Debenhams and other failing businesses

Agree about WH Smith, how can these shops in prime positions selling such attractive, needed items do it SO badly? Staff always seem grumpy, allowing long queues to build. They insist on the use of horrible self-payment machines which don't work, even when there are staff standing around doing nothing. The cheaper stores, such as Primark, The Works & Wilco, seem do it so much better, with plenty of helpful staff & speedily dealt with queues at the till...

Have to agree with others who have said that M&S staff will more often than not be faffing around on the shop floor, anything but man the till, Particularly surprised this can also be the case on their "20% long weekends" when they are busier than usual still queues at tills, our local branch does do that ring the bell behind the counter thing to summon a member of staff to open another till, but even that doesn't seem to rouse anyone sometimes It's a shame the company don't seem to correlate public dissatisfaction which I do believe they are aware of, with the downward trajectory in sales.

John Lewis in my nearby town are always pretty helpful, I do love it as a store it's one of my favourite go to places to shop. We don't have a Debenhams but whenever I go into one of their stores it does amaze me how they survive, by the skin of their teeth it seems, they've been pretty shambolic for years.

Yes do agree teifi about WH Smith, just diabolical, unhelpful staff, quite often there isn't anyone to help if the self service tills go wrong and interminable queues around "pile it high" displays of chocolate that nobody wants God forbid Waterstones ever disappears I'd hate to go to WH Smiths for my books.

I so agree with the OP!
On Friday morning I was watching Breakfast TV and there was a panel on there discussing the demise of the High Street following the dismal Christmas figures. All agreed that the only way forward was by concentrating on customer service.
So, I sallied forth onto my local high street. I was looking for a dress and so made an infrequent visit to our one remaining (hanging on by a thread!) department store.
Customer service??!! I hardly saw any! I wandered around, browsing for something ( I'm not usually a dress-wearer, so would have been glad of assistance). In one department, I gathered 6 dresses to try on, there were two assistants behind the desk chatting to each other, I was offered no assistance, had to trek over to them to ask if I could use the changing room and was just waved in the general direction. Nobody came to see how I was getting on or offer assistance.
In another department, I made a small purchase and the assistant managed to complete it without uttering one word or making eye contact! |It was so hot and I was getting so discouraged that I left after this.
As others have said, where are the managers? I fear there will be no other option than online soon.

I contacted my local supermarket and made a comment about the number of empty shelves. I received a reply from the manager asking which shelves were empty!! I suggested she take a walk around the store and find out for herself

The " older " staff members of past and present department stores were/are the most attentive and pleasing staff and were good for the business as people returned year after year.
Then came the explosion of younger ( disinterested ) staff who were there " for the money " only and had little interest in the customer or what he/she wanted. Followed by the demise of businesses because of a reduction in sales partly due to the internet but mainly due to the lack of wanting to sell leading to customer dissatisfaction.

Often the more senior staff are employed on good employment contracts being either full or part-time depending on their wishes. Those staff normally retain their terms and conditions due to historical factors that very often make it difficult for the employer to change those contracts.

However, new employees are often engaged on zero hour contracts or even employed through the Gig Economy which makes for very different working conditions and therefore interest in the job.

When an employer demonstrates little interest in its employees, is it any wonder that the employee demonstrates little interest in their employer or its customers.

I do believe that we tend to see all 'service' jobs as not terribly important: retail assistants, waiting etc.
If the general public do not show they value these workers it becomes a vicious circle and the quality of service deteriorates. I had a job in an independent department store for a short while before I went to college.
I was trained, as a temp, to clean the glass display cases, how to greet customers, to offer advice & encourage additional purchases as well as the practicalities of the till and the whooshy vacuum system when we had to send the notes up to accounts! At the same store I also spent 4 weeks as a waitress in the in-store Kenya Coffee House. Again I was trained and supported to be a good waitress. I think big stores seem to see all their staff as temps but do not invest in them sufficiently to buy their loyalty!

Surprisingly, my best shopping experiences have been with the "youth"shops. I have been very well served in JDSports and Sports Direct. Also Topshop
Could it be that these Stores enliven their assistants because of the trendy stuff they sell? If I was young, I wouldn't want to work in the Mum/Dad/Granny world of Deb. HoF et al. JL being the only exception; very good service but not really youth oriented. After saying this, 95% of of purchasing is online!

Popped into M&S for coffee today. Had a look at Per Una and remarked to the assistant that the clothes weren't getting any better. She seemed quite offended so I pointed out the cheap and nasty looking gold zip on a pair of trousers. She informed me that that was just my opinion and walked off. I followed her and told her that a lot of us feel the same. I was treated to a lecture about how "passionate" she is about the clothes and how hard they are working to "deliver" the latest range. I told her that she'd lost me at "deliver" and could we carry on without the jargon and she accused me of being offensive and walked of again. Not the sort of interaction with customers that I was taught when I worked there!

Oh goodness - it sounds typically M&S today - the customer is always wrong!

I took back a light showerproof which was anything but showerproof, unfortunately the receipt had been lost although I did have my credit card bill.
The showerproof cost £25 originally and they refunded me £2.50 - enough for a cup of coffee! They said they would contact me after testing the garment - zilch months later.

