Joys of night-flights....

I didn't mean my comment to be harsh Polly, just asking for equal respect for my feelings. A short time might be bearable. A twelve hour flight with only half a seat isn't.

Nana and Grampy, I do get that bigger people feel bad sometimes. My issue was that Magicwriter was complaining that people do not respect her but should she expect respect if she won't give it?
I suppose my experience is that larger people don't even try to stay in their space. If someone has to be uncomfortable because there is not enough room then surely it should be them and not me? Should my legs be squashed up against the side of the plane because their legs are wide apart or should they squash their legs together? Should I have to squash my shoulders inwards and have my elbows pressed into my sides because they take all the armrest and more or should they be prepared to to sit like that to take up less room?
The more people on a plane the cheaper the fare and everyone wants cheap fares. It doesn't seem unreasonable that people who take up more room should have to pay more.

I agree the fault is with airlines making seat room too small in order to cram as many people in as possible to make more money.
Eglantine that comment was a bit harsh. Do you expect overweight people never to travel? Surely you xanout up with a bit of discomfort for a short time. As orgers have sad ther are lots of ways people can annoy otger passenges- with crying babies, children kicking the back of the seat, talking loudly all night, drinking too much, coughing and sneezing etc etc. We just have to put up with it and be tolerant if we want cheap flights.
And to the person who said all hell breaks loose when you say fatty please be aware that it is a very offensive term rather like some racist words or some words for people with disabilities which I wont mention here. Better to say large or overweight or well built.

Eglatine don't for one second think plus size people are not fully aware of the issues . I have travelled extensively for business and pleasure and now generally upgrade to avoid inconveniencing anyone with my large bottom or my limited mobility .

But really , the whole issue is not in the hands of the people, it's in the increasingly greedy hands of airlines who are making both their seat pitch and width smaller and smaller. All in an effort to fit more folks in.

They make money from people such as yourself you might pre book seats to avoid over size seat mates. They make money from tall people who want extra leg room. From families who wish to sit together - the list is endless .

And we the consumer do not vote with our feet , we let them. The average U.K. Woman is a size 16 , yet a size 16 ( not a plus size by anyone's measure surely) already encroaches on the next persons seat. So it's almost impossible to not sit in close physical proximity to your seat mate.

With the next seat size reduction, a size 14 will be squished.... what's the answer?

Surely people are able to rub along (pardon the pun!) without thinking that everything is all about them?
Until anyone can afford a private jet then we're all exposed to other people, and their assorted shapes, sizes, smells and whatever else.

Dear Magicwriter, I'm sorry you are so angry about people not being respectful of you. I would hope that I would respect you as a person. But are you respectful of me and my feelings when you or other large people make my journey uncomfortable and press against my body. Surely you should respect my not wanting to make intimate body contact with you.
You seem to be demanding respect without being willing to give it.

Good for you Nfk! We have a friend who has had weight problems for years. Ended up with terrible lymphodaema. Went to clinic, they told him unless you lose weight we will no longer treat you. The next time he went, no change in weight, they asked if he thought they were joking. . . . That was the wake up call for him. He joined a slimming club and has lost 9 1/2 stone! He's like a new man! His wife says it's like getting her husband back. If he can do it anyone can. Sadly, of course, it's all on the mind.

Right. The diet starts tomorrow. At least I may possibly be able to get down to an average 16 by next March!

Too bloody true!

Surely our wrath should be towards the airlines, not different sized folk. Or are we going to go down the route that only folk who are a size x or under are allowed to fly? I have spent many a flight in agony because the armrests are digging into my hips, then on other flights, I have had room to spare in my seat. And believe me, us larger folk do feel hugely embarrassed if we find ourselves encroaching on other folks space. I think we all need to think about other folks feelings before we start calling folk 'fat, fatties, skinny, stick insects' and so on. We are people first and foremost and should be respectful to each other, this world is crazy enough without finding more ways to hurt each other.

Actually Jess if you look at my graphic above you'll see airline seats AREN'T designed for the average UK woman ( given that the average is a size 16) .

That average will already have you encroaching on the next seat/person. Only size 14 and under will fit without any encroachment.

