Floods!

.....and what good will that do them? I have more respect for the Conservative minister, Liz Truss, I think, who seems to have been on tv every day throughout the Christmas period visiting areas affected by the floods and, presumably has had little or no break from work over Christmas, unlike the head of the Environment Agency who didn't let a small matter of flooding and flood defences, a key part of his agencies work, come between him and his Christmas holiday in Barbados.

I do not quite get the point of your two links Durhamjen. The first is all about UK immigrants to other countries and anyway has no data on the Uk and the other dates back to 2011 and I believe the government has revised and increased the money going to flood alleviation since then.

Why does the fact that the cuts are all to northern projects mean a north south divide? As far as I can see most of the flooding in recent years, with the exception of the floods on the Somerset levels has been in the north of England so I presume that most of the expenditure on flood prevention is in the north. It is not possible to cut funding in the south if there is very little expenditure in the first place.

Certainly one of the reasons our family member in York in a flood threatened area has been saved from flooding is because there have been extensive improvements to the flood defences in her area since the last floods in 2000.

I am not a supporter of the Conservatives and I have never in my life voted for them but I do not believe in the excessive partisan attitudes that can see no good in any party they do not support. All parties, in government and out, do things that are excellent and others that are repellent.

M0nica well said

I can remember this thread running when the Somerset levels and large parts of the country was flooded. The grans were concerned then that We must tackle what seemed a high likelihood that it would happen again, suggesting that perhaps, just perhaps cutting the flood defence budget was not a terribly sensib,e thing to do as it makes absolutely no economic sense whatsoever.

Since then the Environment Agency budget has been cut just under 30 percent each year as it had the years previous since 2010.

wonder what will happen now?

I do hope that photograph is framed and hung on the wall by the relevant planning authorities. If planning is granted for house building development anywhere, in the most unsuitable places, how can any government keep up with the need for flood control? It becomes a bottomless pit.

Taken to extremes, there would be housing built between high and low tide marks, and King Canute employed to command the waves to stay back.

Exactly Elegran

The point many of us are making Whitewave is that this isn't just an issue for central government. Local authorities, be it country, district, town or parish, need to play their part. And, as I keep going on and on about, so do farmers and landowners (and here I include the NT, Forestry Commision, the Jockey Club and the like), government agencies, surveyors, estate agents, builders as well as Jo Public all need to pull together.

For example, when we bought out present house, the surveyors report included a section on flood risk. I don't know if this is usual these days but it ought to be mandatory that this is included in even a basic house survey.

Just a simple inclusion like that would give new buyers the chance to make an informed decision.

anya absolutely - it is the responsibility of all agencies. However the point that I am making is - what message does 30% cuts year on year give out?

Planning applications in my area have to be referred for a flood report - even those halfway up a sizeable hill.

It strikes me with situations like Anya's posted picture that is going around on F.B that local planning commitees should take some responsibility about such bad planning decisions.

The potential for local councillors, business interests etc to "unduly influence" such decisions etc,seems at times to hint at less than open and reputable practices. (To put it in such a manner that I am not claiming any potential corruption.)

www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/dec/30/experts-criticise-george-osborne-over-flood-protection-funding

Anybody believe the experts? Probably not as it's an article from the Guardian.

I do not know if any of you have noticed, but the floods in York have affected Victorian and Edwardian houses, not just new build in floodplains.

Oh dear me no DJ how silly of us, we didn't know that we really are 'pink poodles'

titters girlishly and goes of to find latest copy of 'Hello'

www.migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/data-and-resources/maps/census-map-non-uk-born-share-population-england-and-wales-2011

Thanks for pointing that out to me Monica. That wasn't the one I clicked.
I was going to show you the non-uk born share of the population as you were arguing about where the number of immigrants was the greatest.
I thought a bit of real statistics was needed.
Obviously you will disagree with real statistics.
The reason the figures are 2011 is because they are the most up-to-date on immigration. Unless you know otherwise. The Migration Observatory seems to be believed by most statisticians.
By the way, if you had been interested enough to click on the link, you would have found this information within another two clicks.

Did anyone watch David Attenborough's programme about the Great Barrier Reef last night? It was interesting to note that the Aboriginal people who live near Cairns have passed down legends through dance about the time, 14,000 years ago, when the ice sheets melted and the sea covered the land they lived on. This warming was very rapid and happened in a generation - the land stretched as far out as the continental shelf which is just beyond the Great Barrier Reef (the reef has formed since that time). The distance from Cairns to the Reef is over 50 kms (an hour and a half by boat).

Scientists are just discovering about this now.
(Perhaps they should have asked the native Australians)

I don't think there is anything we can do to stop this happening, tinkering at the edges by stopping the burning of fossil fuels may help somewhat, but if there was such a rapid rise in C02 all those thousands of years ago what caused it?

We need to look at adapting our lifestyles and where we live, not trying to push back the waves like latter-day King Canutes.

Anybody believe the experts?

Well, which one to believe as they disagree amongst themselves endlessly as to cause and effect?

No-one really seems to know all the causes. No-one knows what the outcome will be.

This problem seems bigger than present-day brains can cope with.

So rosequartz What do you suggest we do?

There has always been flooding.

Just saying.

Oh! I didn't realise -rq was a big-shot in the environment agency!!

What's that? She's not? Go and ask someone who is then!

Some of this is probably down to us. A lot of it is most likely normal climate change. The sort that has always happened.

Best to go along with the measures suggested by today's scientists.

So rosequartz What do you suggest we do?

This problem seems bigger than present-day brains can cope with

Adapt as the primitive Aboriginal people did? Instead of trying to fight it or carry on as if it isn't happening, eg as in the proposed building on a flooded site in Anya's link above.
Heads in the sand (or floodwater).

Like my son jing He is responsible for the South Coast from Southampton to Kent.
The staff are highly educated - most with PHDs in environmental sciences etc. They employ a wide range of experts and work widely with other agencies and charities. I will not go into what he says as this would perhaps betray his trust. What I say on GN is what can be gleaned from media.

They need to shout a bit louder then whitewave to educate the planners!

Best attack the problem on all fronts, too, with government, local authorities, housing developers and Joe/Josephine Bloggs who is buying a new house in a vulnerable area all aware of the possibility of there being more water than usual. Blaming one section shifts it nicely from everyone else, it doesn't solve the problem and stop it happening again.

So in the meantime how are we to protect our infrastructure like bridges, roads, electrical and gas installations and our nuclear generating sites?
What if you live in a flood prone area? What do we suggest they do poor buggers - adapt

They do rosequartz but do not have the legal ability to stop them

Of course, as some experts believe that a period of global warming precedes another ice age it may not be long before we are all frozen and the seas retreat.

I don't know whitewave, but planning ahead needs to be a priority.
People who have asked for permission to raise their homes on to stilts as in other flood-prone countries have been denied planning permission.