Remembering Auschwitz

annepl

Apologies to you. I did not see you had started a thread earlier than one I raised on News and Politics. I have duplicated my post on your thread as it is correct to follow a time line and you raised the topic ahead of me.

I posted because I found the Live coverage from Auschwitz this afternoon so moving and all credit to the BBC for covering the 75th Anniversary without interruption to give the occasion the respect it deserved.

' The speeches were so obviously sad but my goodness hit the spot.

The gentleman who spoke of Auschwitz not landing from the sky and the ' 11th Commandment' , the lady from the Roma people , the gentleman who related the story of the child in the ' red coat ' and the fact her ashes were resting behind them were heart breaking, so poignant.

The mention of the rise again of antisemitism and how some even in respected positions of government /politics are once again anti jew etc. etc. etc. could not fail to strike a note of concern, we have learnt nothing if we allow the subliminal messaging of some who do not see their own antisemitism but it is there for all to see.

( in response to Anniebach) - I too watched the coverage from Jerusalem for the World Holocaust Forum and I thought Prince Charles set a perfect tone in his speech and he certainly did the UK proud by remembering what he was there for and not raising politics as a couple of others did. '

I have holidayed a few times in Poland near to where atrocities occured. I feel sometimes the Poles have never recovered.

There are no answers, there are no words.

Pogs thank you for contributing to my thread. I didn't post in News and Politics as I simply wanted people to listen to the song and reflect . The song is so moving even without understanding the words. Impossible to listen without tears.
I wasn't quite accurate. Apparently the song was inspired by words written on the walls of a cell ocupied by a prisoner in a nazi cell who was about to be executed.

No-one outside knew about the camps and what was happening there until the liberation.

The Allies were fighting the Nazis on all fronts and trying to liberate Europe and the rest of the world but no-one imagined there would be such death camps.

Some inspiring stories have come out of the horror.

Thank you annep

So true Daisymae

I have just watched a programme about the Windermere project "in their own words"
www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m000dt7g

Not exactly following on from your postings above but very moving none the less.

I do wish, as a country, we would do more for refugees now. Really we have no excuses.

I watched the Holocaust Day Memorial programme on the television last night with Huw Edwards presenting it very well. That was very moving too with testimony from survivors , music and speeches. Candles were lit at the end. I have recorded several programmes this week to watch when I can.

My school did a Holocaust remembering assembly yesterday. One of the teachers came into my room for a box of tissues. We both said how important it was that the 11-18 year olds were taught about what happened

Thanks for the link NotSpaghetti. I watched the 9pm programme on BBC2. It really made you think about how difficult and sad it was for those poor children.
It's good that young people are educated about it.
Lets hope that this commemoration stays in everyone's mind for a long time and reminds us all to show compassion.

I would not visit Auschwitz or any of the death camps. I would feel contaminated. I know what happened, I know people who had family members there. To me there would be something not decent about going to look at where unspeakable things happened.

What I find interesting is the amount of covert anti semitism there is in the world. I don’t know if it’s just my experience but I have encountered it several times from people I wouldn’t have thought would entertain such views. I believe virtue signallers to be the worst of them. Two very close friends if mine, both British of Irish descent and catholic upbringing. I believe it’s due to their catholic background but may be wrong. Both good women. One always devout but not so much now she’s older, a dedicated nurse and very charitable and kind. In an unguarded moment at Christmas after a few red wines, told me she’s fed up of hearing about what the Jews went through and it wasn’t a patch on what happened to black people. The other one, also a good person, outwardly at least, once told me the Jews should just shut up about the Holocaust, it was the last century, just forget about it! As this came from someone who has often berated the English for what they did to the Irish I soon put her right.

I find it frightening that ‘good’ people can hold such views and I truly believe there are many more that hold their tongue when unsure of their audience.

I visited Neuengamme concentration camp in Germany when visiting my friend in Hamburg. It was haunting and the way the Germans have everything arranged is a testament to their pledge that it must never happen again. There are various rooms playing footage of the camp and each room is in a different language so most visitors can find narration they can understand. There are rooms full of belongings and uniforms and yellow star badges. There are tables where you can sit with headphones on and hear various stories about real people that were taken there. One I found particularly moving was the story of a Gypsy boxer, Johann Trollmann, who fought for Germany but Hitler wouldn’t have a Gypsy in his army so he was brought back to be worked to death in Nuengamme.

I don’t know about Auschwitz but this camp was educational and they need to be preserved to educate people as to what can happen and what did happen and how supposedly civilised people can descend into pure sadism and evil. Needless to say entry to this camp was free and the only money being taken was in the small coffee shop. It wasn’t a money making exercise in any way and I commend the Germans who are ashamed of this diabolical chapter in their history.