Whatever words are used then it is undeniable that those with v wide mid sections or very long legs can impinge badly on the comfort of those sitting next to them. Whose rights are more important? The person who has paid for a seat that they cannot fully occupy, or the person who has paid for a seat knowing that they won't fit into it?
Seats are designed for average-sized passengers. If they are designed for double the average then we would all be paying much more for our air tickets.
I was once in a row of 3 with an enormous Samoan couple. He was vast and wearing a splendid outfit involving a sarong and a grass mat thing around his middle. His wife was v grateful when I relocated myself elsewhere once the seat belt signs off, so that she was not shoehorned into the middle seat for next 3 hours.

I've found the graphic I referred to earlier .

As you can clearly see if you are a size 16 or over you are encroaching on the other persons space.

So we're not talking morbidly obese people here... just the average sized 16 UK woman - which according to some research is now the norm.

Maybe we should stop blaming people for encroaching on our space and start making airlines put people slightly higher up their list than profit because airline seating sizes are decreasing.

Oh I think it's a bit offensive. Slim is complimentary though. But its probably best not to make any comments about a person's body shape at all unless its a compliment eg What a lovely figure you've got' but even then it's dodgy. I had a very tall friend once who was fed up with everyone commenting on her height. She got especially fed up with hearing'what's the weather like up there' and similar comments. I think tge furthest you can go with an overweight person would be to say 'larger' .

Is being called skinny as rude as being called fat? I wish someone would call me skinny. Scrawny on the other hand - that's an insult! (Not that anyone calls me that either)

No excuse for rudeness, whatever shape a person is in. If name calling ( because that's what it is) hurts a person, why hurt somebody else with similar comments?

You are too fat obviously not skinny

Yet again, all sympathy for 'fatties' as obese people are being called on this thread and I did have sympathy until I was described by one poster as being "uncomfortable to look at" and one I have been called before "stick insect", I am a size 8 and I have lost count of the many overweight people who have no qualms, whether it upsets me or not, to comment on my weight. So, why is it unforgivable of me to say to someone, "you really need to lose some weight, you are too skinny"?

Something I would never be hurtful enough to say.

If you say someone is tall or thin that is not discriminatory. When you say fat then all hell breaks loose. It is factual that grossly overweight people spill over airline seats to inconvenience their neighbours. Being in a plane is stressful enough without having your paid for space usurped by these inconsiderate people. All they have to do is pay for an extra seat or one in a higher class.

It is not my intention to be unkind to fat people but this is a matter of only using what you have paid for. My DH is tall therefore we always pay for extra leg room to accommodate this. A waste of money for me but hey ho that's what we have to do. By the same token fat people should pay for the space they take up too. On a different tack this issue of obesity really needs to be tackled-as we're trying to do with smoking, alcohol abuse and gambling. I realise folks will shout "nanny state" but is it really acceptable to allow folks to get "addicted" and then expect the rest of us to pick up the pieces? I do all I can to keep a healthy weight and keep as active as I can, don't smoke, drink or gamble but. . . . I have a terrible sweet tooth and it takes an iron will to avoid the stuff. I have offered a friend that if they give up smoking I will give up cake! I'm serious too but, of course, she doesn't want to stop despite poverty and health problems. These problems are mental health problems sadly.

I agree Esspee. I (officially only over weight as 5'7" 16/18) fit snugly in the seat and don't overlap, and although I have sympathy with larger folk I don't see why they shouldn't have sympathy for me and not think it their right to take over my space.

I think its time, as now Eastern nationalities are generally getting larger as well, that air lines reviewed their seating policies and gave us more space. Travelling 'Cattle Class' has become a too accurate a description.

I'm appalled at the discriminatory attitude of some of the posters here. What started off as a perfectly innocent post, has now turned into nasty slurs about "fat" people...how dare you!

Maddy, I am size 16 and (officially) obese. I have never been given an airline seat that I couldn't fit into comfortably without inconveniencing neighbouring passengers. I was not being mean and spiteful, just stating facts. If I have paid£800+ for a seat why should I be deprived of my allotted space by someone who clearly needs two seats.

I was the first to mention the problem of fat people on an aircraft. It was not meant to be fat shaming, I really don't care why they are fat (I am overweight myself but fit into all airline seats). I merely said that if one seat isn't big enough for them then they should pay for two (or upgrade to a larger seat). Why should other people be inconvenienced and deprived of whatever comfort they have paid for by someone who should have paid for the extra room they need. Try sitting next to a fat person on a flight to New Zealand and you would soon understand that my comment was reasonable.

Esspee did you mean to sound so mean and spiteful? If so, how very rude. You, I presume look like a stick insect.