Contrast with White Stuff - I took in my bank statement when I found a fault with a top but had lost the receipt. They apologised and the assistant located the same top online and had it delivered to my home.

Deedaa I must say that following the assistant and persisting with informing her of your opinion sounds a bit aggressive. It's nice that the assistant was so convinced that the stock was lovely. There's nothing she can do to change it.
Just let the tills tell the management what the customers think of their clothing offering.

Jane10 she really should have been able to refuse the situation, rather than making it quite clear that my opinion was of no interest. We used to be taught this stuff. Should have said she was actually a manager so should have known better.

House of Fraser (Sports Direct) has negotiated with intu and will not be closing down their stores in intu shopping malls (Lakeside (Essex), Nottingham and 2 other sites).
Which is good need for their employees and those shoppers who use these stores.

Deedaa all these companies have non harrassment policies. You following her and persisting in putting your point of view could gave been viewed rather negatively. As I said, there was nothing she could do about stock ordered centrally. Let the tills do the talking. If you want old fashioned customer service try shopping in smaller or privately owned shops. The chain stores are just that - chain stores.

Absolutely agree about WH Smiths prestbury. The high street branches are so grubby and messy that I just avoid going in there. If you do go in, they try to force you to use self-checkouts and buy unwanted chocolates which are mounded up around the one staffed checkout point. Great business model!

With regard to clothing and the occasional visit to a large town for a treat, it is just not possible any more. In most of the main shops, such as M and S , Debenhams, and even J Lewis, the clothing is impractical, does not fit, not cut in a suitable manner, poor quality and made in some country where labour costs are very low. The result of this is that I have had to turn to home dress making, which would be enjoyable, if I did not have children and grandchildren to look after, meals to prepare, two houses to keep clean, and a fairly large garden to sort.
It is not surprising that these shops are not doing well when one sees what is contained therein. I walked around Debenhams just before Christmas last year, and it was pretty awful, for the reasons outlined above.
M and S started to go down hill about 20 years ago for all the usual reasons. Poor quality and made in "God knows where'.

I haven't been able to find anything I like in M&S for quite some time - badly made clothes aimed at the young who wouldn't shop in M&S.

I like John Lewis - I was in our local branch a little while ago with a friend who was buying an electrical item, I wandered off and looked at the TVs, an assistant approached and offered help, I explained I was thinking of getting a new TV but not for a few months so was just looking. He still took the time to explain the merits of each set so when I am ready to buy I will be returning there.

I agree with other posters who commented on 'shambolic' WH Smith and Debenhams. Sadly its not a recent development, I stopped going into Debenhams before I left UK in 2005. It used to be a pleasurable experience having a day shopping but not any more. I think PECS is right in saying that the service industry is undervalued.
In rural France there are no department stores unless you go into large cities. Shops other than supermarkets or DIY shops are in very short supply.

I found myself in JL yesterday. I struck lucky and had excellent service. I find it unpredictable.
It was my first ever job when I was 15. I worked in the invoice department in Jonelle every Saturday.
I was a partner and felt important.
However I read about the new Tzarina they had employed to help JL transition into the post Amazon world and she sounded detached from my reality.
She wants to concentrate on the high end, perfume and designer shoes rather than quality classics and dare I say it - haberdashery. We had to petition to get our fabrics back in the Edinburgh store.
I suppose they know what they're doing as I'm not a big spender.

I have to agree as I have had similar negative experiences in all of the shops mentioned so far. I am particularly disappointed with the decline of M&S which used to be my go to shop for work clothes and now sells nothing that I want to buy. I am especially annoyed with the staff in the cafe there. Plenty of them but they chat and faff about while long queues build up and when I am eventually served the free tables are piled with dirty dishes. Unfortunately, I have vouchers for free hot drinks through their Premium Club membership but I often don’t use them all. I keep the membership going because of the travel insurance which is a good deal.

I really don’t know how W.H. Smith manage to stay in business. I went in recently for some fountain pen refills and baulked at the price but would have bought them had it not been for the fact that I couldn’t find the washable ink ones. Sleepwalking staff were, as usual, no help at all. Later, in the stationery section of a large supermarket, I found exactly the same brand in a larger pack at a cheaper price.

I so agree with prestbury. I was in my local WH Smith a few weeks ago and it was so dim and dark, I have visual problems, I asked if the electricity bill had been paid.

I too have been disappointed in department stores. My main gripe is finding someone to ask - and then to pay! Like many others I'm voting with my feet and prefer to shop on line.

House of Fraser now charge you £5 for delivery to their Stores for customer pick-up. You then get a £5 voucher to spend in Store. I tried to buy some tights to be told they were a franchise and couldn't accept it; ditto the coffee shop. finally put it towards some unwanted make-up! The assistant made the comment that she didn't understand why anyone shopped at HofF! I agree with her.

It infuriates me when I have to queue in M&S Food when I am already paying so much more for the food than I would in other supermarkets. My local one always says 'oh we have had a high number of staff phone in sick today' whenever I complain about having to queue to pay - they literally trot out the same excuse every time!
I avoid shopping there as much as possible.
It also annoys me when the people on the tills have a nice little chat with each customer instead of helping them to pack their stuff and hurry them along so that those of us 3 or 4 back in the queue don't have to wait even longer than necessary!