I also saw the programme last night about the children and it moved me to tears. Just how can people do this to another its beyond belief. It still goes on, Burma, US, and dare I say it Israel and Palestine. Please, please, let it stop.

Yesterday was a day of official mourning for those who were murdered at Auschwitz and other Nazi concentration camps. Nothing should have interfered with that and nothing did.

Today we could maybe pause to reflect on what we hear is happening to Muslims in parts of China about which no protests from Britain appear to be made as we rush to make trade deals. Similarly as already mentioned above the deliberate genocide, or what amount to it, in parts of Africa and the Middle East to whom we readily sell arms. Is this what the learning of lessons amounts to?

I was about 9 years old when I saw the liberation of Belsen people on the Cinema news

I have never forgotten it,, I can`t cope with this on tv.. I know we have to remember, but I wish we did something positive to stop it ever happening again, and it is happening, now,,, in other countries,, genocide..

That is so, so sad tickingbird. I was brought up Catholic and went to a Catholic school. There were quite a few Jewish children there and some were my friends. My parents had Jewish friends and business associates and they went to numerous family celebrations, my dad attending the boys’ bar mitzvah. He was given his own kippot (I think that is what it’s called - the domed hat?).

I do hope this is just your misfortune, it doesn’t speak to my experience.
One of my few close, long term friends is a Jew. We brought up our children side-by-side and I love her dearly.

And yes. Now we have genocide elsewhere. People are people. We have the same loves, fears and worries whatever religion but our politicians are only prepared to tackle the easy stuff and will do anything for trade. You only need to see where we supply arms, and our response to refugees.

Tickingbird, what you have written about is truly awful. That people in Britain, not Tommy Robinson and his ilk, but ordinary, everyday people, can say such, well to me anyway, appalling things, shows that anti semitism is alive and well in Britain today. That people should shut up about the holocaust!!!! That she’s fed up hearing about the Jews!!!! That black people suffered more!!!! Does she think this is some sort of competition about who suffered more? Words fail me!

NotSpaghetti, with respect, I think this isn’t your experience because you’re not Jewish. Tickingbird, correct me if I’m wrong, is Jewish, and the remarks that were directed to her are anti Semitic.

What can I do to make sure vulnerable minority peoples are not murdered or otherwise harmed by those in power?

PS I did join the letter writing crowd of Amnesty International and feel it to be rather a lonely effort.

Can there really be any ‘Bystanding’ for any kind of ‘ism’? Whether than be racism; sexism; antisemitism; ageism and all the others which attempt to isolate individuals or groups from being equal part of the human race - it’s down to common humanity and each of us can acknowledge and speak out about it whenever we come across it. Yes, there have been, and still are numerous instances of inhumane treatment everywhere and every day, but we can all take a part, however small, in addressing it by not remaining silent when we see it.

maddyone - yes you are right, I'm not Jewish. I was appalled that these comments were made by someone in my faith community. tickingbird said she thought it was because they were Catholic and I wanted to say that not all Catholics think like that. Maybe I didn't explain well.

The comments quoted were not only absurd but truly repugnant. I have never heard these types of hateful comments from people I consider to be friends, Catholic or otherwise.

NotSpaghetti, I hope it came over that I wasn’t criticising you, I just thought that those of us who are not Jewish wouldn’t in the normal run of things, experience those anti Semitic comments.
I’m sorry if I upset you.

So Britain did everything it could, did it, during WW2? Did it buggery! There were reports coming out from Auschwitz and those on the 'underground' begging the Allies to bomb it. I believe Churchill didn't think it was worth doing but I can't find the exact quote - I'm sure someone will supply it.

Then there were the refugees. Considering how many were desperate to escape Germany, it's pretty abysmal that more were not given asylum or assistance to escape. The Kindertransport wasn't started by the government either, though it was supported by it. Only 10,000 children escaped by this means; my father was one of the lucky ones.
His parents were desperate to escape but it was down to individual efforts in the end. My father's local synagogue in London tried to raise funds for them, but it was too late once war broke out. He never saw them again. They perished in Auschwitz.

A year ago last Autumn I visited Auschwitz for the first time. I didn't tell my father I was going - I knew he'd want nothing to do with it. Unfortunately we joined an excursion from our hotel where there were people going on a day out and saw it as just another day out. I was clutching photos of the grandparents I had never known. I cried the whole time. I was appalled at the huge car park, the shop, the school parties of laughing, joking children. I felt soiled.

The tour went too fast; I wanted to walk to where I worked out my grandparents met their end but I wasn't permitted. Instead I laid the photos on the German memorial, with one of my great-aunt who also perished there. I wanted to be private with my emotions and to express my grief for my lost family including the others whose fate we don't yet know.

On the coach back we were asked if we had 'enjoyed' the day.