignoring it) themselves. Take your pick is what it boils down to.

Like Bags and when I tend to walk away; the odd time I've made a snippy comment I feel crosser with myself than with the person who has annoyed me!

Exactly anno it's so obvious. But the deniers have an agenda which is rather transparent.

Did you actually read what CHEELU wrote in her last post jessm? Why are you say you are a bit 'mystified' ?? That was quite clear.

Does anyone agree that the question that starts this thread is somehow on its way to providing its own answer?

Cheelu I am a bit mystified as to why this seems to be bothering you so much. As a fairly new member, (I think) why are you worrying away at this?
Are you trying to say people have been unpleasant to you or are you worried that they might be in future?
There are lots of pleasant areas in this forum that are uncontroversial and very unlikely to lead to disagreements if you want to avoid them.

I completely agree with everything bags says.Everyone takes things in different ways.Being challenged /got at or whatever one feels, is only how that individual perceives the situation.Some Grans on here write extremely interesting posts, others funny and flippant, some just plain dull but who cares.Just keep away from the ones that don't appeal.Life's too short and exciting for such pondering. Has anyone ever had a post deleted for bullying- I doubt it.

---gillybob was called bitter and told to get off Gransnet, to me that is very serious bullying.

Well said Ceesnan nana, you are so right, it is much more pleasant to say 'I think' or 'imo' to soften what one has to say and far less hurtful than the 'caustic and opinionated' You are also right about some 'cliquey and ignore comments from people who are not in their "group"'. I also have noticed that.

Yes, I do concede that, ceesnan. But I still think that walking away from comments one finds distressing is a good idea. It doesn't mean one has given in or lost, just that it's not worth encouraging domineering or patronising comments by answering them. The same goes for catty comments or ones that might be funny from someone else's point of view. I only say this because I find it helps me to do that.

This seems to happen on most forums. People forget that with the written word is hard to pick up on the true message. I try to use the letters IMHO (in my humble opinion) if I feel what I am saying is contradicting or slightly controversial, and I think it comes across as less harsh. I do agree that some people on here can be rather caustic and opinionated, but I also find that some people can be cliquey and ignore comments from people who are not in their "group" and that makes me reluctant to comment if I see they are taking over a thread. BUT, having said that we are all different and there are some great people on here who are very supportive and great fun and this is a fabby site which I thoroughly enjoy xx

Bags while there might not be any out and out bullies on GN would you concede that there are one or two regular posters who positively thrive on 'heated debates' and can come across as patronising or domineering, both of these can be off putting to someone who is not as experienced in the art of cyber fencing.

Ceesnan I make you right--can not think of anything better than to go away and ignore it--I have now learnt that,, and will never again get into silly banter..just was soooo shocked, did not expect to get such nonsense on a Granny site!!

I do think that the good far far outweighs the bad. If I felt that I was being bullied I would not log on for a bit and wait for things to settle. I would get on with the things that I should be doing when I am tatting about in the ether!